Crusty Jazzers

drew_bassmore · #1 10-24-2009, 05:41 PM

This seemed like a miscellaneous observation:

Being relatively new to Double Bass and Jazz studies, I learn a lot from the seasoned professionals and working (full or part-time) players on these discussion boards.

The conversations on TBDB are generally thought provoking, intelligent and valuable from my perspective. I even appreciate some occasional crustiness from those with the life experience (especially from a jazz background) that lends authenticity to the topics.

So I would like to sing my praises for the community that resides here.

JohnZ (fellow TBDB contributor) really demonstrated my points above (minus the crustiness).

We both live in the SF Bay Area (something I was able to discern from his profile). When I noticed in one of the discussion threads that he had both an AI Clarus and an EA Doubler, I saw an unusual opportunity to contact him for the privilege of performing a side-by-side sound test of his amps. I was interested in this because I was considering the AI amp, and already own a Micro 300.

In any case, he graciously agreed to connect. He is a good player and a very bright mind. I am happy to have made his acquaintance and look forward to seeing him perform around the area.

The best part was when his wife came home and asked how we met. After telling her she exclaimed, “You guys met on the internet?!”

In reply, “Well it’s not as if we are going to move in together now or something.”

drew_bassmore · #2 10-24-2009, 05:44 PM

Maybe I should have put this in Off-Topic. My apologies.

Marcus Johnson · #3 10-24-2009, 06:31 PM

Andrew..... as a guy who may (proudly) wear a bit of a crust

, let me say that it works both ways. I get a lot out of interacting with people who are a little closer to the beginning of the journey, at least as much as I do from learning from the masters who've gone before. It's one of the real fringe benefits of teaching.

The internet has really changed how people meet. I've made some lifelong friends on this very site. It's no more or less valid than any other form of communication.... it just widens the playground by quite a bit. It's a lot easier to be a global citizen than it used to be, and I dig that aspect of it. At the same time, you sometimes find someone right in your own back yard that you might have missed otherwise.

Uncletoad · #4 10-24-2009, 06:40 PM

I'd like you to write your opinions on the two amps for us. I'm curious as to the similarities and differences.

drew_bassmore · #5 10-24-2009, 07:14 PM

The amp experience:

Let me qualify, I have had little jazz performance experience. I have brought the DB out on occasional stripped down acoustic pop settings (even those require quite a bit of volume). When I have played standards with folks, it has been in a purely acoustic environment.

My bass is a fully carved unnamed Hungarian with Evah Weichs (thanks to Marcus for his extensive writings on these strings) and a Realist pickup. I have two Wizzy 10’s for when I need more volume, but anticipate most future settings to only require one.

I have owned a Micro 300 (first run) that had the infamous buzzing associated with an initial batch. As an aside, EA was great in correcting the problem. They took the amp back and changed the circuit that was the culprit and sent it back out to me with an iAmp 800 Bag- gratis. I admit however, that I didn’t know better to realize that it still had a problem some months later, and they once again fixed the problem and it has sounded great ever since (the noise floor is virtually silent).

Micro 300:
As the EA amps seem to be known for, they are very transparent sounding. I felt that I was getting every bit of the pickup with my bass, and not a lot, if any coloring. I pulled the gain back to 9 O’clock, with Master at 11 O’clock.

On the flat settings, it accentuated the mids quite a bit. This might be good in a situation where I am battling volume, but I don’t like the sound on its own. I pulled the mids to the range of 9 O’clock. Backed off on the Lows to 11 O’clock, and left the Highs at 12.

That setting was the closest I’ve gotten to the “acoustic” sound of the bass. I feel that this will be a good setting for quiet intimate occasions and ensembles.

If I want to get more volume, I am now sold on the need for a HPF with this amp.

(The Doubler seemed to have similar tonal characteristics to the above, but it does have the Phase and HP filters already built in. It touts more power than the Micro 300 of course. Additionally, I perceived a high frequency pitch coming through the speaker occasionally. It could have had something to do with the fan, but I couldn’t say for sure.)

AI Clarus 1:
Gain and Master set virtually identical above. The flat settings were a little more abrasive with the mids than the EA.

Right off the bat, I thought it colored the sound slightly. After dialing it in with Lows at 11 O’clock, Mids 11 O’clock, and Highs 12, I got a nice “round” sound in the first few positions. There seemed to be a subtle low-mid presence as compared to the EA. I could get more growl if I wanted. All in all, it felt as if I was getting more sound pressure- like it was throwing more out into the room. With that, I could see cutting through in a full on Hard Bop or Latin band setting being a good use for me with the setup.

I am considering blending a mic in the future.

Ultimately, I like both amps, and have acquired an AI Clarus 1, Series III. I will be able to use both dependent on the situation in my ensembles at school, and other opportunities.

JohnZ can possibly weigh in on his impressions as well, with a bit more of a refined ear. Or one can go to : New amp time (ai or ea) Post #4 for his original review.

**Chris Fitzgerald** · #6 10-25-2009, 09:22 AM

Moved to OT by request. I'd like to weigh in, but life is pulling me in another direction, so.... subscribed!

hdiddy · #7 10-25-2009, 09:37 AM

Just an aside:
TBDB has been a life changer for me. BIGGUS, DURRL, UNCA P, ISHOTTHESHERRY, TOAD, etc...

If it weren't for you fools I probably would not have gotten into DB. And if it weren't for you fools I certainly wouldn't have the bass now. DB is now one of the 3 things I live for. And I never even met these dudes (at least not yet).

I hate you all.

/rass hattur speak

Paul Warburton · #8 10-25-2009, 10:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hdiddy

Just an aside:
TBDB has been a life changer for me. BIGGUS, DURRL, UNCA P, ISHOTTHESHERRY, TOAD, etc...

If it weren't for you fools I probably would not have gotten into DB. And if it weren't for you fools I certainly wouldn't have the bass now. DB is now one of the 3 things I live for. And I never even met these dudes (at least not yet).

I hate you all.

/rass hattur speak

I jusy weighed in on 3 threads where some of us are being crucified.(to put it mildly).
This came as a welcome change.
Thanks, Huy.

drew_bassmore · #9 10-25-2009, 10:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hdiddy

Just an aside:
TBDB has been a life changer for me. BIGGUS, DURRL, UNCA P, ISHOTTHESHERRY, TOAD, etc...

What Huy refers to is exactly where I am coming from. Along with my teacher Glenn Richman, I've received some great guidance and perspective from the likes of Paul W., Phil M., Sam S., Marcus J., Chris F., Marc P., Trey T., Ed F., Mike A., John G. and John A. (and more...)

I will be a better DB and Jazz player than I could've imagined as a result of their input (even if it can't come soon enough for my tastes).

There is an immense wealth of talent and experience with the likes above. I take pause to celebrate access to such fine individuals.

Some people may take exception to their humor, opinions, or pedagogical approach, but no one can deny that their work stands on it's own.

Jake deVilliers · #10 10-25-2009, 02:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by drew_bassmore

What Huy refers to is exactly where I am coming from. Along with my teacher Glenn Richman, I've received some great guidance and perspective from the likes of Paul W., Phil M., Sam S., Marcus J., Chris F., Marc P., Trey T., Ed F., Mike A., John G. and John A. (and more...)

I will be a better DB and Jazz player than I could've imagined as a result of their input (even if it can't come soon enough for my tastes).

There is an immense wealth of talent and experience with the likes above. I take pause to celebrate access to such fine individuals.

Some people may take exception to their humor, opinions, or pedagogical approach, but no one can deny that their work stands on it's own.

Very nice Andrew!

The guys here are an amazing resource. They are wise in many ways, some of which have to do with music and the double bass, and I've learned a lot from them.

One of their chief collective virtues is that they won't bullsh*t you. What you get is the truth - if it makes you uncomfortable, maybe you need to ask yourself some questions.

I'm looking forward to meeting more of these guys in person and buying them drinks!

Marcus Johnson · #11 10-25-2009, 04:24 PM

The other thing that sometimes happens here is that some of us who've been playing jazz for awhile lapse into the sort of bull****ing style of speaking that we're accustomed to on the bandstand. That may get misinterpreted on an internet forum. Some things that sound like out and out insults to the layperson are complements of the highest order to a crusty jazz guy. "Mother******" is a perfect example (sorry, mods, just making a point). Try walking into a cocktail party and calling the CEO that one! But on a bandstand, you say "Thanks, man."

I don't know if it carries over into other areas of music... I haven't seen much of it in pop bands or in orchestras. But for us, it's just part of the ritual, part of showing that, in addition to being able to play, we can also hang. It's hard for me to not be pretty jazz-centric at this point in my life and career. I really appreciate the input from all the classical, bluegrass, rockabilly, etc., folks here... helps to keep me aware of the bigger picture. Hopefully I haven't offended too many folks in the process.

fingers · #12 10-25-2009, 04:39 PM

Backatcha'll. Like Pee Dub points out it is nice when a thread this this pops up. I (and several of us) got attacked pretty good today. Sleeping fine though.

It's all about give and take. That's what makes a community like this function. The anarchy of the internet and all. I have learned so much and I hope I have helped some others learn. Like Marcus is saying there is a style of communication in on the bandstand, or in big cities, certain communities, even in certain ethnic groups (we always joke in my Italian family that any of us could have been lawyers) that might read a certain way on the interweb. I am never trying to disrespect anyone and for that matter you know an Italian is really mad when they stop busting your chops. Long live TBDB.

Marcus Johnson · #13 10-25-2009, 05:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fingers

I am never trying to disrespect anyone and for that matter you know an Italian is really mad when they stop busting your chops.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WxZyFNVBRJY

johnz · #14 10-25-2009, 06:22 PM

Hey Andrew! Excellent Thread!

I concur, TBDB has been invaluable to me too; and, thanks so much to all of you who take the time to give us your opinions, information and humor!!!!!!!!!!

I think Marcus' and Marc's points are particularly pertinent. I'd also add what seems to me to be an obvious but often overlooked point. The TBDB community has a history.

That history is important because it's sometimes necessary to provide the appropriate context to understand a post. Regardless of how well anyone writes, if you read enough posts, you get an idea of who they are. Conversely, if you don't have a sense of history you can really miss the point.

For example, I was just looking at the "Jazz Keys" thread and saw the heat the Marc took. I can't imagine that the folks dishing the criticism had read much (or any) of Marc's postings or they'd know better. He gave them two gems and got back a pile of fecal material. tsk tsk tsk! But, if that had the history...

Anyway, I think you all have comported yourselves admirably. And you all have my gratitude.

Marcus Johnson · #15 10-25-2009, 06:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by johnz

For example, I was just looking at the "Jazz Keys" thread and saw the heat the Marc took. I can't imagine that the folks dishing the criticism had read much (or any) of Marc's postings or they'd know better. He gave them two gems and got back a pile of fecal material. tsk tsk tsk! But, if that had the history...

Ehh... Marc's fine, I'd guess. It's just the weekend, and daycare's closed.

Some of these posters, though, remind me of that Robin Williams line from "Good Morning, Vietnam".. "You're in more dire need of a ******* than any white man in history".

Problem solved!

Uncletoad · #16 10-25-2009, 07:08 PM

Yea whatever. **** you people. Yer all a bunch a underemployed crusty muther****ers that need serious ass whippins. When will you fecal discards become real contributors to society?

If I didn't know better I'd think you were all ****ing asshats.

Treyzer · #17 10-25-2009, 07:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marcus Johnson

Ehh...that Robin Williams line from "Good Morning, Vietnam".. "You're in more dire need of a ******* than any white man in history" Problem solved!

Biggus,

Since you put it that way, I'm rethinking my whole approach to trolls. They are just very very very sexually frustrated

Seriously, this is a wonderful forum and the people who post here regularly and the people who value this site and come for conversation and information are quality people. Not only do many have great musical skills but also there is great insight, humor and fun on this site.

In Hawaii, those people who are not native born, like me and Marcus, if not already akami (smart, and/or understanding), learn to act like respectful guests. This is considered part of the true aloha spirit. It's not that hard. Most of us learned this at home when we were small children. Being respectful shows grace and class. It's really no different out here in cyberspace; certainly no different on the TBDB site. You come in here with a good attitude and you'll have a great time; come in here with a chip on your shoulder and it will usually go down hill fast.

I feel that I've met some wonderful guys who happen to be bass players. I've learned so much and gained lots of insight on many facets of music and musicianship. I look forward to actually meeting more TBDB'ers in the coming years. Hopefully, I've contributed in a positive manner when it was appropriate or I had something to offer.

All The Best Guys!

T

Marcus Johnson · #18 10-25-2009, 07:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Treyzer

In Hawaii, those people who are not native born, like me and Marcus, if not already akami (smart, and/or understanding), learn to act like respectful guests. This is considered part of the true aloha spirit.

Dude... quit fartin' rainbows.... PW's head WILL explode.

Treyzer · #19 10-25-2009, 07:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marcus Johnson

Dude... quit fartin' rainbows.... PW's head WILL explode.

Bet it's REALLY COLD in Denver this time of year, eh Marcus?

Marcus Johnson · #20 10-25-2009, 07:39 PM

I guess. Still love to see PEE strollin' down one of our beaches someday. I'm not holding my breath.