Guitar: Did Wes Montgomery 'double-thumb'?

[peteroberts]

Originally Posted by PETERROBERTTAIL

hey man, don't you try and Fuqua me!

I gotta start looking for some Wes Montgomery videos!

[Paul Warburton]

I once did a concert with Johnny Smith and Chet Atkins...
Chet didn't want the bass to play behind him! Just Jake Hanna playing brushes.

[hdiddy]

Originally Posted by peteroberts

I gotta start looking for some Wes Montgomery videos!

Pick them up at Stefan Grossman's site: www.guitarvideos.com. Wes is on "Legends of Jazz Guitar Vol.1" and there's quite alot of footage. Do thyself a favor and pick up Vol. 3 to see Jim Hall play with Art Farmer. You won't be disappointed!

[Marcus Johnson]

Originally Posted by hdiddy

Wes did use upstrokes, but only for comping. All soloing are downstrokes (no double thumb). Check it out.

http://www.duke.edu/~mjs4/wes/westech.htm

Wow. That makes him all the more amazing.

Great link, HEDOESKNOWDIDDLY, thanks for that one.

Sometime, I'd like to show a clip of my friend Shiro, who I mentioned before. Herbie Hancock called him "the only guy in Japan who can swing"; not true, but good press!

He does a lot of downstrokes, but he also does some double thumb things that are fun to watch and really great to hear. He told me once that the pick feels like a condom to him, and just gets in the way of feeling the fingers on the wires. Great F***in' musician. You should hear him play piano, probably his main axe. He once played drums with Freddie Hubbard when he came through, and kicked a$$. I've also heard him play soprano sax, flute, vibes, all great. One time, he was listening to me play bass, when I was in my Eddie Gomez period, and he suggested that I could try more legato phrasing and slides, and not enunciate every note. He played my bass, saying "y'know, kinda like this", and just ripped through some perfect Ray Brown stuff like it was nothing.

The guy's a freak from another planet.

[hdiddy]

Originally Posted by PUTTHEM PANTSON

Wow. That makes him all the more amazing.

Great link, HEDOESKNOWDIDDLY, thanks for that one.

NP. Yeah, reading all that again about Wes just makes me think seriously about developing a one-finger pizz approach (ala Old School). My middle finger just seems to not have that meaty tone I can get playing off the side of my index. But I'm sure it'll come with practice. Watching Arthur Harper in the DVD I mentioned earlier is pretty cool - all one finger soloing. Does anyone know anything about him? His technique seems pretty air-tight.

Sometime, I'd like to show a clip of my friend Shiro, who I mentioned before.

The guy's a freak from another planet.

Yeah that would be cool... or maybe not... my ego might not be able to handle it. :P I know it's a generalization but I think when a japanese person is talented, they're scary talented! EEEK!

[godoze]

I love Wes.

[Ed Fuqua]

Originally Posted by Marcus Johnson

One time, he was listening to me play bass, when I was in my Eddie Gomez period, and he suggested that I could try more legato phrasing and slides, and not enunciate every note. He played my bass, saying "y'know, kinda like this", and just ripped through some perfect Ray Brown stuff like it was nothing.
The guy's a freak from another planet.

Speaking of guys who play guitar and bass, anybody hear William Ash?

[hdiddy]

Wow, sounds like he's a cross between Wes & Pat Martino. His single note stuff is hella fast, and from the photos it looks like it's nothing but thumb too. I love that style of comping/octave playing. I wonder if he's double thumbing his single note lines, they're awfully fast and it sounds like they're all double notes. Ed, do you know?

[peteroberts]

that sounds pretty damn fast to be thumb using downstrokes only...

[Marcus Johnson]

I like Allan. I spent some time with him at a soundcheck, drinking beers and chatting, many years ago. What a nice, unassuming guy.

Of course, he then proceeded to blow the roof off the place.

[Marcus Johnson]

Yeah, it was just that trio when I saw him, no keys. Not really necessary!

He had the singer, Paul Williams (no, not that one ). On one tune, Allan was going for one of those stretched-out frogfinger chord voicings, and apparently the lowest note in the chord was an F#, from where I was sitting. Because he was busy playing the rest of the chord further up the neck, he couldn't reach the root. So he had Paul reach around from behind and finger the F#. Not showbiz or anything, just what needed to be done to get the music out. Wonderful guitar player.

[peteroberts]

Being that Allan Holdsworth is a friend of mine, I have to take exception to your listing of Eddie V., after all, he really only ripped Allan's style off. Ok, so Eddie used 2 hands to do what Allan could do with 1<g>, but the style came from Allan, IMO. The biggest difference between the 2 of them was that Allan would never, ever, sell out to commercial of anything

that was kind of my point; Allan didn't bring that stuff into the mainstream, Eddie did. I consider them pretty different although I do see similarities...Eddie doesn't generally go for the aforementioned 'frogfinger chord voicings' cuz they really just don't work in the style of Van Halen.

You guys that know Holdsworth, who were his influences? I love his work on Bruford's 'One of a Kind' and JLP's 'Enigmatic Ocean'.

[anonymous0726]

What does 'sell-out' really mean, anyhow?

[Don Higdon]

Originally Posted by peteroberts

Long live Wes!

so here is a side subject... how many influential guitarists have there been in the 1900's - 2000's?

I say, when it all boils down, distilled and all, there are really only four...that changed the guitar and the way people play it.

1. Charlie Christian
2. Wes Montgomery
3. Jimi Hendrix
4. Eddie Van Halen


I'm beginning to think Metheny and Scofield.

In view of your time frame, i.e. 1900 on, and since he was doing the Wes Montgomery octave stuff in 1932, I'd say Django Reinhardt deserves recognition.
As for Scofield, I think Vic Juris runs circles around him.