NFL Lockout

[tastybasslines]

There are arguments for both sides, and I am a football fan, but the owners are absolutely right to lock out the players.

In what business enterprise, do the employees expect to make 60% of the revenue? If the players think they are equal to the owners, then let them take on half the risk of running a business and take on losses also. Let them find a way to make 500MILL to buy a franchise. They don't get to act like owners, they are not. I hope the lockout continues, and the already overpaid players quit whining and get to work.

Big stars sit out? Who cares, new opportunity comes for players who would not have gotten it otherwise and the league will go on. It's not like the players, who are EMPLOYEES, aren't making enough, in an uncapped free market.

Can you imagine if you could mount a legal defense like this to your 9-5 employer? And try to force them to pay you 50-60% of your revenue?

[Jay Ralston]

I'm all for the owners as well. I work corrections for a living and could only imagine how much more the State I live in would be screwed up even more if when I started, they offered me the same salary as my Warden even though I may or may not have made a good officer.

The rookies need a salary cap or a system that pays them off of performance not potential. Also, the players and union have become way too greedy. As a result, I have not really watched any football in about 2 or 3 years. I catch the highlights but I have lost total interest due to the players and union greed.

[tastybasslines]

Originally Posted by Jay Ralston

I'm all for the owners as well. I work corrections for a living and could only imagine how much more the State I live in would be screwed up even more if when I started, they offered me the same salary as my Warden even though I may or may not have made a good officer.

The rookies need a salary cap or a system that pays them off of performance not potential. Also, the players and union have become way too greedy. As a result, I have not really watched any football in about 2 or 3 years. I catch the highlights but I have lost total interest due to the players and union greed.

The rookie pay is insane. It really sucks for a 5 time pro bowler or so who signed a contract only to see someone who never played a down, and doubling their salary. Unions are a racket.

BTW, in all interviews, you will see the players keep saying things like, "I feel sorry for the fans", which they are probably coached to do.

[jp58]

Both sides want the rookie pay scale. Not just the players or owners.

[dangnewt]

There is plenty of money made in the game - that is why players are paid well and franchises are worth 100's of millions of dollars. They are dividing a large pie and the owners want a bigger piece than they had under the old agreement. I have no problem with the owners wanting to improve their economic situation, that is their right. However, the owners are taking a risk that they will end up hurting themselves.

Both sides have much to gain from coming to an agreement and much to lose if they don't. But I try to root for the underdog as much as possible, so I am hopeful that the players will come out OK in this.

What would stop a group of wealthy folks who do not currently own an NFL franchise from organizing themselves into a new league and offering a better deal to the players? Initially, the player salaries would likely be less, but they could come up with an agreement that provided the players with a bigger share that would pay off if the league became more successful.

[SoonerMatt]

I'm all for the NFL being dissolved and rugby union landing in the States

[MJ5150]

I support more money going to the players.

Like most of you, I'll retire from my job in my 60's and begin a new life. Most NFL players are forced out of the game before they are 30, then are stuck with debilitating physical and mental injuries. Not all of these guys pick up cushy studio analysis or commentating gigs then travel around the country playing golf.

-Mike

[jp58]

Originally Posted by MJ5150

I support more money going to the players.

Like most of you, I'll retire from my job in my 60's and begin a new life. Most NFL players are forced out of the game before they are 30, then are stuck with debilitating physical and mental injuries. Not all of these guys pick up cushy studio analysis or commentating gigs then travel around the country playing golf.

-Mike

+1.

The owners only make money because the players are there. The "owners" are not like a traditional boss in that the people that work with them, not for them, are specialists.

The reason players make what they do (and I highly doubt it borders 60%, as wealthy as most NFL owners are) is because they are elite athletes. That's why the NFL holds a monopoly on pro football. They have the best of the best playing every week.

Owners don't want the players to walk because no one is going to pay money to see someone like Tee Martin when they could be paying the same amount of money to see Manning play. If anyone could take advantage of this, it would be the AFL and CFL. They are in the position with the most to gain.

A new league doesn't spawn now, even though a few are in the works, because of the legal issues. Stadium deals, trust laws, contract laws, finding an ownership group, tv deals, etc. It would take accountants, investors, lawyers, and league officials working around the clock for months to pull that off.

[Jawbone]

if it were to all end right now would any one really care. We ought to be able to find something more constructive to do with our time.

[tastybasslines]

Originally Posted by MJ5150

I support more money going to the players.

Like most of you, I'll retire from my job in my 60's and begin a new life. Most NFL players are forced out of the game before they are 30, then are stuck with debilitating physical and mental injuries. Not all of these guys pick up cushy studio analysis or commentating gigs then travel around the country playing golf.

-Mike

Even in a 4 year career, most average NFL players will earn way more than you or I will for our entire lives. And not all players have permanent disabilities as you seem to insinuate. They have a privileged life, and are unappreciative. They don't need a violin, they need humility. And I think you posted it Mike, less hitting is happening now because of rule changes. I'd like to actually see money go to an NFL players health fund for when they retire.

BTW for one of the other posters..they are looking for 58% of the revenue. And union officials are dead set on not giving up anything, because it will set precedent and they will take a step back in what they earn. They have said this. Bottom line, players will get hurt more by this, and I for one, am glad to see the owners taking initiative to not get pushed around anymore but the "victim" players and their uncompromising agents.

[jp58]

Edit:On second thought, I'll let this one go. You seem pretty set on your side.

[tastybasslines]

Originally Posted by jp58

Edit:On second thought, I'll let this one go. You seem pretty set on your side.

I wish you would have posted, but understand. I am passionate about this.....

[Hawaii Islander]

Owners don't have the risk life threatening or career ending injuries, players do. Owners can continue making money off of the game for as long as they are alive, while most players last 8-10 years, if that?

I would like to see better pay for the OLs and DLs and a fund to help former players who are dealing with injuries and illnesses incurred as a result of playing the game.

[Mike N]

Originally Posted by MJ5150

I support more money going to the players.

Like most of you, I'll retire from my job in my 60's and begin a new life. Most NFL players are forced out of the game before they are 30, then are stuck with debilitating physical and mental injuries. Not all of these guys pick up cushy studio analysis or commentating gigs then travel around the country playing golf.

-Mike

I don't. Most of there guys are overpaid to begin with. Plus, they know the risks of playing the game before they get hired.

[Pacman]

The average NFL career is 3 years. I don't think they're asking too much.

[Mike N]

Originally Posted by Pacman

The average NFL career is 3 years. I don't think they're asking too much.

I'll admit to not knowing all the details of what the players really want, because:

A) I have zero interest in organized sports, and don't follow them.

B) Overpaid athletes whining about money really pisses me off.
Maybe we should pay them with Monopoly money instead.


With that being said, as long what the players want doesn't come at the expense of the taxpayers, then whatever. It's bad enough we have to fund the stadiums, but we shouldn't have to fund health care for athletes as well. They know the risks of going up against 400 pound linemen, yet the choose to play anyway. Their choice, deal with it.

[MJ5150]

Originally Posted by tastybasslines

Even in a 4 year career, most average NFL players will earn way more than you or I will for our entire lives. And not all players have permanent disabilities as you seem to insinuate. They have a privileged life, and are unappreciative. They don't need a violin, they need humility.

You are right that NFL players are well paid, but trying to relate our income to theirs is never going to make sense. As jp58 pointed out, this is a unique situation. People do not pay $75 or more each to watch me work, and I am not one of 75 or 100 people in the world who do what I do.

As for the injuries, there is a dark side to the NFL that we are only starting to get a glimpse of in recent years related to concussions. I don't know how familiar you are with the inner workings of the NFL, but there is a big drop off on how players are treated once you get past your Troy Polamalu, Aaron Rodgers, Drew Brees, and Chris Johnson types. Your average guy comes in and signs for the league minimum, about $350,000, which is not guaranteed. He gets hurt in training camp or a game, and gets cut. Career over, no more money, and hopefully the injury was not severe enough to manifest itself in joint or muscle problems as he gets older. Or you have a guy who plays a few years in the league, maybe makes up near the million dollar a year salary. His career ends at age 30 or maybe even 32. By the time he hits 45, he can no longer bend over to pick up the newspaper or the headaches and neck pain is so intense, he is reduced to a life of pain meds and people helping care for him. Those latter two happen far more often than people realize or want to admit. It doesn't happen to everyone, I agree, but it is a reality of playing football.

All of us go to work to earn as much as we can and we look for chances to get a promotion, a raise, a bonus, what have you.

-Mike

[i_got_a_mohawk]

Originally Posted by SoonerMatt

I'm all for the NFL being dissolved and rugby union landing in the States

I like your thinking!




The players enter the NFL knowing it's a high risk high reward system. They may only be working in the NFL for a few years, but they earn horrendous amounts of money. A google search (so I don't know how true it is), gave a median salary of $770,000 in 2009.

Over 3 years, you'll be pushing $2.5 million. I'd say that's pretty close to what most of us would earn over 20-30 years of working!

And when they come out, do they have to stop? No, they could pick up 101 different jobs.

Regarding injuries, what about insurance? Pretty sure these guy's will have pretty hefty insurance policies!

I just think that huge amounts of money ruins sport, it certainly has with Association Football.

[aborgman]

Originally Posted by tastybasslines

BTW for one of the other posters..they are looking for 58% of the revenue.

Just for a note - this absolutely is not 58% of all the football revenue brought in by the team ownership.

In fact - the owners aren't even willing to open the books... so who KNOWS what their revenue is.

That 58% is 58% of a relatively specific set of revenue streams.

[mpdd]

they need to hand pick players with trust funds just like the music business and the fine art world, then there wouldn't be all of this controversy, because the people would all undercut each other to get exposure