Sleeping Pills, Sleeping Aids, Melatonin

[CrispyDelicious]

So I have a sleeping problem. I can't fall asleep at night. This is a bad thing, because my schedule isn't exactly forgiving. During the week, I need to be awake at 6:45am, and out of the house until 10:00-11:00 p.m. Long days, I know, work and school full time is teh suck. Now, most people would come home from a day that long and have no trouble falling asleep. However, I come home and am absolutely wired until ~3:00a.m. Getting 3.75 hours of sleep a night is not good.

I don't drink coffee or tea past the early afternoon. I don't put anything in my system, for that matter, that could be causing this. The result, however, is that every night, at ~7:00p.m., I pass out for 10-20 minutes. It's uncontrollable, my body shuts down, like a light switch being turned off. My professors are not pleased. My notes have gaping holes from the content I miss.

Last night my roommate gave me a melatonin pill (she has the same problem, only worse - is usually awake until 5:00a.m. but luckily her schedule allows her to sleep in until mid-afternoon).

The pill knocked me out pretty quick, but I haven't heard anything about long-term use. The internet says that studies have shown short-term use (3 months) had no negative side effects. That's great, but I'm curious if anyone else here has used it for any longer - does it still work after 6 months? A year? Any side effects?

Also, if anyone else has sleeping problems, I would like to know how they deal with them.

[Ericman197]

The first part of working up someone with insomnia is to exclude various medical and psychological causes. In your case, it probably has more to do with your schedule. If you're only falling asleep in class, that's fairly normal for someone who's sleep deprived. There are many things that may still be giving you trouble, such as:

stress, anxiety, and just about any form of mental illness
exercise, which depending on timing, could make your problem better or worse
blah blah blah

So assuming you are healthy, the next step would be to look into sleep hygiene (google this). Basically it's a bunch of steps you take in order to get yourself into the sleeping mood, and to stop habits which may be making your insomnia worse. For example, staying up late reading in bed gives some people insomnia: one of the tricks that helps a lot of people is to use the bed ONLY for sleeping and you know what else. You may also consider not using any caffeine at all.

As far as the melatonin is concerned, it's pretty weak sauce compared to benzodiazepines, z-drugs, barbiturates, etc. In other words, if it works for you, and you're not taking VAST quantities of it, it's probably OK. You're not likely to get addicted. I'm not sure that anyone is aware of any long term health problems associated with melatonin, but that's why ideally I would use it while you work on your sleep hygiene, and possibly make changes in your schedule. The goal would be to be able to taper off it at some point in the future.

[kesslari]

Actually, melatonin can cause/worsen a powerful clinical depression in some people. Not an extremely common side effect, but not pleasant, and it doesn't stop when you stop taking the melatonin.

[Lady Kayri]

If you can, get checked over by a doctor and make sure you don't have a medical problem that is contributing to your insomnia.

That said, I've used melatonin off and on for years, and haven't had any addiction problems. I use it mostly when I've been working a strange work schedule, and once I get back to more of a routine, taper it off as normal sleep routine takes hold.

[Bassslayer69]

I prescribe the police...
But i'm NO doctor.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FzDMl...F3&index=7good luck bro.

[6jase5]

I sleep about 4-6 hours max and very lightly. White noise (or pink or brown noise) helps me to concentrate on only the sound, much like meditation, and I fall asleep. I tried a lot of things but my brain keeps me awake and I just think and think about nothing in particular. I need a small house fan or I use simplynoise.com when I'm travelling and it really helped me.

Simple fix that's better than medication, can't hurt to try.

[flipper_gv]

Well, I study in neuropsychology and Melatonin can help you with the "timing" you want to go asleep. you take one at night (at like 8 pm) and it will help you to "retime" your internal clock that tells you when is the time to sleep. People use Melatonin to get used to different times when traveling. Use it right. IT IS NOT A SLEEP AID. Like I said, it will simply retime your internal sleeping clock (aka it works with the pineal gland).

[CrispyDelicious]

Originally Posted by flipper_gv

Well, I study in neuropsychology and Melatonin can help you with the "timing" you want to go asleep. you take one at night (at like 8 pm) and it will help you to "retime" your internal clock that tells you when is the time to sleep. People use Melatonin to get used to different times when traveling. Use it right. IT IS NOT A SLEEP AID. Like I said, it will simply retime your internal sleeping clock (aka it works with the pineal gland).

Ah, thank you for clearing that up. I do think it is a timing issue, because on weekends, when I can sleep in, I sleep from 3-4am until noonish, and feel great. I just need to get myself back into sleeping at midnight, not 3am. SO I should be able to stop taking it once I get back into the habit of sleeping at a normal time?

[dullsilver_mike]

I have a nightcap. Does the trick pretty nicely.

[Indiana Mike]

I took ambien for almost a year , the first two months pretty much every night , then as needed until two months ago when I quit . Had no bad effects and did not become addicted to it .

It WILL knock your woohoo in the dirt within 15 minutes of taking it . You have to take it and GO STRAIGHT TO BED or you may wake up naked walking in the middle of the street.
My only fear was , if my house caught fire would I die because I wouldn't hear the alarm or acknowledge it.

I went thru a divorce that was very hard on me . I went a month with almost zero sleep so I had no choice but to take something.

[NJL]

google binaural beats

buy diphenhydramine

[Joe Gress]

Originally Posted by NJL

buy diphenhydramine

Goofball.

[TBrett]

Melatonin is a naturally occuring hormone, derived from seratonin, that is associated with sleep. It has been suggested that several illnesses, including certain cancers, may result from low levels of melatonin in the body. One remedy for restoring healthy levels is ensuring you are always sleeping in the dark, i.e., not with a TV or light on in the room. Google it for more info on how melatonin works and for what you can do to increase your body's natural melatonin production.

We use it when sleep, or lack thereof, becomes a problem. Mostly, it works fine and we've never had dependency issues with it. Sometimes, though, I find I'll still wake up in the wee hours of the morning and be unable to get back to a proper sleep, which, in my case, is usually a sign that I'm stressed about something.

Because your schedule sounds so punishing, Crispy, I also suggest looking into any forms of relaxation that appeal to you. Even 20 minutes of relaxation with eyes closed (this is key), when you come home at the end of the day, can help regulate your body clock and allow you to sleep better at bedtime. And some simple breathing and calming exercises in bed can be extremely helpful, too.

In addition, I'd recommend talking to a qualified herbalist. There are various herbs that can be combined in tea at bedtime to soothe the nerves, calm the mind, and allow you to drift off peacefully with no side effects or dependancy issues. I went through a really hellish experience about four years ago that produced the worst insomnia I've ever experienced. Fortunately, I have an excellent herbalist just up the street (The Herbal Clinic on Ronces, since you're also in T.O.). The bedtime tea she sells for this purpose did the trick every time. So if you're going to go that route, make sure you consult with a qualified practitioner. A Chinese doctor I know also recommends taking 1,000 mg of Calcium about 20 minutes before bed. This works for some but not for all, I have found.

Another thing that has really helped me is ear plugs, along with having an electric fan going in the bedroom. We live on a main street, next to a neighbour whose TV seems to be on 24/7, so the fan is a great noise mask. I used to be a deep sleeper when I was younger, but not anymore. So on those nights when sleep eludes me, I put in the ear plugs and 9 times out of 10, I sleep really well. Occasionally, I'll wear an eye mask to block out any ambient light.

A final note: I'd recommend eliminating as many stimulants from your diet as possible during sleep-deprived periods. This can include caffeine, alcohol, and various sugars. Everyone is different, so you might have to experiment to see what helps and what hinders. Hope you can find some solutions quickly because I, like many of us who posted, know just how much sleep deprivation sucks!

And with that said, I'm off to bed. Wishing you - all of you - a very good night's sleep!

[L-A]

Originally Posted by CrispyDelicious

Ah, thank you for clearing that up. I do think it is a timing issue, because on weekends, when I can sleep in, I sleep from 3-4am until noonish, and feel great. I just need to get myself back into sleeping at midnight, not 3am. SO I should be able to stop taking it once I get back into the habit of sleeping at a normal time?

That sounds like delayed sleep phase syndrome. You don't have insomnia, therefore don't need sleeping *aids*. Melatonin can help reset your internal clock.

My friend had DSPS and used to wear sunglasses 1h before going to sleep, it seemed to work well for him.

[flipper_gv]

Originally Posted by L-A

That sounds like delayed sleep phase syndrome. You don't have insomnia, therefore don't need sleeping *aids*. Melatonin can help reset your internal clock.

My friend had DSPS and used to wear sunglasses 1h before going to sleep, it seemed to work well for him.

yah, being in the dark some time before when you go to bed will help you with your normal melatonin cycles. Like, the melatonin cycles is supposed to fit with the day light cycles. If you are unbalanced, best way is try to be in the dark some time (at least 20 min) before going to sleep. If you want info about quantities and such, ask your pharmacist, I'm really not in the position to help on this.

[LightGroove]

Originally Posted by TBrett

Melatonin is a naturally occuring hormone, derived from seratonin, that is associated with sleep. It has been suggested that several illnesses, including certain cancers, may result from low levels of melatonin in the body. One remedy for restoring healthy levels is ensuring you are always sleeping in the dark, i.e., not with a TV or light on in the room. Google it for more info on how melatonin works and for what you can do to increase your body's natural melatonin production.

We use it when sleep, or lack thereof, becomes a problem. Mostly, it works fine and we've never had dependency issues with it. Sometimes, though, I find I'll still wake up in the wee hours of the morning and be unable to get back to a proper sleep, which, in my case, is usually a sign that I'm stressed about something.

Because your schedule sounds so punishing, Crispy, I also suggest looking into any forms of relaxation that appeal to you. Even 20 minutes of relaxation with eyes closed (this is key), when you come home at the end of the day, can help regulate your body clock and allow you to sleep better at bedtime. And some simple breathing and calming exercises in bed can be extremely helpful, too.

In addition, I'd recommend talking to a qualified herbalist. There are various herbs that can be combined in tea at bedtime to soothe the nerves, calm the mind, and allow you to drift off peacefully with no side effects or dependancy issues. I went through a really hellish experience about four years ago that produced the worst insomnia I've ever experienced. Fortunately, I have an excellent herbalist just up the street (The Herbal Clinic on Ronces, since you're also in T.O.). The bedtime tea she sells for this purpose did the trick every time. So if you're going to go that route, make sure you consult with a qualified practitioner. A Chinese doctor I know also recommends taking 1,000 mg of Calcium about 20 minutes before bed. This works for some but not for all, I have found.

Another thing that has really helped me is ear plugs, along with having an electric fan going in the bedroom. We live on a main street, next to a neighbour whose TV seems to be on 24/7, so the fan is a great noise mask. I used to be a deep sleeper when I was younger, but not anymore. So on those nights when sleep eludes me, I put in the ear plugs and 9 times out of 10, I sleep really well. Occasionally, I'll wear an eye mask to block out any ambient light.

A final note: I'd recommend eliminating as many stimulants from your diet as possible during sleep-deprived periods. This can include caffeine, alcohol, and various sugars. Everyone is different, so you might have to experiment to see what helps and what hinders. Hope you can find some solutions quickly because I, like many of us who posted, know just how much sleep deprivation sucks!

And with that said, I'm off to bed. Wishing you - all of you - a very good night's sleep!

+1 well said!

My sleep issues always are dictated by outside factors whether it be anxiety, stress, caffeine. What Ive learned through all of this is about Adrenal Exhaustion... Look into this....Ive followed several recommendations including a major diet and sleep change and my body and sleep is drastically improving. Something to think about... Your body hits REM sleep earlier in the night 10-11...anything after that is really no good...obviously something is better than nothing...

[Jimmy Bones]

I am a chronic insomniac, been taking various medications for years.

I rotate my meds, both OTC and prescription, so as not to become too dependant or resistant to any one pill.

First, I recommend the non-medicated approach. Try jogging or powerwalking for about half an hour before going to bed. Seriously. Do it. Feel better bout yourself, lose some weight, get some cardio, and then be able to relax well enough to sleep. It works for everybody, except me.

Second, you could try the natural stuff, some valerian, some melatonin, etc, but it tends to be to weak for me, even way back when everything worked for me. And valerian stinks like horse manure.

Third, you could go for the OTC meds. Anti-histamines like Diphenhydramine HCL work well, but you develop a resistance, and CAN OD on it, it can mess you up if you take more than 50mg. I take 200 mg a night when it's in my rotation. It's only benadryl, but you can get the store brand for a third of the price - it's marketted in both the sleep section AND the allergy section, but it's the same product. DO NOT take the kind mixed with acetomenaphin, you can fry your liver. Take lots of water with it and wear chapstick, you'll wake up dried out.

Fourth, you could consider asking your doctor for a short term prescription for something like ambien, but it has lots of weird side effects.

[Ericman197]

Originally Posted by Indiana Mike

It WILL knock your woohoo in the dirt within 15 minutes of taking it . You have to take it and GO STRAIGHT TO BED or you may wake up naked walking in the middle of the street.
My only fear was , if my house caught fire would I die because I wouldn't hear the alarm or acknowledge it.

This is the main problem with Ambien. A lot of people do really weird things while taking it. The same applies to benzos (Valium, etc.), but the stories with Ambien seem to be the most bizarre. Quite a few people have gotten into car accidents while sleepwalking on Ambien. Usually minor, because you don't get very far in that state - still, a cause for concern.

If you take Ambien, you need to take it just before bed and under no circumstances (other than emergencies) should you drink alcohol, or get out of bed before morning. A lot of people's 'close-calls' with Ambien involve dangerous stuff, like cooking, bathing, driving, drinking, etc.

[Georynn]

Originally Posted by Jimmy Bones

I am a chronic insomniac, been taking various medications for years.

I rotate my meds, both OTC and prescription, so as not to become too dependant or resistant to any one pill.

First, I recommend the non-medicated approach. Try jogging or powerwalking for about half an hour before going to bed. Seriously. Do it. Feel better bout yourself, lose some weight, get some cardio, and then be able to relax well enough to sleep. It works for everybody, except me.

Second, you could try the natural stuff, some valerian, some melatonin, etc, but it tends to be to weak for me, even way back when everything worked for me. And valerian stinks like horse manure.

Third, you could go for the OTC meds. Anti-histamines like Diphenhydramine HCL work well, but you develop a resistance, and CAN OD on it, it can mess you up if you take more than 50mg. I take 200 mg a night when it's in my rotation. It's only benadryl, but you can get the store brand for a third of the price - it's marketted in both the sleep section AND the allergy section, but it's the same product. DO NOT take the kind mixed with acetomenaphin, you can fry your liver. Take lots of water with it and wear chapstick, you'll wake up dried out.

Fourth, you could consider asking your doctor for a short term prescription for something like ambien, but it has lots of weird side effects.

I seem to have a very similar problem as you, I've found that Ambien causes problems for me (I stay awake, only I don't remember what I did), and the alternative my doctor proscribed worked 100 times better, Its called Lunesta. Just like someone said earlier about Ambien, be near a horizontal sleeping surface immediately after taking this, it will take you down in a hurry. If I took it and was not in my bed...after 20 minutes, I could barely make it to my bed 30 feet away. Boy that stuff puts you into a DEEEEEEP sleep. That being said, when Lunesta has done its thing, and if you are sleeping, and then are awakened sometime during the night, Plan on being up... when this stuff wears off, it almost has the complete opposite effect as when it started working. after you wake up there is no hangover, no fatigue, and often feel far more well rested after the good nights sleep this stuff gives you, than you've probably had in a while (at least for me... I have 3 kids).

I can certainly see where this could become addictive... the lure of a deep and peaceful sleep the entire night through, is a very tempting and powerful motivation.

[Marcus Willett]

I've used Alteril which is a melatonin/valerian/tryptophan mix. Works pretty good and has a milder effect with no hangover. It's also OTC and pretty cheap; like $15 at Walmart for a box that will last you 2-3 months even if you take it regularly.