Honda accord transmission blues...

[Stilettoprefer]

So I got a used '97honda accord a couple months ago for $2200. It was in really good shape and drove great up until a few days ago.

The check engine light came on and autozone determined that the code was for the speed sensor. If the speed sensor isn't working properly then the transmission will supposedly shift funny. Well I took it to a shop and they said that the transmission was slipping going from 2nd to 3rd gear on their test drive. I came and got the car because they wanted to do a tranny swap for $2800. I know that price is ridiculous so I drove it home and found a place that'll do a rebuild for about $1800 (aamco). But on the drive home it had no slipping problems, just shifted a little hard into 3rd and I've never had it slip on me.

I have an appointment setup for Monday morning to have Aamco look at it (free diagnostic). On the call we were talking and they said that if the speed sensor is going bad that it'll usually start shifting into 3rd harder then eventually just quit shifting.

Hoping that its just the sensor! This car has been great for the time that I've had it and the engine is fantastic. I hear that these v-tech engines usually last about 300k miles if they're taken care of (my car is at 150k and the previous owner kept records of everything and was very good about maintenance).

If I do need to get the tranny rebuilt, is it worth the money?

I'd end up having to spend at least that much on a different car anyways, and the next one may end up with similar issues. And this car wouldn't be worth anything on the used market with a bad tranny.

[carlos840]

I know it is a completely different era, but my 76 corvette stingray was shifting funny when i first got it.
I changed the trans fluid and it shifted great, has been shifting great since without a single problem.
The fluid in the car was black and burnt and could have been years old. Do you know when yours was last changed?

Might be worth changing the fluid! If it's only that it's a cheap fix.
If not, I would personally not spend more money than the car was worth in the first place on a new trans.

[T-Bird]

Hi.

If You don't mind me asking, where on earth do You live???

$2200 for a -97 Accord is about twice as much as they go for here, and we tend to have the most expensive cars ANYWHERE. At least when new .

Used cars are a whole 'nother ballgame.
Sub 500€ (~$670) daily drivers are everywhere, and that's with a year to go before the next yearly inspection and approval.

A used replacement transmission should set You back a couple of hundred, and replacing it by yourself isn't very difficult either. If You for some reason can't do that, it's about 4-5 hour job, so a few hundred more.

Pop the pan off and replace the filter before making the final desicion about the swap/repair though, just changing the oil won't do You any good.

Regards
Sam

[OldDog52]

Originally Posted by T-Bird

$2200 for a -97 Accord is about twice as much as they go for here, and we tend to have the most expensive cars ANYWHERE. At least when new .

A couple years ago I sold a 1993 Honda Accord for $3700. It was exceptionally clean, 89K miles on it. Advertised it on craigslist for $3900, had many responses. First person who responded bought it. Clean Accords of that era can fetch decent money because of their reputation as a very reliable daily driver.

[johnson79]

I have 95 accord that I bought with 80k miles on it a fee years ago. The hard shift is a common problem.

Mine was actually leaking fluid after I had a CV replaced, so luckily it was an easy fix of re-seating the axle.

[Stilettoprefer]

Originally Posted by T-Bird

Hi.

If You don't mind me asking, where on earth do You live???

$2200 for a -97 Accord is about twice as much as they go for here, and we tend to have the most expensive cars ANYWHERE. At least when new .

Used cars are a whole 'nother ballgame.
Sub 500€ (~$670) daily drivers are everywhere, and that's with a year to go before the next yearly inspection and approval.

A used replacement transmission should set You back a couple of hundred, and replacing it by yourself isn't very difficult either. If You for some reason can't do that, it's about 4-5 hour job, so a few hundred more.

Pop the pan off and replace the filter before making the final desicion about the swap/repair though, just changing the oil won't do You any good.

Regards
Sam

The blue book is $2300 for a 97 accord LX with a sunroof and in very good condition (which this was). If it needs a tranny, then it's worth basically nothing to the average person.

And I live in Portland. (edit: Oregon)

[Mike N]

Originally Posted by T-Bird

Hi.

If You don't mind me asking, where on earth do You live???

$2200 for a -97 Accord is about twice as much as they go for here, and we tend to have the most expensive cars ANYWHERE. At least when new .

Used cars are a whole 'nother ballgame.
Sub 500€ (~$670) daily drivers are everywhere, and that's with a year to go before the next yearly inspection and approval.

A used replacement transmission should set You back a couple of hundred, and replacing it by yourself isn't very difficult either. If You for some reason can't do that, it's about 4-5 hour job, so a few hundred more.

Pop the pan off and replace the filter before making the final desicion about the swap/repair though, just changing the oil won't do You any good.

Regards
Sam

Honda's hold their value here. I personally would never have paid that much for a 16 year old car, but that's what they go for here.

In any event a trans swap isn't all that easy on an Accord, and there is no pan to pull off on a Honda trans. The trans is a clamshell design and disassembly is required to access the filter.

[Mike N]

OP- any chance you know what the code was that AZ pulled, like the code number? I'd be curious as to what it is.

[Stilettoprefer]

Originally Posted by Mike N

OP- any chance you know what the code was that AZ pulled, like the code number? I'd be curious as to what it is.

I have no clue. The receipt I got from autozone disappeared somewhere down the line. I'll see if it's on the report that I got from that first shop I took it to, when I get home tonight.

And I have no way to change the tranny out myself. We don't have a shop and we don't have a way to get the car lifted up high enough to work on. Unfortunately the car is so low that I can't even get under it to change the fluid. I'll see what the free diagnosis says and if it's just changing the sensor and filter, I have a buddy in school to be a mechanic that'll do it for real cheap.

[xaxxat]

Originally Posted by T-Bird

Hi.

If You don't mind me asking, where on earth do You live???

$2200 for a -97 Accord is about twice as much as they go for here, and we tend to have the most expensive cars ANYWHERE. At least when new .

I've got a 91 Accord that I've been offered $6,000 for.

It does have 61,000 original miles on it.

Japanese cars hold their value over here. I've seen rusted out Toyota pickups with 300,000 on them miles go for unreal sums.

[Dave the Bass]

I used to work for a used car dealer and saw an '84 Accord with 450,000 miles go through an auto auction for $1600......and it was still purring like a kitten.

[68Goldfish]

I would think that if you've never felt it slip previously and it didn't slip when you drove it back home then more than likely it's just a problem with the sensor itself or the circuit between the sensor and whatever controller controlls it. Granted, I come from a Chrysler/jeep/dodge background but internal trans problems usualy just don't come and go. And when a trans has an issue there's usualy a lot more codes like gear ratio error and shift faults. Again, I'm a jeep tech. CJD trannys and most electronic tranny's have a failsafe or limp in mode of such that when the controller doesn't recognize a gear ratio (slip) or there's an electrical problem (solenoid, switch or sensor) all power is cut to the trans and it will only have one forward and reverse gear. Auto transmissions and driveability diagnostics is serious bussiness. Don't be afraid to pay a real mechanic for a real diagnosis. You get what you pay for.

[Stilettoprefer]

Originally Posted by 68Goldfish

I would think that if you've never felt it slip previously and it didn't slip when you drove it back home then more than likely it's just a problem with the sensor itself or the circuit between the sensor and whatever controller controlls it. Granted, I come from a Chrysler/jeep/dodge background but internal trans problems usualy just don't come and go. And when a trans has an issue there's usualy a lot more codes like gear ratio error and shift faults. Again, I'm a jeep tech. CJD trannys and most electronic tranny's have a failsafe or limp in mode of such that when the controller doesn't recognize a gear ratio (slip) or there's an electrical problem (solenoid, switch or sensor) all power is cut to the trans and it will only have one forward and reverse gear. Auto transmissions and driveability diagnostics is serious bussiness. Don't be afraid to pay a real mechanic for a real diagnosis. You get what you pay for.

I payed for the first one where they determined that my tranny was "shot". I'll give this other place a go. I have a feeling that its just the sensor causing the drive-ability issue.

BTW, the error code is: po715

Google comes up with input/ turbine speed sensor.

[T-Bird]

Hi.

Originally Posted by Stilettoprefer

I live in Portland. (edit: Oregon)

~46°N sure makes it a bit easier on the body than it does over here at ~61°N, so I'd suspect that a good portion of the cars over there are in a pretty good shape.
Or at least can be cleaned in a couple of hours .
Our winter OTOH has probably a lot to do with our cheaper prices. NOT so gentle for the body.

Originally Posted by OldDog52

A couple years ago I sold a 1993 Honda Accord for $3700. It was exceptionally clean, 89K miles on it. Advertised it on craigslist for $3900, had many responses.

Originally Posted by Stilettoprefer

The blue book is $2300 for a 97 accord LX with a sunroof and in very good condition (which this was).

Originally Posted by Mike N

Honda's hold their value here. I personally would never have paid that much for a 16 year old car, but that's what they go for here.

Originally Posted by Dave the Bass

I used to work for a used car dealer and saw an '84 Accord with 450,000 miles go through an auto auction for $1600......and it was still purring like a kitten.

Originally Posted by xaxxat

I've got a 91 Accord that I've been offered $6,000 for.

Originally Posted by xaxxat

Japanese cars hold their value over here. I've seen rusted out Toyota pickups with 300,000 on them miles go for unreal sums.

So it seems.

Thank You all for the eye-opener.

Unbelievable if You ask me though.
Not to mention a polar opposite for what I have thought up to this point.
Well, as they say: You learn something new every day .

Originally Posted by Mike N

In any event a trans swap isn't all that easy on an Accord, and there is no pan to pull off on a Honda trans. The trans is a clamshell design and disassembly is required to access the filter.

Thank You for getting the facts straight Mike.

I had a bit older Accord once in my car-swapping days in my 20's, and I think I did replace the filter and oil to improve the driveability. Then again that was a sweet while ago, it could've been some other Jap. Not too many automatics here though, we tend to drive stick over here.

IRRC we did do a trans swap on a Accord of a frriend of mine about the same era as mine, and that was just the same as replacing a stick trans = very easy for us.
Granted, not as "easy" as swapping a TH350, but relatively easy.

Perhaps the newer design is different, I'm into older cars .

Regards
Sam

[OldDog52]

Video of that 1993 $3700 Accord: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=leC6wqRf4pw

I had the car completely detailed, did a few other minor cosmetic things, had the engine valves adjusted.

[pat5150]

Originally Posted by Stilettoprefer

I payed for the first one where they determined that my tranny was "shot". I'll give this other place a go. I have a feeling that its just the sensor causing the drive-ability issue.

BTW, the error code is: po715

Google comes up with input/ turbine speed sensor.

You absolutely need to have that code diagnosed and repaired before considering any kind of other repair. Maybe look for an independent import shop, some place familiar with Hondas.

[yodedude2]

http://honda-tech.com/showthread.php?t=953661

[Pilgrim]

Originally Posted by pat5150

You absolutely need to have that code diagnosed and repaired before considering any kind of other repair. Maybe look for an independent import shop, some place familiar with Hondas.

Absolutely. A second opinion on that code might save you a ton of money.

[68Goldfish]

How about the Honda dealer. There's usually more than one qualified honda tech running around those places.

[Stilettoprefer]

Whelp, it slipped on me going into 3rd on the way to the shop this morning. They quoted me $1500-1800 for a rebuild on that tranny and I get a 10% discount on labor since I'm a AAA member.

Still cheaper than selling this one for what it's currently worth (very very little) and buying a different car. At least the engine is strong and the body is straight and clean.

The change should give me at least another 150,000 miles, though. And won't bankrupt me since my entire tuition at school just got waived.

Thanks for the words of wisdom guys! It was much appreciated.