The Tenth Inning?

[Dr. Cheese]

What do you guys think of the new Ken Burns documentary? So far, I'm a bit unmoved. I'm not learning anything new, it just looks like a bunch of ESPN reruns to me.

It does have a funky soundtrack though!

[crucislancer]

Fell asleep watching it last night.

[MJ5150]

I just got done watching it. I kept watching hoping it would be more than it ended being, an ESPN rehash as you accurately described.

-Mike

[stratovani]

I found it interesting to watch from a historical perspective. I did learn one thing - the only thing bigger than Barry Bonds' head is Barry Bonds' ego! I also found it interesting that everyone defended baseball as America's pastime (which was not unexpected). In a way, I agree with it, baseball is America's pastime - it's to pass the time between seasons of what is really America's sport, NFL football.

[Dr. Cheese]

Originally Posted by MJ5150

I just got done watching it. I kept watching hoping it would be more than it ended being, an ESPN rehash as you accurately described.

-Mike

I think the Ken Burns approach works well when he can bring out some nuggets of truth that are not well known. Commenting on such well documented recent history, he had nothing to add to the story. In twenty years, somebody may come along and really bring a new perspective to this era, but The Tenth Inning is just too soon.

[sloasdaylight]

That's disappointed to hear it wasn't that great. Ken Burns' Civil War and Jazz documentaries were outstanding pieces of documentary work, and gave me a huge amount of respect for the man.

[doktorfeelgood]

Tonight I recorded the installment with the story of the Red Sox's 2004 World Series win and have yet to watch it. Prolly won't watch any of the rest of the series. More interested in NHL hockey starting up soon. I loved the Civil War series and I think Ken Burns is a genius. )-(

[Atoz]

There was no need to go into extra innings.

[Ground Pounder]

Originally Posted by Dr. Cheese

I think the Ken Burns approach works well when he can bring out some nuggets of truth that are not well known. Commenting on such well documented recent history, he had nothing to add to the story. In twenty years, somebody may come along and really bring a new perspective to this era, but The Tenth Inning is just too soon.

I think this is the key. Doing a fairly recent-to-present-time sports doc, I think you have to do something a little less out-front. I would've loved to see Burns do something like this on, say, American soccer, before the World Cup started.

[tycobb73]

agree with above. I saw baseball, 2 or 3 times and it worked because I wasn't there for any of it. I knew all of the tenth inning so it didn't really move me. It was interesting to see what he thought was imporrtant from the era.

[steamthief]

I liked it. The overriding theme, to me, was that while baseball has succeeded wildly in commerical terms (attendance, union vs. mgmt, etc,) the game has lost the "mythic" qualities, like the "sacred" history of stats, etc, due to the pervasive influence of steroids on a large percentage of the best players over the last decade.

[Philbiker]

I loved it. Ken Burns has always had difficulty with recent history - this is the best he's ever done with something recent. I thought it was perfect.

[Dr. Cheese]

Originally Posted by Philbiker

I loved it. Ken Burns has always had difficulty with recent history - this is the best he's ever done with something recent. I thought it was perfect.

I really disliked Burns decision to make Barry Bonds the focal point of the steroid era despite the fact that Burns, and everyone else, acknowledges that Bonds got into steroids much later than other players who posted unreal numbers. Second, since Bonds is known as surly and distant, it is way too easy for him to fall into the villian role while baseball, as a whole, avoids blame for a problem that was aided and abetted at all levels of the game.

I think McGwire and Sosa are the true exemplars of the steroid era since they achieved incredible fame, and money through doping, and they also lifted the sport as a whole in the post 1994 strike era. The problem with criticizing them is that then the people like Selig, Costas, and George Will would all have to look themselves in the mirror instead of just piling on Bonds.

The above criticism is a big part of what I mean when I say that Burns, simply sounds like everyone else of this time in his critique of the steroid era. A future writer, may not take my approach, but hopefully would bring some thing more insightful than what has been written so far.

[steamthief]

While I agree with you on McGwire and Sosa, I think Bonds deserves to have that spotlight shined on him. He broke the most revered record in the game, and did it riding dirty.

[Dr. Cheese]

Originally Posted by steamthief

While I agree with you on McGwire and Sosa, I think Bonds deserves to have that spotlight shined on him. He broke the most revered record in the game, and did it riding dirty.

I didn't say he should be ignored or downplayed. I think acting as if he was the prime mover of the steroid situation is inaccurate.

[Philbiker]

Originally Posted by Dr. Cheese

I didn't say he should be ignored or downplayed. I think acting as if he was the prime mover of the steroid situation is inaccurate.

I didn't get that from the doc.

[steamthief]

Originally Posted by Dr. Cheese

I didn't say he should be ignored or downplayed. I think acting as if he was the prime mover of the steroid situation is inaccurate.

Originally Posted by Philbiker

I didn't get that from the doc.

Me neither. If either Sosa or McGuire broke both the single season and career HR records, juiced, I believe the spotlight would have been the same.

More than any other sport, baseball looks to the record books with reverence. Sadly, the history of the game is tainted and diminshed by the steroid era.

I hope the truth about that pumpkin head Roger Clemens is revealed in full. He's as bad all the hitters injecting roids, imo.

[Dr. Cheese]

Originally Posted by steamthief

Me neither. If either Sosa or McGuire broke both the single season and career HR records, juiced, I believe the spotlight would have been the same.

More than any other sport, baseball looks to the record books with reverence. Sadly, the history of the game is tainted and diminshed by the steroid era.

I hope the truth about that pumpkin head Roger Clemens is revealed in full. He's as bad all the hitters injecting roids, imo.

To be clear gain, I am by no means defending Bonds. As Burns noted, he was a legitimate HOF playere without steroids, and it seems his vanity allowed him to do it because he felt lesser players got too much attention at his expense. My point is that his vanity and grouchiness allowed him to be portrayed as a villain to a degree that even he did not deserve relative. The fact that he made no friends in the media also did him in.

[Dr. Cheese]

Originally Posted by steamthief

If either Sosa or McGuire broke both the single season and career HR records, juiced, I believe the spotlight would have been the same.

They both broke Roger Maris' record in the same season before Bonds came along.

[steamthief]

Originally Posted by Dr. Cheese

To be clear gain, I am by no means defending Bonds. As Burns noted, he was a legitimate HOF playere without steroids, and it seems his vanity allowed him to do it because he felt lesser players got too much attention at his expense. My point is that his vanity and grouchiness allowed him to be portrayed as a villain to a degree that even he did not deserve relative. The fact that he made no friends in the media also did him in.

Vanity is a deadly sin, innit? I don't think he was any more vain or grouchy than, say, Reggie Jackson, and he definitely had HOF cred with or without the juice. I think where the villainy kicks in is because 1.) he refused to acknowledge anything to do with Balco when the evidence clearly showed otherwise, and 2.) he played in the hyper-media age of 24-7 sports newsfeeds.

Originally Posted by Dr. Cheese

They both broke Roger Maris' record in the same season before Bonds came along.

Yep, and I remember how I thought back then how juiced McGuire looked. Look at pics of him from his rookie season with the A's, before Canseco turned him on.

If the single season record wasn't broken by Bonds, I believe McGwire would have caught a lot more heat.