This tickled my sociological fancy

Alex · #1 01-27-2008, 07:27 PM

"Between men and women there is no friendship possible. There is passion, enmity, worship, love, but no friendship."
~Oscar Wilde

Basically this is saying that no matter what there will always be a sexual undertone in male/female relationships. This obviously excludes gays, siblings, etc.

I am inclined to disagree because while this is often true, I definitely have friends that are girls that I am simply friends with and nothing else. I don't see them in a different light than any of my other friends.

I think that I really don't want this to be true because it is basically an insult to every presumably genuine relationship I have had with a girl, but the more I think about it the more true it seems, as almost every girl I've been friends with has at one time or another had a thing for me. Even if I haven't had similar feelings, if it's on one end of the relationship then it counts.

Either way it just really bothered me for some reason.

I thought that this would provoke a bit of stimulating discourse!

discuss.

A9X · #2 01-27-2008, 07:33 PM

I'm waiting for Maki's comment.

theshadow2001 · #3 01-27-2008, 07:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alex

I am inclined to disagree because while this is often true, I definitely have friends that are girls that I am simply friends with and nothing else. I don't see them in a different light than any of my other friends.

Yes indeed but how do they see you.

skaliwag66 · #4 01-27-2008, 07:42 PM

Wasn't Oscar Wilde gay himself?

theshadow2001 · #5 01-27-2008, 07:46 PM

Yeah I thought that too. It seems he had a wife. He could of been bi though.

hbarcat · #6 01-27-2008, 07:49 PM

I have had, and still have, numerous genuine friendships with women, some with sexual content (overt or suppressed) and some without.

I don't see what's so controversial about this, unless one wants to get into a pseudo-intellectual discussion that attempts to fallaciously redefine the meaning of "friends" as being different when applied to opposite gender relationships.

Alex · #7 01-27-2008, 07:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hbarcat

I have had, and still have, numerous genuine friendships with women, some with sexual content (overt or suppressed) and some without.

I don't see what's so controversial about this, unless one wants to get into a pseudo-intellectual discussion that attempts to fallaciously redefine the meaning of "friends" as being different when applied to opposite gender relationships.

I think you just argued for both sides.

Valerus · #8 01-27-2008, 08:13 PM

This can be debated either way.

Personally I disagree, because I have a lot of girl friends that I only see as friends.

SuperDuck · #9 01-27-2008, 08:15 PM

Isn't that the basic gist of When Harry Met Sally?

theshadow2001 · #10 01-27-2008, 08:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Valerus

This can be debated either way.

Personally I disagree, because I have a lot of girl friends that I only see as friends.

The thing is while you might feel this way they may not. Even if someone asked them if there was something there they are likely just to say no regardless whether there is or isn't something there

Tsal · #11 01-28-2008, 03:07 AM

I think that in biological context, attractive member of the opposite sex is just that. However, I'd say that the social context dictates our behaviour, and we are used to suppressing our urges. I still notice that I tend to aim to please or even remotely court attractive females, though, even if I don't expect anything but a platonic relationship.

Deacon_Blues · #12 01-28-2008, 03:31 AM

While YOU might think of a person of the opposite sex as only a friend and cannot really imagine it being something else, that particular friend might have different feelings about you (or the other way around - rather common for me

). One of my best friends in my current town is a female. She have confessed she had some feelings for me in the beginning, while I really didn't have more than friendship feelings about her. She's been happily together with another guy for a few years now, and we're all good friends.

Only bad thing with having a female friend is that if you go out just the two of you, people automatically assume you're dating while you're not....

I kind of agree with the Oscar Wilde quote in the OP, although I think it isn't always that black and white.

ahkiatt · #13 01-28-2008, 03:35 AM

We've had a thread like this. Seems like it's a 50-50 fight.

morf · #14 01-28-2008, 05:55 AM

Oscar Wilde said that? Heh.

casualmadness · #15 01-28-2008, 08:43 AM

I aggree 100%. If a man and a woman are friends long enough, one will develop feelings. That person may never act on those feelings, and it may possibly be nothing more than a fleeting glimpse.But at some point, one of the two will glance at the other and think..."I wonder what it would be like..."
Just my own armchair psychology there.

hbarcat · #16 01-28-2008, 05:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alex

I think you just argued for both sides.

I didn't. Here's the quote:

"Between men and women there is no friendship possible. There is passion, enmity, worship, love, but no friendship."
~Oscar Wilde

This means that the presence of sexual undertones is not only inevitable, but that it precludes friendship.

I wrote:

I have had, and still have, numerous genuine friendships with women, some with sexual content (overt or suppressed) and some without.

I'm saying that friendship IS possible regardless of the existence of sexual content.

Alex · #17 01-28-2008, 05:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hbarcat

I didn't. Here's the quote:

"Between men and women there is no friendship possible. There is passion, enmity, worship, love, but no friendship."
~Oscar Wilde

This means that the presence of sexual undertones is not only inevitable, but that it precludes friendship.

I wrote:

I have had, and still have, numerous genuine friendships with women, some with sexual content (overt or suppressed) and some without.

I'm saying that friendship IS possible regardless of the existence of sexual content.

Ok but the next paragraph seemed to contradict that. W/e don't worry about it.

superbassman2000 · #18 01-28-2008, 06:35 PM

that reminds me of that ladder theory website...

anyways, i don't know--I have friends that are girls and i don't have passion, enmity, worship, or love for her. I would preface wilde's quote with "this quote only applies to member's of the opposite sex that you are attracted to in the first place" because in that case, i'd have to agree!

funkalicious101 · #19 01-28-2008, 08:40 PM

Wasnt Oscar Wilde into young boys?

theshadow2001 · #20 01-28-2008, 08:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by funkalicious101

Wasnt Oscar Wilde into young boys?

Quote:

Though Wilde's sexual orientation has variously been considered bisexual, homosexual, and paederastic, Wilde himself felt he belonged to a culture of male love inspired by the Greek paederastic tradition.[8] In describing his own sexual identity, Wilde used the term Socratic.[9] ("Bosie"). Wilde also had numerous sexual encounters with working-class male youths, who were often He may have had significant sexual relationships with (in chronological order) Frank Miles, Constance Lloyd (his wife), Robert Baldwin Ross, and Lord Alfred Douglasrent boys.

There's no reason the same idea can't be adjusted for anyone who's gay.