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09-18-2011, 12:33 AM
| | Registered User | | Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Colo Spgs, CO-I hate it here!! | | | If a product is out of print and you can't find it anywhere....
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I don't like the idea of downloading music for free. However, what if a product is out of print and you can't find it anywhere what would you do?
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09-18-2011, 12:39 AM
| | Registered User | | Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Los Angeles | | | What are you looking for? |
09-18-2011, 12:58 AM
|  | Registered User | | Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Albuquerque, NM | | | I think one a music or movie product has quit paying royalties to all involved it is perfectly o.k. to download/trade/share/pirate said material. For example, Robert Johnson material should be shared by all who desire it. If someone owns the rights to Robert Johnson material today, then it is morally o.k. to me not care about their desire for me not to trade it. They own something that IMO they should not be entitled to legally or spiritually own.
That being said, I am unaware who if anyone owns the right to his material. Were it to be his family or the engineers family etc, I may change my moral position.
If a product is no longer being produced and is otherwise unavailable then by all means download it. Once however it is is available and is not a situation like I outlined above, then one should be obligated to purchase the product if they desire its entertainment value.
Last edited by acubass : 09-18-2011 at 01:03 AM.
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09-18-2011, 02:15 AM
| | Registered User | | Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Columbus, OH | | | Try amazon or ebay, both can sometimes have out of print materials. Ebay is more likely, but amazon independent sellers will sometimes post things up. You can also try places like half-price books, they tend to carry a lot of out of print items (they also carry music, games, etc...).
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09-18-2011, 02:29 AM
|  | so then I sez to Mabel, I sez... | | Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: Texas | | | alibris.com is a good source.
These may help as well: addall.com , addany.com |
09-18-2011, 04:19 AM
| | | | I understand downloading music that is hard to get or out of print however, that only lowers that resale value of the physical item (movie, cd, book, etc.).
In other words: "Why should I pay someone on ebay $50 for a music cd when I can download it for free since I only want the music from it?" |
09-18-2011, 04:33 AM
| | Registered User | | Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Melbourne, Australia | | | If you can't buy it (it's out of print) download it.
I see no ethical or moral reason to prop up collectors and inflated prices.
If I can't buy it, it isn't stealing.
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09-18-2011, 07:15 AM
| | | Quote:
Originally Posted by theNoseBleedKid  If you can't buy it (it's out of print) download it.
I see no ethical or moral reason to prop up collectors and inflated prices.
If I can't buy it, it isn't stealing. | Since you cannot buy the Mona Lisa (there is only one so in reality it is out of print), does that make it right to steal it?
Who says that the prices are inflated? Supply and demand falls into play here.
If you walk into a car lot and drive off with one without paying for it, isn't that considered stealing? |
09-18-2011, 07:59 AM
| | Registered User | | Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: Richmond, VA, USA | | Quote: |
Originally Posted by Longhair
Since you cannot buy the Mona Lisa (there is only one so in reality it is out of print), does that make it right to steal it?
Who says that the prices are inflated? Supply and demand falls into play here.
If you walk into a car lot and drive off with one without paying for it, isn't that considered stealing?
| Yea, but if pirating was even close to applicable to that scenario, you would take a car, and the car would also still be there when you left. |
09-18-2011, 10:06 AM
|  | No need to ask, he's a smooth... Moderator | | Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: West Midlands UK | | How about if you just drive the car around for a while and then put it back before the owner returns? 
The argument about music still "being there" after downloading so that somehow makes it okay doesn't really hold much water. If it did, your local CD store would have no problem with you walking in with a laptop, burning a few albums onto your hard drive for free and then putting the CDs back on the shelf before walking out.
That said, if I was after something available in a downloadable form that was just impossible to buy, I'd probably download it. And I've often bought whole albums after discovering them by downloading individual tracks that someone has shared. So, I'm not perfect in the regard by any means, but I do try to do the right thing when I can.
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Originally Posted by SBassman |
Last edited by bassybill : 09-18-2011 at 10:13 AM.
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09-18-2011, 10:29 AM
| | Registered User | | Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: (M)a$$hole. | | | Sometimes just because it's available to dl vs. acquiring physically, doesn't mean it's a free for all. Sometimes you're just not meant to have something.
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09-18-2011, 10:31 AM
| | | Quote:
Originally Posted by NateS Yea, but if pirating was even close to applicable to that scenario, you would take a car, and the car would also still be there when you left. | Say that you are selling some original music that you wrote. Someone want to give you $1.00 per song and you are about to sell them 100 songs. Right before the guy hands you his money, I come along and say, "save your money because I will give you the songs for free."
The music is still there after I gave it away so by your logic it makes it 100% acceptable. |
09-18-2011, 12:14 PM
| | Registered User | | Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: Richmond, VA, USA | | Quote: |
Originally Posted by Longhair
Say that you are selling some original music that you wrote. Someone want to give you $1.00 per song and you are about to sell them 100 songs. Right before the guy hands you his money, I come along and say, "save your money because I will give you the songs for free."
The music is still there after I gave it away so by your logic it makes it 100% acceptable.
| Yea, and id still have the 100 songs to sell. I didn't lose anything. That means I need to work harder, to make him want to buy it. |
09-18-2011, 12:21 PM
| | | Quote:
Originally Posted by NateS Yea, and id still have the 100 songs to sell. I didn't lose anything. That means I need to work harder, to make him want to buy it. | Why would anybody want to pay money for your songs since they could get them for free? |
09-18-2011, 12:35 PM
| | Registered User | | Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: (M)a$$hole. | | Quote:
Originally Posted by Longhair Why would anybody want to pay money for your songs since they could get them for free? | If you place any value at all in music being an actual art form and not a free for all, you would.
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Don't tell me the sky is the limit, when there are footprints on the Moon.
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09-18-2011, 12:51 PM
|  | Registered User | | Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Dallas | | Quote:
Originally Posted by hover If you place any value at all in music being an actual art form and not a free for all, you would. | agreed...and even if it isn't art, it's intellectual property
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09-18-2011, 01:38 PM
|  | Total Hyper-Elite Member | | Join Date: May 2000 Location: Groom Lake, NV | | So it's OK to steal the Beatles' music because the Beatles no longer own the rights, even though someone spent hundreds of millions of dollars to buy the rights? As far as I'm concerned, the owners have the legal and "spiritual" (whatever that means) right to control the catalog's distribution. Quote:
Originally Posted by acubass I think one a music or movie product has quit paying royalties to all involved it is perfectly o.k. to download/trade/share/pirate said material. For example, Robert Johnson material should be shared by all who desire it. If someone owns the rights to Robert Johnson material today, then it is morally o.k. to me not care about their desire for me not to trade it. They own something that IMO they should not be entitled to legally or spiritually own.
That being said, I am unaware who if anyone owns the right to his material. Were it to be his family or the engineers family etc, I may change my moral position.
If a product is no longer being produced and is otherwise unavailable then by all means download it. Once however it is is available and is not a situation like I outlined above, then one should be obligated to purchase the product if they desire its entertainment value. |
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What is this thing called butthurt? |
09-18-2011, 02:46 PM
| | Registered User | | Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: Richmond, VA, USA | | Quote: |
Originally Posted by Longhair
Why would anybody want to pay money for your songs since they could get them for free?
| And music should be free. Sell art. Not just sound that I can stream all I want anywhere any way, even if I couldn't download it. Make the package, the album be worth my time. One or two songs, or even 10 or 11 songs, can all be streamed on YouTube, grooveshark, itunes, MySpace, Facebook, soundcloud, and a million other sites. |
09-18-2011, 02:55 PM
| | | Quote:
Originally Posted by NateS And music should be free. Sell art. Not just sound that I can stream all I want anywhere any way, even if I couldn't download it. Make the package, the album be worth my time. One or two songs, or even 10 or 11 songs, can all be streamed on YouTube, grooveshark, itunes, MySpace, Facebook, soundcloud, and a million other sites. | Give away your bass gear for free since it makes music. Why limit yourself to just music? - Give away all your money since you do not require it to buy things.
- Let people use your electricity so they may download music for free.
- Let people use your home so they may have a place to download music for free.
- Let people use your computer so they may download music for free.
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09-18-2011, 04:08 PM
| | Registered User | | Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Colo Spgs, CO-I hate it here!! | | This is what prompted my original question.
I want Greg Howe-Howe II High Gear CD...it's out of print and not available on his own website, heck, he doesn't even list it in his discography.
Amazon you can buy it used for around $50 and up to $107 Amazon.com: Used and New: Howe 2: High Gear
Found on ebay for $25
give money to a dealer or download from torrent site? 
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