Woman Profiled on 9/11

[Dr. Cheese]

Some real Shock and Awe: Racially profiled and cuffed in Detroit | Stories from the Heartland



http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/44501310...ity/?GT1=43001

[i_got_a_mohawk]

If that's all true, it's pretty disgusting.

Hope you guys enjoy those "freedoms" that us "poor" euro's are missing out on . . .

[Jazz Ad]

Terrorists won.

[i_got_a_mohawk]

Originally Posted by Jazz Ad

Terrorists won.

With the attitudes displayed by these authorities.

+1

[Munjibunga]

Before I knew it, about 10 cops, some in what looked like military fatigues, were running toward the plane carrying the biggest machine guns I have ever seen–bigger than what the guards carry at French train stations.

First, armed security at European airports is far more prevalent than what you'll see in the U.S. In the last 15 months, I've been through San Diego, Detroit, Atlanta, Kennedy, Heathrow, Paris, Madrid, Dublin and Shannon. The security procedures in Europe are far more thorough than in any of the U.S. airports, including taking photographs of you at check-in, and comparing them at the security checkpoint. You won't see any machine guns in U.S. train stations either.

OK, back on topic. What happened to the woman is a real bummer, and it really sucked to be her. But what if one of the men she was sitting next to really was a security threat? What should they have done with her? Sorry for my non-PC perspective, but they did exactly what I would want them to do: find out what's up. It is unfortunate for American citizens of Middle-Eastern descent but, despite the government's insistence that they don't profile, they do profile and they will keep profiling. I don't necessarily have a problem with that, given the demographic of certain groups of people who have vowed to kill others who do not share their beliefs.

[i_got_a_mohawk]

Going into San Diego I had to have my picture taken and fingerprints scanned plus I got to go through one of those funky x-ray backscatter devices (they wouldn't give me a copy of the picture ). Also, the guys who were checking our train tickets in the US, had guns .

PS - White folks can be Muslims too.

[Jazz Ad]

Originally Posted by Munjibunga

First, armed security at European airports is far more prevalent than what you'll see in the U.S. In the last 15 months, I've been through San Diego, Detroit, Atlanta, Kennedy, Heathrow, Paris, Madrid, Dublin and Shannon. The security procedures in Europe are far more thorough than in any of the U.S. airports, including taking photographs of you at check-in, and comparing them at the security checkpoint. You won't see any machine guns in U.S. train stations either.

The only reason you don't see men in arms in US airports or stations is because US Army can't operate on your soil. It isn't a disturbance to anyone and they are efficient at keeping things under control.

Security in Europe is tighter -it always has been, terrorism has been a threat for decades around here- but the way USA enforce it is way more intrusive and disturbing to the traveler. This too always has been, even before 9/11.

Any young European will tell you that when first travelling to USA they shat their pants when arriving at Kennedy. Authorities there are firm, rude and unwelcoming.
For example, I never heard about a cavity search happening in European airport. It is a completely useless and truamatizing procedure that can easily be avoided by x-ray scanning, which is available in all airports.

[Munjibunga]

Originally Posted by i_got_a_mohawk

Going into San Diego I had to have my picture taken and fingerprints scanned plus I got to go through one of those funky x-ray backscatter devices (they wouldn't give me a copy of the picture ). Also, the guys who were checking our train tickets in the US, had guns .

PS - White folks can be Muslims too.

Strange. All of my trips originate in San Diego (when I'm not at Groom), and I've never had my picture taken or fingerprints taken there. I've never had my ticket checked on a train, here or in Europe.

Did I say Muslims?

[Jazz Ad]

Originally Posted by i_got_a_mohawk

PS - White folks can be Muslims too.

And Christians can be terrorists. Profiling is useless.

[Munjibunga]

Originally Posted by Jazz Ad

And Christians can be terrorists. Profiling is useless.

True, but check the percentages. And I didn't mean to imply that all members of any religious group have a proclivity toward terrorism.

[Munjibunga]

Originally Posted by Jazz Ad

The only reason you don't see men in arms in US airports or stations is because US Army can't operate on your soil. It isn't a disturbance to anyone and they are efficient at keeping things under control.

Security in Europe is tighter -it always has been, terrorism has been a threat for decades around here- but the way USA enforce it is way more intrusive and disturbing to the traveler. This too always has been, even before 9/11.

Any young European will tell you that when first travelling to USA they shat their pants when arriving at Kennedy. Authorities there are firm, rude and unwelcoming.
For example, I never heard about a cavity search happening in European airport. It is a completely useless and truamatizing procedure that can easily be avoided by x-ray scanning, which is available in all airports.

Nah. Maybe it's just that we don't think we need machine guns to "keep things under control." Ultimately, security at any airport is annoying. And your young European friends could say the same thing about the servers in many New York delis. It's New York.

When I was leaving Moscow in 1990, they had a curtained-off area where many passengers were routinely strip-searched. This was long before 9/11. My group escaped that treatment, fortunately (we were escorted semi-dignitaries).

[i_got_a_mohawk]

Originally Posted by Munjibunga

Strange. All of my trips originate in San Diego (when I'm not at Groom), and I've never had my picture taken or fingerprints taken there. I've never had my ticket checked on a train, here or in Europe.

Did I say Muslims?

I did notice American Citizens got through a separate line to the rest of us, so maybe you don't need to go through it. But we had to go through the card that we needed to fill out, have our fingerprints scanned and pictures taken. When leaving had the x-ray backscatter (people being picked at random to go through that instead of the standard metal detector.

We had tickets checked a couple times on the tram as well as when I got the Coaster from Encinitas to San Diego.


You strongly implied it, at the very least it's a lingering fear of people who are different:

Originally Posted by Munjibunga

It is unfortunate for American citizens of Middle-Eastern descent but, despite the government's insistence that they don't profile, they do profile and they will keep profiling. I don't necessarily have a problem with that, given the demographic of certain groups of people who have vowed to kill others who do not share their beliefs.

Originally Posted by Jazz Ad

And Christians can be terrorists. Profiling is useless.

Exactly, I know the UK has had more terrorist incidents caused by those of christian faith than any other.

Originally Posted by Munjibunga

When I was leaving Moscow in 1990, they had a curtained-off area where many passengers were routinely strip-searched. This was long before 9/11. My group escaped that treatment, fortunately (we were escorted semi-dignitaries).

I don't think Russia has ever been a major boaster of personal freedoms

[colcifer]

Why didn't they just contact the flight's air marshal?

[Munjibunga]

Originally Posted by i_got_a_mohawk

Exactly, I know the UK has had more terrorist incidents caused by those of christian faith than any other.

Well, that's because you've got that Northern Ireland situation going on. I don't believe the same could be said for the rest of Europe, except the recent Norwegian atrocity.

[Munjibunga]

Originally Posted by i_got_a_mohawk

I don't think Russia has ever been a major boaster of personal freedoms

What's interesting is that that time in Russia was the dawning of glasnost. We stood in the middle of Red Square at midnight chatting with Russian citizens. Five years earlier, we all would have ended up in jail for that offense. At that time there were still some sucky aspects of Russia but, based on conversations with friends who have been there recently, it sucks less now.

[metallicafan18]

I don't mean to sound racist, but if I was traveling on a plane of the 10 year anniversary of 9/11 and I saw two Middle-Eastern men using the bathroom in succession, I would be a little uneasy too.

[colcifer]

That does sound a little racist.

[1958Bassman]

Originally Posted by Jazz Ad

And Christians can be terrorists. Profiling is useless.

Useless? really? It's actually a very effective tool. If it was useless, they wouldn't do it at all.

[Bloodhammer]

"Those who would give up Essential Liberty to purchase a little Temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety."

-Benjamin Franklin

[colcifer]

Originally Posted by 1958Bassman

Useless? really? It's actually a very effective tool. If it was useless, they wouldn't do it at all.

What makes it effective? Please don't reference Israel; their security needs are irrelevant to ours as pertinent to profiling.