Rape in Kenya..this article really got to me..

Relic · #1 05-12-2011, 08:10 AM

It's not just Kenya, but different shades of this happen all over the world.
Having traveled a good bit, I'm very open to other cultures and respectful of their beliefs, but sometimes wrong is just wrong. With a respect for differences being meaningless in such cases.
If there ever was a time, when one should impose at least a smidgen of their cultural beliefs on another (which I'm normally DEAD SET against) this would be one of them. What do you think? Is there ever a time when we should say "no" based on our own cultural standards?

As an aside - Josephine Kulea, is absolutely a gorgeous woman, wow!

Activist battles Kenyan tradition of rape 'beading' - CNN.com

Quote:

Isiolo, Kenya (CNN) -- "Josephine" is 12 years old and several months pregnant.

She's a member of the Samburu tribe, living in a small village in a remote part of Isiolo in Kenya's Eastern Province. The pre-teen, whose identity is being protected, claims she had sex with a relative -- a rape sanctioned by the Samburu, through a practice called "beading."

Intricate beaded necklaces are a symbol of the Kenyan nation. But to young Samburu girls, the necklaces are a symbol not of national pride, but something much darker, that can lead to rape, unwanted pregnancies -- and even the deaths of newborns, according to activist Josephine Kulea and the Samburu tribe itself.

In "beading," a close family relative will approach a girl's parents with red Samburu beads and place the necklace around the girl's neck.

"Effectively he has booked her," says Kulea, a member of the Samburu herself. "It is like a (temporary) engagement, and he can then have sex with her." Girls are also "beaded" as an early marriage promise by non-relatives.

Some girls who are "beaded" are no more than 6 years old. They are the focus of Kulea's rescue mission, a trip to Isiolo she's been planning for weeks.

Samburu culture dictates that girls be engaged to a relative, she says, and they are allowed to have sex with him. But "they are not allowed to get pregnant and there is no preventative measures," she says. "At the end of the day, most girls get pregnant ... and these (infants) end up dying or being killed or being given away."

When they reach adulthood, Samburu girls will marry outside of their village, but taboo dictates the girls will never be able to marry if they keep their babies resulting from beading.

Some girls, she says, undergo a crude abortion before their pregnancy advances. Others hide their condition until it is too late for that. "They let them give birth, but only to kill these babies," Kulea says.

If the girls are lucky, their babies are given away to strangers. "Most of these girls are traumatized," Kulea says, and some get infections from the crude abortions.

Philip Lemantile, the father of 14-year-old Nasuto, says beading is aimed at stopping promiscuity among young girls.

"This is our culture," he says. "It is part of us. And we have been practicing it, and we accept that these girls should be beaded, and sometimes the girls just get pregnant."

Kulea calls that a bad cultural practice.

"For any change that comes by, we have to have a start," she says. "And this is the start."

But the start is traumatic for the Samburu, as the girls are taken away from their families and put in a shelter. Their babies are placed in orphanages.

Still, Kulea says, it's better than staying.

"I just felt that it is wrong," she says. "Something wrong is going on in my community. And that is where my passion began. And so I decided to help out the girls."

ehque · #2 05-12-2011, 08:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Relic

If there ever was a time, when one should impose at least a smidgen of their cultural beliefs on another (which I'm normally DEAD SET against) this would be one of them. What do you think? Is there ever a time when we should say "no" based on our own cultural standards?

I get where you're coming from, but as you're a cultural relativist I don't see a basis for you to pick and choose issues that where suddenly "universal" norms should be applied to other cultures.

Relic · #3 05-12-2011, 08:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ehque

I get where you're coming from, but as you're a cultural relativist I don't see a basis for you to pick and choose issues that where suddenly "universal" norms should be applied to other cultures.

I know, it's a tough thing, it really is.
In this case, this local activist is trying to take care of it so that's as close to a perfect solution as one's going to get IMO, but what if she wasn't? Would it ever be "right" for an outsider to do something about this?

MakiSupaStar · #4 05-12-2011, 09:01 AM

Meh. I'm with you Relic. This is wrong. Just like most of the civilized world has spoken out against extreme Muslim's treatment of women, I have no problem taking a stance against this cultural practice.

Smokin' Toaster · #5 05-12-2011, 09:03 AM

They do have some strange "cultural practices" in Africa. Here's another one that defies basic human dignity:

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/05/12/op...stof.html?_r=1

Interesting how most of these horrific "cultural practices" seem to be aimed at women.

Love it or hate it, male circumcision has some hygenic benefits; this female circumcision is simply inhumane.

boynamedsuse · #6 05-12-2011, 09:14 AM

Rape in Kenya? More like pedophilia.

ehque · #7 05-12-2011, 09:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Relic

I know, it's a tough thing, it really is.
In this case, this local activist is trying to take care of it so that's as close to a perfect solution as one's going to get IMO, but what if she wasn't? Would it ever be "right" for an outsider to do something about this?

That's slightly better. Change - especially cultural change - needs to be from within to be effective and lasting.

I would agree its wrong, but I'm not a cultural relativist and I don't have the same dilemma you do.

Dr. Cheese · #8 05-12-2011, 10:08 AM

Often "culture" is just a fig leaf used to cover ugly practices.

masturbasser · #9 05-12-2011, 10:14 AM

Ah, Africa. Liberals act like it would be some kind of utopia if the european colonization had never happened. I beg to differ.

Absentia · #10 05-12-2011, 10:23 AM

I'm not touching this everything I write turns out offensive to someone.

sneha1965 · #11 05-12-2011, 10:26 AM

I would support and end to this. I'm not sure the best way to do it but I think it's a poor excuse to tap the young girls of this culture.

Absentia · #12 05-12-2011, 10:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sneha1965

I would support and end to this. I'm not sure the best way to do it but I think it's a poor excuse to tap the young girls of this culture.

You could ask the Kenyan government to get involved....

FilterFunk · #13 05-12-2011, 10:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by masturbasser

Ah, Africa. Liberals act like it would be some kind of utopia if the european colonization had never happened. I beg to differ.

For the record, I feel compelled to disagree with this, but I won't go into detail so as not to derail the thread.

MakiSupaStar · #14 05-12-2011, 10:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr. Cheese

Often "culture" is just a fig leaf used to cover ugly practices.

Well put. I agree.

sneha1965 · #15 05-12-2011, 10:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Absentia

You could ask the Kenyan government to get involved....

That would be great. But if they were going to do it, why aren't they now?

MakiSupaStar · #16 05-12-2011, 10:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by masturbasser

Ah, Africa. Liberals act like it would be some kind of utopia if the european colonization had never happened. I beg to differ.

There is so much wrong with this statement that I don't know where to start. Suddenly people that are in favor of preserving human rights and dignity are liberals, and am I left to presume that those in favor of enslaving a local people while imperialistic powers rape a country of its resources are to be considered conservative?

FilterFunk · #17 05-12-2011, 10:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MakiSupaStar

There is so much wrong with this statement that I don't know where to start. Suddenly people that are in favor of preserving human rights and dignity are liberals, and am I left to presume that those in favor of enslaving a local people while imperialistic powers rape a country of its resources are to be considered conservative?

Thanks for summing up my thoughts perfectly, Maki.

Absentia · #18 05-12-2011, 11:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sneha1965

That would be great. But if they were going to do it, why aren't they now?

Because primitive cultures will remain primitive until the populous decides it's time for things to change, not only is it not our place, it's not our responsibility.

There I said it.

As narrow minded and as much of a bigot it makes me sound.

sneha1965 · #19 05-12-2011, 11:05 AM

Trust me, I have my own opinions on this too.

But they're not this.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Absentia

Because primitive cultures will remain primitive until the populous decides it's time for things to change, not only is it not our place, it's not our responsibility.

There I said it.

As narrow minded and as much of a bigot it makes me sound.

Relic · #20 05-12-2011, 11:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Absentia

Because primitive cultures will remain primitive until the populous decides it's time for things to change, not only is it not our place, it's not our responsibility.

There I said it.

As narrow minded and as much of a bigot it makes me sound.

Actually I agree up to a point.
IMO - If a "primitive" culture is happy with their lifestyle who the hell are we to impose our values on it?
Yet, when that culture includes the rape of children, then arrogant or not, I'd like to see it put to a stop ASAP. It's best if it comes from within that culture - if they decide for change themselves, but if it's not happening..? I dunno, sometimes maybe I get too sensitive about this stuff but I couldn't turn a blind eye to this. Ever. Wrong is wrong