TalkBass OFFICIAL English Football thread 2012-13: second half

[MartinG1957]

Ridiculous situation at Arsenal with the boo boys leading to Arsene saying he may consider his position at the end of the season.
Similarly some eejits at Celtic giving Neil Lennon pelters the other week a few days after, no doubt the same people, were hailing him for one of the clubs greatest results in beating Barca.. Probably also the same guys who hounded Gordon Strachan out when he was one of the most successful managers we ever had... Although I think more nefarious motives were behind a lot of that.
The list goes on-I am heartily sick of the attitude of vocal minorities - and I include certain half-wit chairmen in that-who expect perfection from a manager and his team week after week, it's sport, it's a game it doesn't always work, there can be only one etc. - grow up, grow a pair and live with it.
I'm as disappointed as any other supporter when my team get it wrong, play badly or seem to lose their way - I'm also honest enough to say that I make mistakes or have bad days or sometimes just lose out to better tactics, skill, strategy etc in the things I do - thats life - I don't beat myself up and dont expect to be subject to the abusive crap and humilation that seems to be acceptable in some quarters, for someone doing their job. I've never booed my team or manager and never walked out early, no matter how poor or dissapointing the performance.
I extend this to chairmen and fans who sack last year's hero, the guy who got them promoted, for the team failing to make the quantum jump in standards in the next league up. This sort of thinking reaches the ultimate level of stupidity of course in the case of Chelsea, where it seems that at least some of the supporters are getting fed up with the whims of the chairman.
Yes, I appreciate the argument that those who pay their money are entitled to express an opinion - but only up to a point- the sort of standard abuse and humiliation we see when things aren't going well is, to me anyway, totally beyond any rights conferred by wearing a scarf and paying in-don't care how passionate you are about your team, if you are unhappy why do you go - and I appreciate of course the investment in tradition and passion we all have for our team, but to me that means thick and thin, express your dissatisfaction if you like but not by abusing team and manager - no one goes out to play badly. Wonder how the boo boys would cope with someone doing the same to them at work? Yes sometimes things dont work out and it's time for a change but treat people with dignity.
I had thought Arsenal, United and Everton in particular had supporters and chairmen who were an example to the rest in realism and supporting the manager and team when it doesn't go well, sadly it seems that Arsenal may be heading down the slippery slope.

Sorry that turned into such a Sunday morning rant lads, hadn't meant to do that it just grew - I am just fed up with this reality show society that we seem to be getting herded into - real people with real lives shouldn't need to survive the public vote every week to keep their jobs - and the 'disposable people' mentality being engendered in society by this sort of stuff scares me...

[MartinG1957]

Gawd just saw how long that got when I posted it - sorry again lads! :-)

[Darkstrike]

I don't blame ya, and I certainly enjoyed reading your thoughts on the situation. I especially feel sorry for Wenger, as it's not like he's doing the best he can, it's not his fault that his star players keep ditching the team, or his bosses won't let him splash out on big players.

Modern fans feel bloody entitled, that's for sure.

Originally Posted by MartinG1957

I had thought Arsenal, United and Everton in particular had supporters and chairmen who were an example to the rest in realism and supporting the manager and team when it doesn't go well, sadly it seems that Arsenal may be heading down the slippery slope.

I just want to point out that United really don't belong in that list, sadly. I'm on a United forum as well. This season we spent big on a superstar player, are 3 points clear in the league in Dec, have only lost, 3 games in the Prem. Yet all I see is complete whining that we didn't win the 3 we lost, that our midfield sucks, we need to buy everyone, that our defence sucks, our keepers suck..... It's draining.

As for realism, it's Wigans fault we didn't win the title, it's QPR's, it's Evertons, etc, etc. Man Utd having nothing to do with these games of course. Clearly the moment Utd walk on the pitch, other teams should just bend over and say, "have at it lads".

[Tituscrow]

Nowt wrong with a rant, Martin.

Don't think for one minute that we haven't got our fair share of the "Moyes Out/Kenwright Out" brigade.

Mike Walker, Howard Kendall (3rd time around), Joe Royle and Walter Smith all endured horrendous abuse, fuelled by a sense of entitlement from older blues who'd seen an unbelievably good side in the late 80's destroy all comers. And I was one of them.

When you've seen Paul Bracewell, Kevin Sheedy,Trevor Steven, Peter Reid, Neville Southall, Graeme Sharp, Andy Gray, Gary Lineker etc, its VERY hard to get enthused by the likes of Earl Barrett, John Spencer, Carl Tiler and Vinny effin Samways

There are plenty of games I've left early. Usually when we are 3-0 down with ten minutes to go, and Slaven Bilic is playing centre forward as a last gasp strategy! I even left a third round cup tie at home to Tranmere at half time, having conceded three of the softest goals I've ever seen thanks to the woefully inadequate combined defensive skills of David Unsworth, Marc Hottiger and Craig Short.

But those kind of periods of adversity make most fans appreciate seasons like this one a little more. And as an older fella these days, you know what? Does it really matter? I mean REALLY matter? It's football. I show my disapproval these days by simply refusing to line their already bulging pockets anymore. Unless its a one-off game that I really fancy, or all the old lads are having a weekender in Liverpool. They are my team and I love them, but not enough to let them ruin my weekends anymore.

I would hazard a guess that the boo-boys at Arsenal and United are mostly younger (relatively speaking) fans that don't remember, for example, Denis Laws backheel.

And despite my loathing of those on the dark side of Stanley Park, I understand that it must REALLY hurt those fans of my age and older seeing how far from grace they have fallen.

So, the lighter side of all this? All you moaning Gooners, Spurs, Hoops, Reds...whatever...it could be worse. You could be a Liverpool fan.

[Darkstrike]

On the darker side, I'm at the moment, reading a United fan trying to justify calling Wenger a paedo, amongst other disgraceful songs.

[MartinG1957]

Good honest comments and points lads thanks.
It would always be my option to simply not go if i was unhappy - think I'm at the same stage Titus of 'older and wiser,' (geez 55 on Wednesday where did it go!!) - the days when a bad result ruined my day are also long gone.
Agree DS some of what people feel is ok to shout and aim at people doing a job sickens me -same at Parkhead with some of the 'politically orientated' stuff that was yelled out there in past days....as you say Titus, the X Factor generation seem to have very little in the way of either patience or a decency filter....

[Keano]

Good guy Danny. I don't know why, but his parental tucking in of Rafael put a smile on my face.



No prize for guessing what Big Sam's instruction here is. Hammers gonna Hammer, Sam gonna Sam.



As for the boo-boys, honestly screw them. They're more likely than not fairweather fans that's not prepared for the long ride. Interestingly enough, we had some anti-AVB/pro-'Arry fans in the mix yesterday. They had some choice words about AVB at half time. Coincidentally, they were both very quiet during second. lol

[Tituscrow]

Gutted for AFC Wimbledon. Would have been a nice twist that, holding out for a draw and a replay back at their ground.

Nothing sickens like conceding a 90th minute winner.

[Darkstrike]

Aye, that was a shame for Wimbledon.

Pretty meh FA Cup Draw.

[Tituscrow]

I dunno, some decent ties thrown up. Your game at West Ham will probably be on the telly, as will Liverpool away. Talking of boo-boys, there are still West Ham fans that bang on about the whole Paul Ince thing. 23 years ago.

[Darkstrike]

The Swansea/Arsenal one was a bit a shocker.

I wanted us to draw Bradford, assuming they win their current tie, they're my grandads team, so picking at each other would have been fun.


West Ham have a different breed of fan to be fair, 23 years behind the rest of us sounds about right.

[Tituscrow]

Aaaah, your grandad will no doubt remember Bradford knocking us out of the FA Cup in 1997.

Kanchelskis fannying about in the centre circle lost the ball to an ageing, mulleted Chris Waddle, who, with the turning circle of an oil tanker, still managed to nutmeg Gary Speed and chip Southall from the halfway line. I think they beat us 3-2. Never seen away support like that before or since.

Another game I left before the end

I remember signing Stuart McCall in 1988 (I think?). Great player. Solid, old-fashioned gutsy midfielder, with tree-trunk thighs to rival Stuart Pearce!

Talking of scumbag 'fans', there are still Leeds supporters that sing songs about the fire in '86.

[Darkstrike]

I'm sure he does!

"Turning circle of an oil tanker", somehow a comment I wouldn't expect of a footballer...

Watching the goal though, it's incredibly accurate.

[Tituscrow]

Originally Posted by Darkstrike

I'm sure he does!

"Turning circle of an oil tanker", somehow a comment I wouldn't expect of a footballer...

Watching the goal though, it's incredibly accurate.

Oh it was a magnificent strike, no doubt about that. I remember him launching a similar effort for England v Germany in the 1990 World Cup semi final. The point is, even though his legs had gone by the time he ended up playing for Bradford, he found that old magic for a brief second and scored one of the goals of the season.

[Darkstrike]

Reading the comments, it seems he had told your guys keeper to not leave his line during the game, a dare that worked out for him.

[Tituscrow]

Originally Posted by Darkstrike

Reading the comments, it seems he had told your guys keeper to not leave his line during the game, a dare that worked out for him.

Yeah, Big Nev was widely regarded as the best in the world at one point (around 86/87). I've seen him do after dinner speeches, and he rates Waddles goal against him as the one that still haunts him

[cheezewiz]

Completely baffled by the Gunners current form. The talent is on the pitch, but they somehow can't find a way to play together. Cazorla, Arteta, Wilshire in midfield should be one of the best in The Prem, but somehow, it just isn't.

[boethius]

Originally Posted by cheezewiz

Completely baffled by the Gunners current form. The talent is on the pitch, but they somehow can't find a way to play together. Cazorla, Arteta, Wilshire in midfield should be one of the best in The Prem, but somehow, it just isn't.

Agreed! Quite disappointing to say the least!

[MartinG1957]

Originally Posted by cheezewiz

Completely baffled by the Gunners current form. The talent is on the pitch, but they somehow can't find a way to play together. Cazorla, Arteta, Wilshire in midfield should be one of the best in The Prem, but somehow, it just isn't.

And so it goes on... Sigh....

Ah well, they are at least through, now, Come On The Hoops!

[Darkstrike]

Aye, wanna see a Celtic result tonight!