Dress "CASUAL"?!

[pdbass]

I'm getting really tired of this.

Somebody called me for a last-minute gig. Late morning, outdoors. "What's the dress?" I asked. "CASUAL". So, I show up in a polo shirt, jeans, sneakers. I planned on going to the movies afterwards, and that's would I would've casually worn. So, I get there and everybody else in the band is wearing slacks, or all black, or bringing nice shirts to change into--and definitely no sneakers. I looked like an idiot up there--somebody forgot to tell the bass player what to wear!

Of course, I'm sure that had I worn khakis and a nice shirt, everyone else would've been in shorts. That's the way it seems to happen, but I digress. . .

Anybody else sick of this? It seems as though one man's casual is another man's "business casual" is another man's "light dressy". I even got a "smart casual" on a gig a couple of weeks ago. This sh*t is driving me CRAZY. There should be some kind of code somewhere, or maybe a definition of the word CASUAL posted somewhere that all musicians have to read--so that when they say the dress is "casual" they all mean the same thing!

Of course, the guys on the gig were entirely cool--and it really didn't matter how I was dressed, but this kind of thing will rear its ugly head now and then I'm starting to think that when someone says CASUAL (in Pittsburgh) it means
a) definitely don't wear sneakers and
b) try not to wear jeans, but if you have to wear jeans, wear them in a dressy sort of way with nice shoes and a dress shirt

. . . cause that's what I wear when I'm sitting around watching TV at home

Anyone else have experiences like this? Love to hear about it!

[TomSauter]

To me casual means you don't have to wear a jacket or tie, but you probably shouldn't wear jeans. 'Nice casual' might mean all black or slacks and a nice dress shirt. It's probably better to err on the side of caution. I used to live in Knoxville, TN, and there it was common to wear jeans and tennis shoes to a gig, so I guess it changes a little regionally.

[Aaron Cohn]

I tend to interpret casual in different ways depending on the gig. If it's a private party that pays well, I'll try to look reasonably neat. A bar gig, on the other hand...

[Uncletoad]

I don't think you can put the blame on somebody else on this one. I'll also bet you'll never be unclear about dress on a gig again. One time embarrassment would be enough for me.

Overall I think American fashion for men is pathetic and has gotten worse and worse over the last 20 years. For performers on stage I think dressing is even more important no matter what the level of casual on the date. People are looking at us for entertainment. I think its important to have the respect of your audience enough to look like you know you'll be stared at on a stage prior to stepping up on it. I always wear a prepared look even playing at a backyard BBQ.

If you look like you could step right off stage and sit in a dark movie theater indistinguishable from the fellow next to you who just rolled out of bed then you aren't ready to be on stage. Even if that stage is the back of a pickup truck or a street corner.

Tux gigs aside, my rule of thumb is to alway dress at least one tic better than I think the crowd will be, and overall much better than I think I need to. I can always dress down after I get to a gig but I can't go up.

You can dress up jeans but not tennis shoes. I never ever wear them to a gig ever. Dress shoes, dress loafers or dress boots at the very least for me, even with jeans. I have worn jeans with good looking dress shoes and a sportcoat with a pocket square over a dressy black T shirt to gigs and got away with casual with panache. I can loose the coat and untuck the shirt if somebody insists or it's just too hot.

Most summer casual gigs outside in the searing heat I'll wear some dressy or interesting shirt untucked over dress slacks and some fabulous shoes. Even rock gigs in dumpy bars get some kind of prepared look.

I love mixing dress clothes and casual clothes for effect. Starched dress shirt and jeans. Dress pants and interesting dressy T shirts. Pocket squares and no tie. Sport Coat, pocket square, T shirt and dress pants. Dressing in this manner allows me to mix in social situations up or down as I move about town and always look appropriate.

Dressing for gigs requires respect for the audience and one's self, knowing you are a professional paid performer who has polished their skills and considered their presentation right down to the little accessories like belts shoes and watches.

The audience sees EVERYTHING and we owe them the respect that we know it.

[anon_6j591b0]

Originally Posted by Uncletoad

Dressing for gigs requires respect for the audience and one's self, knowing you are a professional paid performer who has polished their skills and considered their presentation right down to the little accessories like belts shoes and watches.

The audience sees EVERYTHING and we owe them the respect that we know it.

Especially the shoes. Something I read in a Barney Kessel interview thirty years ago has always stayed with me: When you're up on a stage always wear nice shoes because your shoes are right at the eye level of the audience.

And when in doubt WEAR BLACK! Stage lighting is one of my "day" jobs and lemme tell ya if you want to upstage the leader and soloists wearing a white shirt is even better than playing busy all night. The tin ears in the audience won't notice that you're wanking but everyone notices a white shirt even in low light. Here's a pic of the Kurt Rosenwinkle Quintet where the right guy is wearing light colours and (with a little help from me) is the one standing out.

[Marc Piane]

Personally I NEVER wear jeans or gym shoes to a paying gig unless the leader says specifically that I should. There was a jazz great (Art Blakey I think) that said "You should know right away who the band is because they are the best dressed guys in the club".

[Chris Fitzgerald]

Here in the 'Ville there's a phrase called "jazz casual" which describes looking nice without having to wear a jacket and tie. Also agreed about the dark colors thing.

[Marc Piane]

The phrase I hear a bunch here in Chitown is "jazz cool".

[pdbass]

I expected to get these kind of replies--the kind that say "you should always OVERdress for the gig"--but it's not about that at all. For me, playing in an ensemble means be able to take a step back and become part of a group. Maybe it's the nature of the instrument, but I don't really want to attract any extra attention--whether I'm underdressed or overdressed. And it happens, too. Last Monday I showed up at a gig where I could "wear what I wanted", so I went with a hip, black dress shirt, jeans, and dress shoes. Everybody else had on sneaks, t-shirts, etc. I stood out a little. Until I reach the point in therapy where it doesn't bother me anymore, it still bothers me a little.

I'm not really new to this. When I toured with Maynard Ferguson, we all wore black pants and the same black t-shirt. When I toured with Stanley Turrentine, it was dressy slacks, dress shirt, optional jacket. I understand when someone 50+ calls me, thier casual might mean just don't wear a jacket. But often times I might get called for a gig by someone under 30--and their casual might mean (to my 33-year old ears) CASUAL--whatever you're wearing that day--wear it. Also, the situation might dictate what to wear. As some of you have said, I think it's always best to ask and ask again. For someone like me, who plays a variety of gigs--shows, festivals, clubs, whatever--it's best to ask.

Incidentally, I'm getting TOTALLY different responses to this question over on the BG off-topic board. Check it out.

[ZuluFunk]

This is casual

[Uncletoad]

HA! Exactly.

[Eublet]

Casual is never, ever...jeans. If someone tells you casual and they mean jeans, then they are the ones who are wrong, and you should take a moment to kindly correct them. It's the only way to stop this madness.

Casual is khakis and a polo shirt, a short sleaved button down or perhaps nice square-bottomed shirt like a Tommy Bahama. Shoes is harder. That might mean loafers in many parts of the country, but where I live a nice pair of sandals or leather flops are much more common.

Business casual is a suit without the coat and tie. Dress shoes, no loafers or those tacky foam-bottomed Rockports. Business casual is not casual either.

[Marc Piane]

I see what you are saying Paul. It makes a big difference to me if it is a jobbing thing or a bar/club. If I am playing with cats that I don't know very well I always try to be the best dressed of the lot. I look at it as part of showing that you really care about a gig and appreciate the call.

In a group it is different - I agree. I am always impressed by bands that look together. That said I still never wear jeans to a gig unless the leader specifically says to do so. I live by the statement that you should always be one notch above the audience.

I also don't like it when I go to see a band and they are in jeans and a t-shirt (a slayer shirt).

[Marcus Johnson]

+1

I try to do a little more on the dressy side. I just feel better that way in public. On the other hand, if I'm at Lowes or Home Depot, all bets are off!

I take it up a notch when I go to Honolulu, and another notch or two if I'm going to LA, SF, NY, etc. I try to remember that I'm the CEO of a small (one-man) business. I don't remember ever getting guff for being overdressed.

Anyway... blame it all on Pat Metheny. I used to see him at shows looking like he showed up to fix my refrigerator.

[anon_6j591b0]

Originally Posted by pdbass

Everybody else had on sneaks, t-shirts, etc. I stood out a little. Until I reach the point in therapy where it doesn't bother me anymore, it still bothers me a little.

You're seeing a therapist over this?
Save yer money, here's the solution:
Super Casual
under
"Jazz" Casual
under
A Very Nice Suit & Tie
That way you can show up looking ready to play with The Jazz Messengers and "Super Man" down from there as necessary. You're an entertainer, right? Think of how entertaining it would be to watch someone tear off a Brooks Bros suit, then a dress shirt and Dockers to get to the t-shirt and jeans. I'd pay a cover and a two drink min just to see that.

[Chris Fitzgerald]

Originally Posted by ZuluFunk

This is casual

Booyah!

I'm not sure what the hell that is, but whatever it is, "casual" isn't the first word to come to mind...

[Marcus Johnson]

I like those pants. My boys would be downright comfy in those.

Whoops... did I say that out loud?

[pdbass]

C'mon guys!

That's how any 20 year old. . . er

30 year old. . . I mean

40 year old . . . . ur, uh

50 year old dresses casually!!!

People, this really seems to be an age/situation thing. Here's what I already knew (wonderfully reiterated by my fellow TB'ers):

When in ROME. . . . wear what the freakin Romans are wearing!

Regarding the above picture: How would I feel if I showed up for a gig and everybody else in the band was dressed in a vest like THAT?!

relieved

It's an age thing, guys. I'm sure if I was playing a "casual" gig in 1965, yadda, yadda, yadda. On my casual 33-year-old body is jeans and a t-shirt, complimented with some lovely Reeboks.

Are there any 30-year-olds reading this that actually casually dress like that? I'd love to hear from them.

[Eublet]

I'm 35. I'm not arguing about style or how someone should dress. I'm arguing for what the definition of "casual" dress really means. If someone says casual and you wear jeans, one of you is wrong.

When I dress casual, I were jeans or shorts. That's a slang term to mean be comfortable in what you want to wear. When someone says an event is "casual dress", it does not mean jeans or shorts. That means look good but be comfortable.

And the guy's attire above is NOT casual dress, although it might be acceptable since he's the entertainment at a casual dress event. He's wearing showman attire, but you wouldn't show up as a guest dressed like that. Hopefully anyway.

[Uncletoad]

They are very excellent trousers, and shirt for that matter.

The vest is over the top of course but it was a flashy gig. Everyone was over the top. I've got a closet full of over the top stage clothes.

I wouldn't call that casual pdbass those guys are teasing my fat old ass.

But kill the vest and loose the tie and it's casual.

Jeans and T shirts and sneakers aren't casual gig clothes to me, they are kicking around the house clothes. It doesn't surprise me that the slab guys don't look at this the same. I'll bet their playing incomes show it too.

I suppose there are age differences with these things but my cranky old ass thinks there should be a better standards no matter what age. Like people should dress for church, and if they are on TV. Don't get me started again...

Oh and the hair and beard are gone now. Cut short with just a goatee left. Finally coming to terms with the bald guy thing.