internet rip off

[BawanaRik]

I am seriously thinking about relocating for many reasons.

This isn't one of them. My cable cost nothing because I don't have any

Originally Posted by Pilgrim

Not really, it's because the bandwidth allocations are broader for cell phone service in other countries, so their service is better. Competition is not the primary factor.



These are all very interesting points. I have a question about them, and it's one I don't know the answer to. That question is: how much of the difference you cite is supported by taxes that we don't pay in the US? France has a MUCH higher personal tax rate, and many of the taxes they pay go to support things which are not tax-supported in the US.

SOMEONE is paying to reduce those rates you cite. If it's not the individual paying directly out of pocket, I suspect that in some cases it's tax-funded so citizens are paying indirectly. If anyone happens to know the answer, it would be interesting to hear it.

As noted above, I can tell you that one reason the US is slower in wireless speed is different bandwidth than is available in other countries. If you have a problem with that, you should correspond with your elected representative and urge the FCC to take action.

[Jazz Ad]

Originally Posted by Pilgrim

how much of the difference you cite is supported by taxes that we don't pay in the US? France has a MUCH higher personal tax rate, and many of the taxes they pay go to support things which are not tax-supported in the US.

I'm afraid your question doesn't make much sense.
Phone and internet access in France are provided by private companies.
We pay more taxes than people in USA indeed. They come as an addition to the price, not as a deduction. They make roughly 20% of the price. I don't see how they could help us save money in a way or another.

To give you an example, I have a quadruple play formula that gives access to roughly 200 channels (I don't use it though, I have no tv), a kickass dsl modem/bridge/router, connection is about 13 mbits, unlimited fix phone calls worldwide and cellphone calls in Europe, a cellphone with 4 hours of calls and unlimited SMS. We pay 56 € a month for the whole packs, roughly us$ 75.

There are cheaper services than the one I use but it is still way cheaper than what you guys pay.
What's been proven around here is that there aren't enough phone companies to ensure competition. Phone companies made arrangements to maintain high prices.
There is a strict regulation around here and phone providers have been condemned more than once for illegal price behaviors.

It is a good balance for this kind or service I think.
Without regulation providers stick together to high prices and when you take the opposite case, ie the single national phone company that we still had 15 years ago, price remain insanely high too.

[Jazz Ad]

The first time I went to USA, during the mid 90s, I was struck with the poor state of energy and communication networks.
I figured USA was a country of high technology, with shiny equipments everywhere. I discovered phone services that didn't interact well with each other, complicated offers from providers that the average human can't comprehend, high prices and poorly maintained infrastructures.

Once after a storm an electric pylon in front of my host fell on the floor. Guys from the electric company came to fix it. They used a cable to keep it up, put back the lines together and left it at that.
In France the pylon and lines would have been completely replaced with new ones back then, especially with the national company taking care of it all.

It is strange because in USA manufactured products tend to be easily available, with a lot of competition that drives prices down and what may be the best customer services in the world. It isn't the case for energy and communication networks.

[i_got_a_mohawk]

Originally Posted by BawanaRik

I was in Britain in the 80s. Trust me we had much better land line service than they did.

We used to have a shared line. Independent number but fairly limited bandwidth, not a problem for phone calls but the limitations were obvious with dialup internet.

The telecoms infrastructure was overhauled during the late 90s and early 00s. Over the past 5 years or so they've started upgrading optical fibers which will bring the UK in line with some of the faster EU countries.

[kanonfodr]

It all comes down to competition, or really lack thereof. Anyone in the USA know of a town that has more than one cable tv provider??

To everyone claiming infrastructure costs: Every backbone line is fiber optic, and it's slowly branching out further. There is not really a theoretical limit to bandwidth across fiber, we have a realistic limit due to switching/routing hardware but the medium itself is limitless. These lines have been in place for twenty years, the major hardware has been in place for twenty years but what still comes to everyone's house?? Copper. If you're a Telecom tech, and electrical engineer, or just some guy like I am who can run, terminate, and then test fiber optics you will see where the problem lies.

Peace,
Greg

[Jazz Ad]

Originally Posted by kanonfodr

It all comes down to competition, or really lack thereof. Anyone in the USA know of a town that has more than one cable tv provider??

Yes that's another factor.
In Europe, cable TV is scarce out of big cities. Most of internet access is provided through DSL phone lines so there is a choice amongst providers.

[lunarpollen]

When powerful companies control the market for a service and product whose supply is, for all intents and purposes, close to infinite (i.e., packets of electrons), they will pretend that it isn't, and set up pricing schemes accordingly. They will mark up the price of the product astronomically, and make astronomical profits, unimaginably far beyond what any sane person would think is a great return for providing service to customers, operating costs, rank-and-file payroll, etc.

[uOpt]

Originally Posted by BawanaRik

I was in Britain in the 80s. Trust me we had much better land line service than they did.

We are talking neither GB, which has it's own problems with consumer ripoff (usually government enabled ripoff in that case), nor the 1980ties.

We are talking about how high speed Internet made it into households in some countries, specifically those countries that have faster speeds for lower prices than the US. Germany certainly does. And they do not support it with taxes. And their cities are centuries older than US cities and harder to dig through.

Even if you can find some country or other in Europe that does worse that doesn't invalidate the point.

[scorpionldr]

Originally Posted by duff beer

North America lags FAR behind most other countries when it comes to internet service. I always knew we were getting ripped off, but I didn't know how bad it was:

http://finance.yahoo.com/blogs/daily...130914030.html

well so much for the guy saying everyone's getting boned and they don't even know it being crazy....