Filled with Disgust (BSA Content)

GeneralElectric · #1 04-05-2010, 07:57 PM

I've been in Boy Scouts almost my entire life. I poured a lot of my adolesence into it. A lot of the awesome things I know I learned from Scouting. I've made life long friendships with people I hardly ever see from around the country. I meet random people on the street who I recognize, and who recognize me, from the days when I donned my tan shirt and green pants. My hands are worn and scarred from boy scouts. My hairline won't even be the same because of it. (I set myself on fire a few times) Putting Eagle Scout on a job application has gotten me work when I shouldn't have been able to. Suffice to say, I wouldn't be half the person I am today without it.

Unfortunately, I'm now currently filled with disgust at my local Boy Scouts. I am currently part of a small Troop in Staten Island as a leader when I have time. Today (Monday the 5th) was supposed to be a giant rally. This rally was held to prevent GNYC (Great New York Council, the people in charge of the Scouts, events, and camps in the Greater NYC area) from selling Pouch Camp; a Scout Camp here on Staten Island to developers.
Pouch camp isn't particularly large, but it is part of the Green Belt; a section of woodland in Staten Island and the closest you'll get to woods in the city. Its a beautiful place. If its sold, the only camp ground on Staten Island is completely gone, and so is the camp as a resource to young men and women in the New York area. It'd be a huge blow to every Scout Troop on Staten Island (in which there are several thousand scouters) and the Scouts in NJ and the inner city who come here.

This rally has been planned for about two weeks now, that I know of. Dozens of troops were supposed to turn out in support of it. Apparently, within the past two days the GNYC office has been calling Troops and unit leaders to tell them that the rally has been cancelled! Obviously it was not. The turn out was awful with only about 100 people attending. This is really demoralizing to me as an organization founded on ideals of integrity and honesty have stooped this low. I haven't been this upset in awhile (and I'm sure the gin and tonics have contributed to it) and I'm not exactly eloquent right now.

Urging whoever has had their life affected for the good due to scouting give their national number a call.

http://sne.tripod.com/bsa-info.htm

username n/a · #2 04-05-2010, 08:05 PM

They won't allow gays, atheists, or agnostics, and this is the thing that fills you with disgust?

FL Knifemaker · #3 04-05-2010, 08:08 PM

And I thought you might have been having carbeurateur problems........Or however the Brits say it

McHaven · #4 04-05-2010, 08:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FL Knifemaker

And I thought you might have been having carbeurateur problems........Or however the Brits say it

yeah, I thought this was going to be about British motorcycles.

**Howlin' Hanson** · #5 04-05-2010, 08:14 PM

I am Boy Scout volunteer and an employee. Your council did not act according to the principles of the Scout Oath and Law. Shame on them.

standupright · #6 04-05-2010, 08:15 PM

i got kicked out of the scouts for eating a brownie

GeneralElectric · #7 04-05-2010, 08:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by username n/a

They won't allow gays, atheists, or agnostics, and this is the thing that fills you with disgust?

I'm an atheist and I've never had a problem in Scouting. Many of my leaders were agnostic or atheist. One of my pack leaders was a flaming homosexual who went on to become a troop leader. My boy scout troop has 3 kids in it who are gay.

While their official policy might not be to allow it, its actually really wide spread if you've been in Scouting.

I understand why the BSA is hesitant to change its policies (they're scared of losing funding from relgious groups and most Troops are based out of Churchs and schools etc) for monetary reasons. They're also terrified of lawsuits if someone says the someone says that a gay leader molested them. Meanwhile they neglect to realize that gay men are interested in other adult gay men, and aren't pedophiles interested in children.

standupright · #8 04-05-2010, 08:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by username n/a

They won't allow gays, atheists, or agnostics, and this is the thing that fills you with disgust?

aaaaaaaaaaannnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnd?

Relic · #9 04-05-2010, 08:23 PM

The Scouts are not what they used to be. At least not around here...
My oldest son joined our local scouts a couple of years ago and ended up staying on for about 6 months before quitting. His troop was pretty much a joke. Uniforms were optional, discipline was apparently optional, you could not get information on anything, it was just a huge mess. I actually thought about joining to see what I could do to help, but it's beyond that.
Back when I was a scout there was a lot more to it. It was like being part of something, now it's just an activity to do when you feel like it and not much more than that.

I had driven into my work office the other morning. We're located right across a big highway from a Scout headquarters and supply store.. what was once a nice building is now overgrown and neglected. The Boy Scouts are not what they used to be....it's sad.

Of course, this may not be the case everywhere, honestly I don't how it is elsewhere but I can tell you right now from my perspective, the Scouts are dying if not basically dead already.

GeneralElectric · #10 04-05-2010, 08:30 PM

Hey Relic, I know what you mean. Troop memberships have been down across the board.

That small troop I'm part of in SI? It went from 14 kids 2 years ago to over 40 kids. They used to be really disshelved. They didn't wanna do all the boring first aid drills and everything else. They didn't wanna wear uniforms. There was hazing. There was cliquish behavior. There wasn't much discipline whatsoever.

Scouting, how I was raised, was supposed to be ran by the kids. The adults only purpose was to make sure no one got killed. Now its doing what the kids want and they're eager to wear uniforms and learn, if only to show up neighboring troops at functions.

I'm really proud of our guys and everything, but I've seen a lot of troops exactly like how you're saying.

FWIW I'm only 20 but my viewpoint isn't any less valid.

Matt, how far is Ewing NJ from Staten Island?

bongomania · #11 04-05-2010, 08:45 PM

I was thrown out of the Boy Scouts for refusing to recite the "under God" part of the Pledge of Allegiance. I have read countless similar stories about kids being kicked out for failing to conform to the straight Christian tradition.

If there are openly gay or atheist people in the Scouts today, I guarantee you it is only very recently that they have been allowed to speak openly without being thrown out.

nic salsus · #12 04-05-2010, 08:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by McHaven

yeah, I thought this was going to be about British motorcycles.

Me too...disappointed.

**bassybill** · #13 04-05-2010, 09:10 PM

Speaking as one of TB's "most devout atheists" (

), I hate to hear of anybody being discriminated against for that reason. But that doesn't change the fact that a lot of good things come from the scouting movement and it really sucks to read GE's post about what's happening with the camp. I hope it all ends well for the youngsters who benefit from that facility now and in the future.

doctorjazz · #14 04-05-2010, 09:15 PM

That's pretty messed up, but there are plenty of things about Scouting I disagree with. I'm an Eagle Scout, and fortunately my troop didn't have any issues with discrimination, we had several gay and atheist Scouts and nobody hassled them. From what I hear, those types of things really only occur on a troop by troop basis, although unfortunately it is condoned officially.

SpamBot · #15 04-05-2010, 10:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Relic

Well this one was also run predominantly by the kids, but honestly they were not doing too good of a job. It was just a bad experience all around. I'm not really sure that they're to blame or the adults in the troop for not mentoring and guiding, but something's missing.
OK, I'm going to sound old for a minute....
But back when I was in, you took pride in your uniform and what it symbolized, you learned to respect others and really incorporated the belief that you were part of something important. Now? pffff.. if you don't have an attitude and are not talking back, acting "cool" and challenging authority every chance you get, you just aren't respected by your peers.
This Summer my middle and oldest son want to join the Civil Air Patrol to maybe see if that's a better fit. We'll see..

Ewing is about maybe an hour and a half/ two hour drive from SI. Depends on traffic and whatnot.

Also, I really laugh at the Scout haters. It's apparently in fashion now to bash the Scouts.
When I was in, we had a couple Jewish kids and even a Muslim kid in our troop even though our meetings were in a catholic church auditorium. Never had a single problem. We would even talk about how we all believed in the same God and how cool that was. Now THAT is what scouts are about IMHO.

Clearly, judging from the first half of your post.

bongomania · #16 04-05-2010, 10:06 PM

Show me one "Scout hater" in this thread. Who exactly are you laughing at?

GeneralElectric · #17 04-05-2010, 10:08 PM

This thread kinda took a turn for the worse right after the first post...

EBodious · #18 04-05-2010, 10:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bongomania

I was thrown out of the Boy Scouts for refusing to recite the "under God" part of the Pledge of Allegiance. I have read countless similar stories about kids being kicked out for failing to conform to the straight Christian tradition.

If there are openly gay or atheist people in the Scouts today, I guarantee you it is only very recently that they have been allowed to speak openly without being thrown out.

i am no authority, but i think it really varies. i am not surprised that in a large metro area you find a lot more openness and diversity. my son tried it a little when we lived in northern cali in a university town and it was mellow and liberal. here in iowa, i am under the impression that the christian nature of it is a stronger influence. but that is true in general here as well.

bongomania · #19 04-05-2010, 10:13 PM

Stands to reason--it was in North Carolina that they booted me.

mike_v_s · #20 04-05-2010, 10:16 PM

Former employee here. I could add quite a bit, but I'll just stick to the topic at hand.

GeneralElectric: that **** sucks. As an adult volunteer not so removed from the actual program (you could still be in Venturers, you know), watching this unravel must feel pretty dirty. Every Council is different, but the one I worked for was very revenue driven and a lot of punches were pulled to that end. The bottom line is always the bottom line. If you hang around on the Council level long enough, you'll probably see a lot of the same attitude in other areas.

Do you know your District Executive?

PM me for a more frank discussion.

Mike