why are these mass murders on the rise?

[chuck norriss]

I think I've asked this before: In Canada they don't really dwell on bad news on the boob tube. True? In San Francisco the news doesn't (didn't) report when people jumped from bridges. I wonder if it would be worse or less worse if people didn't know. However now we have the internets--all is known and inescapable. Sad day.

[darius8]

Originally Posted by Relic

Well...in theory if everyone had a gun, the problem would kinda sorta work itself out in time. Just my opinion is all.

It sounds like an alternative means to population control. Just my opinion.

[4dog]

For those who took me staight up serious,, gotcha,, i agree totally that it is media oversaturation. If it bleeds it leads

[HunterBrodt]

Taking anti-depressents does not turn you into a homicidal maniac... but people who are depressed are more likely to be homicidal maniacs. People who are having mental health issues usually get prescribed ad's... and some of those people end up committing unspeakable acts against innocents.

[StyleOverShow]

Dr. Drew nailed it, IMO. His disgust was palpable.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CfdqSOaBLwg

[michael_atw]

Loaded question. They aren't on the rise. The only thing on the rise is the ability of mass media to convey one piece of information 100 different ways. Perceptions are distorted.

[Datsgor]

It's clearly a symptom of the "nobody is a loser" and "we don't keep score" and "everybody is a winner here" mentality that these kids have been brainwashed with. The educators think they know how to make sure nobody's feelings get hurt. Everybody gets a fair turn they say...but what they don't know, is that when these kids get out into the "real" world and start getting treated like "real" people treat each other....they don't know how to handle it. So they lose it and lash out. It's only going to get worse, because we have a couple of generations of these "protected" children to go through.

[fdeck]

Originally Posted by Datsgor

It's clearly a symptom of the "nobody is a loser" and "we don't keep score" and "everybody is a winner here" mentality that these kids have been brainwashed with.

This seems to be a popular belief, but is it something that you are saying here because of your own experience with kids? It seems to me that kids today are immersed in situations where there are winners and losers.

[MysticMichael]

Originally Posted by SolarMan

These drugs don't make the cashier at walmart any more friendly, but they could send him into homocidal rage.

Hey, if I had to work at Walmart, I'd be halfway there already...

MM

[MysticMichael]

Originally Posted by Relic

Well...in theory if everyone had a gun, the problem would kinda sorta work itself out in time. Just my opinion is all.

Meaning that one-half of the population would eventually gun down the other half? And that would accomplish precisely what then?

Originally Posted by Relic

Frankly, I'd rather there be more attention paid to mental health issues

Me too. But not as a substitute for more attention being paid to responsible, reasonable gun reform policy.

MM

[LiquidMidnight]

Originally Posted by Datsgor

It's clearly a symptom of the "nobody is a loser" and "we don't keep score" and "everybody is a winner here" mentality that these kids have been brainwashed with. The educators think they know how to make sure nobody's feelings get hurt. Everybody gets a fair turn they say...but what they don't know, is that when these kids get out into the "real" world and start getting treated like "real" people treat each other....they don't know how to handle it. So they lose it and lash out. It's only going to get worse, because we have a couple of generations of these "protected" children to go through.

[SBsoundguy]

I found this on another forum and I agree with Roger Ebert.

http://rogerebert.suntimes.com/apps/...311070301/1023

"Let me tell you a story. The day after Columbine, I was interviewed for the Tom Brokaw news program. The reporter had been assigned a theory and was seeking sound bites to support it. "Wouldn't you say," she asked, "that killings like this are influenced by violent movies?" No, I said, I wouldn't say that. "But what about 'Basketball Diaries'?" she asked. "Doesn't that have a scene of a boy walking into a school with a machine gun?" The obscure 1995 Leonardo Di Caprio movie did indeed have a brief fantasy scene of that nature, I said, but the movie failed at the box office (it grossed only $2.5 million), and it's unlikely the Columbine killers saw it.

The reporter looked disappointed, so I offered her my theory. "Events like this," I said, "if they are influenced by anything, are influenced by news programs like your own. When an unbalanced kid walks into a school and starts shooting, it becomes a major media event. Cable news drops ordinary programming and goes around the clock with it. The story is assigned a logo and a theme song; these two kids were packaged as the Trench Coat Mafia. The message is clear to other disturbed kids around the country: If I shoot up my school, I can be famous. The TV will talk about nothing else but me. Experts will try to figure out what I was thinking. The kids and teachers at school will see they shouldn't have messed with me. I'll go out in a blaze of glory."

[1958Bassman]

Originally Posted by MuinXing

Society has become more detached and in personal. It's no surprise, in japan they have high rates of suicide among teens that are isolated, in america's gun culture mass killing are the norm.

The suicide rate among Japanese teens is also tied to competition related to getting the best grades and getting into the best schools.

The comment I read about yesterday had to do with family members saying that this kid was definitely not right.

I think it's time to hold families responsible when they see a problem and do nothing about it. I don't mean they should haul off the kids when they can't be disciplined, but when there's strong evidence that someone will lose it in a big way, they need to be stopped.

It boils down to a lack of involvement by the family and parents. It sounds like this kid saw his mom caring more for the other kids than him. It's about perception and the inability to separate fact from fiction.

[1958Bassman]

Originally Posted by Relic

Well...in theory if everyone had a gun, the problem would kinda sorta work itself out in time. Just my opinion is all.

Frankly, I'd rather there be more attention paid to mental health issues

I think part of the problem is that mental health problems come with so much stigma that people will do anything to avoid being labeled "has mental issues", or having family members with this label. Insurance companies don't want to cover them because the care needed is endless.

WRT "If everyone had a gun"- the estimate I saw Thursday is that the US already has over 250 Million guns. That's as many guns as cars. Japan was right, during WWII- at this point, we have more guns than many countries have people. This kid took this gun- it was his mother's, apparently. It wasn't secure and that's a problem.

[1958Bassman]

Originally Posted by Makatak

" Only in America " ??

OK, but how do you explain the guy who killed 35 in Nowray, Sweden, or wherever?

Here's a list- it's NOT all here-
http://www.swedishwire.com/nordic/10...ings-full-list

[Relic]

Originally Posted by MysticMichael

Meaning that one-half of the population would eventually gun down the other half? And that would accomplish precisely what then?

No, more along the lines where eventually it would reach some sort of equilibrium. Ala a Cold War/mutual destruction type of scenario after a period of weeding out those who have less self control. In theory at least.
But with that said, it's not something that I'd personally like to see. It would suck having to live in a world like that.

Originally Posted by MysticMichael

Me too. But not as a substitute for more attention being paid to responsible, reasonable gun reform policy.

MM

I agree.

IMO A combined thought out approach is always better than a singular emotionally-driven approach.

[Relic]

Originally Posted by 1958Bassman

I think part of the problem is that mental health problems come with so much stigma that people will do anything to avoid being labeled "has mental issues", or having family members with this label. Insurance companies don't want to cover them because the care needed is endless.

WRT "If everyone had a gun"- the estimate I saw Thursday is that the US already has over 250 Million guns. That's as many guns as cars. Japan was right, during WWII- at this point, we have more guns than many countries have people. This kid took this gun- it was his mother's, apparently. It wasn't secure and that's a problem.

And that's a part that I cannot argue with. The anti-gun folks make a damn good point - if she didn't have those guns, he may not have done this. But... making something illegal, banning it, etc does not suddenly make it unavailable even to a mildly determined person. Someone who's willing to break the law by stealing a gun(s), killing their own mother, taking that gun(s) to a gun-free school zone, using it to murder innocents, is so obviously not a person concerned with the law that it's silly for me to even point that out.
I don't know guys.. I don't know the answer.
My thought process is that it's not the guns, it's more a matter of mental health. And I think that if there's ANY answer here, any way to prevent this from happening again (which I doubt) it's going to be a solution with many facets, not just one.

[i_got_a_mohawk]

Originally Posted by 1958Bassman

OK, but how do you explain the guy who killed 35 in Nowray, Sweden, or wherever?

Here's a list- it's NOT all here-
http://www.swedishwire.com/nordic/10...ings-full-list

Norway, 77 killed IIRC.

"or wherever" indeed

It's certainly a bigger issue in the US than in most of the developed world.

[SolarMan]

These mass-murder and then suicide killers are on the rise. Prozac came out in December 1987.

It isn't the media - crimes on this scale have commanded the airways since live TV was invented. What you don't see Nationally is when a kid with a serotonin soaked brain just kills his best friend or only 1 teacher, or maybe blew his brains out in front of his classmates.

There are very few of these mass-murderer then suicide killers that are NOT on these drugs.

A brain revved up on serotonin is an alpha-oriented brain. A leader. Not a follower. It is capable of amazing things, both wonderful and horrible.

Just google "mass murderer prozac" - and look at what you get. This is not a theory, it is for real.

If you want to understand this a little better, watch this video:

http://www.dailypaul.com/246031/vide...ris-connection

The media want's to talk guns instead of the real problem here.

I think we need to talk about the real problem.

And, I guarantee we find out this punk was on an SSRI, but you won't hear it on National TV - that is for sure!

[1958Bassman]

Originally Posted by Relic

And that's a part that I cannot argue with. The anti-gun folks make a damn good point - if she didn't have those guns, he may not have done this. But... making something illegal, banning it, etc does not suddenly make it unavailable even to a mildly determined person. Someone who's willing to break the law by stealing a gun(s), killing their own mother, taking that gun(s) to a gun-free school zone, using it to murder innocents, is so obviously not a person concerned with the law that it's silly for me to even point that out.
I don't know guys.. I don't know the answer.
My thought process is that it's not the guns, it's more a matter of mental health. And I think that if there's ANY answer here, any way to prevent this from happening again (which I doubt) it's going to be a solution with many facets, not just one.

The problem with the "Mutually-assured self-destruction' idea is that it never accounts for the crazy emmer-effers who don't care if they die. It's worse when it's a whole group.

I have been looking at guns for target shooting and home protection. I'm not just leaping into this on a whim- I take it very seriously but the gun control debate needs two sides to look at it objectively if this problem is to be solved. A) making it hard to buy guns legally makes no difference to those who will use them in the commission of a crime or who don't have a problem buying one without going through the proscribed method. B) telling felons they can't possess a gun does nothing to help- they already proved they can't make good decisions. C) The two day waiting period, also called a "cooling down period", is in place for the reason that's clear, when the latter phrase is used but for some, like the kid yesterday, two days means nothing. He should never have been able to put his hands on this gun. D) As much as I don't want more regulation of our ability to protect ourselves, I think it should be more difficult for people to sell a gun "person to person". It may have been bought legally when it was new, but everyone knows someone who's not the model "law-abiding citizen" we all hear about and it wouldn't take long for a gun to be sold only a couple of times before it ends up in the hands of a killer. Also, guns are stolen all the time.