BDDI vs VT Bass comparison?

Wild_Cat · #1 02-21-2010, 12:55 PM

So I've been thinking of getting a SansAmp pedal to get some cranked SVT growl into my usually crystal-clear Little Mark Tube.

From the Youtube videos I've seen, both the BDDI and VT seem capable of producing the tone I seek: a light to medium prog-rock overdrive with plenty of warmth and low-end clarity. Think Justin Chancellor on Tool's "Vicarious", Mic Todd on Co&Ca's "Gravemakers & Gunslingers", Colin Edwin on Porcupine Tree's "Anesthesize", or at most a late John Entwistle live sound (should I require more distortion than that, I have a perfectly serviceable EHX Bass Big Muff which sounds awesome). Also, there's a ton of love for both pedals here.

It looked like both pedals could be made to sound the same, and that my choice would have to be done on non-sonic considerations (i.e. are the presence of a DI and programmable settings desirable enough for me to get the BDDI (especially since my LMT has a line out), or do I go for the 70-euro-cheaper VT?)... But then Tech21 unveiled the VT Bass Deluxe at NAMM, which is basically a VT in a BDDI Deluxe casing, matching it feature-for-feature (and, I assume, similarly-priced).

Clearly, I must have been wrong -- for both products to exist, they must be differences in sound between the two.

So, here's my question: what are these differences? What kind of sound can one get on a VT but not on a BDDI (or the other way around)?

**bass dan** · #2 02-21-2010, 12:57 PM

If you don't need the di go for the vt. The vt can do the bass driver sound and many more. the bddi is a one trick pony.

brandtb · #3 02-22-2010, 07:23 PM

Good question. I have a BDDI Deluxe on order and will compare it to the VT Deluxe when it comes out. Whichever I like better, I will keep. If I find that both give me sounds that the other can't...might end up holding on to both of them.

My guess is this: If the Ampeg sound is what you're looking for, the VT Bass should do the trick. If you're looking for a more generic tube-amp sound that may or may not have some more flexibility than the character pedals, then the BDDI may be the better choice. If you end up preferring the VT Bass sound, the VT Deluxe will be adding the DI.

From my observation, the character pedals have two things that set them apart: The Character knob that seems to change the base EQ structure for different models in the brand emulated (call it "their personality") and the fact that they each emulate speaker response that were typical to the brand -- American 8x10's vs. Alnico Bulldogs vs. Jensen 12", etc. That might limit the pedal, but if you're looking for "that sound" it may not matter.

Forgive me if I appear to be the "Minister In Charge of the Obvious". Good luck with whatever you end up with, and please do share your observations with the rest of us.

I'm hoping to be able to cop sounds reminiscent of Ampegs and Hiwatts with the BDDI. We'll see in the long run how exact I will want or need the amp modeling to be.

JimmyM · #4 02-22-2010, 09:47 PM

the new generation of character pedals will have a speaker simulator lift on them. the speaker sim is just eq that emulates the eq curve of the cabs. but i haven't heard one yet that doesn't work on bass. the hiwatt pedal should be especially amazing.

Mark Olson · #5 02-22-2010, 09:55 PM

With my not limited experience with them, I would compare them much how one would go about comparing stool to vomit.

JimmyM · #6 02-22-2010, 09:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mark Olson

With my not limited experience with them, I would compare them much how one would go about comparing stool to vomit.

vomit has a lot of different smells, so i'm going to say that would be the vt in your comparison.

::::BASSIST:::: · #7 02-23-2010, 01:20 AM

Every clip I've heard of the VT is all about some level of fuzz/distortion.

Can the VT do a nice clean/warm tone?

JimmyM · #8 02-23-2010, 01:30 AM

yes it can, torin. the drive knob can be turned completely off. all the character pedals do clean sounds. they all have speaker sims so you get nothing past 5k, but they do clean very well and very much in the style of the amps they're emulating.

::::BASSIST:::: · #9 02-23-2010, 01:39 AM

Thanks Jim.

Tempting pedal.

René_Julien · #10 02-23-2010, 02:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bass dan

If you don't need the di go for the vt. The vt can do the bass driver sound and many more. the bddi is a one trick pony.

I disagree a bit with this.

I own the BDDI and tested out (don't own) the VT Bass.
To me the VT Bass doesn't do what the BDDI does when it comes to tone.
It's all subjective, I am probably one of the few who prefers the BDDI over the VT Bass.
The BDDI does tube-amp emulation, the VT Bass does it better.
Still I prefer the BDDI because it is more generic, more of a lowest common denominator for tube-amp-simulator.
And that's what I like about it, strange eh? Because it is not as close to a real tube-amp as the VT Bass (probably, I have limited experience with the VT) I like the character of the BDDI. It has a great sound wether or not it is a specific amp simulator.
The BDDI is more metallic and generic. The VT Bass is more warm sounding... and more rounder in sound.

At 23h59 it's very subjective and you can get the job done with either of these pedals.

It's not like apples and oranges, it's like red apples and green apples.

Tech21 makes great stuff. I'm waiting on the Leeds to be available to see how that one can be used on bass.

12bass · #11 02-23-2010, 05:31 AM

A couple of months ago I briefly compared the SansAmp RPM and VT Bass. My impression was that the VT Bass was more colored in an "Ampegy" sort of way, while the RPM had less intrinsic personality. Now that I've owned a VT Bass for a while, I find that it sounds good, but stays within the Ampeg range of tonality. Not sure if the RPM or BDDI could quite copy the VT Bass tone, however.....

Wild_Cat · #12 02-23-2010, 06:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by René_Julien

I disagree a bit with this.

The BDDI is more metallic and generic. The VT Bass is more warm sounding... and more rounder in sound.

Aha. That's the kind of info I was after. Thanks a lot (and to the others who gave their opinion). I'll probably get a VT, then -- I'm looking for the warmth of a SVT turned to 11, spilling its guts into a monster 8x10... Only in a package that doesn't weigh 2 tons and require sound levels that make buildings collapse at my first low B.

Quote:

Tech21 makes great stuff. I'm waiting on the Leeds to be available to see how that one can be used on bass.

That's the one that gives guitars a Townshend-ish kind of sound, right? How do you think it'd sound on a bass?

René_Julien · #13 02-23-2010, 06:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wild_Cat

Aha. That's the kind of info I was after. Thanks a lot (and to the others who gave their opinion). I'll probably get a VT, then -- I'm looking for the warmth of a SVT turned to 11, spilling its guts into a monster 8x10... Only in a package that doesn't weigh 2 tons and require sound levels that make buildings collapse at my first low B.

Yup... VT Bass would be the perfect match for you.

Not for me, I'm not an Ampeg fan. (Except the SVP-Pro preamp was awesome.)

VT Bass is also better priced than the BDDI.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wild_Cat

That's the one that gives guitars a Townshend-ish kind of sound, right? How do you think it'd sound on a bass?

Well, my assumption is that Steve Harris plays with Hiwatt-based preamps... so the Leeds should get close... I hope.

Definately will check it out.

If I don't like it I'll give it to my guitarist. He already has the California, Liverpool and British pedal and they sound awesome on guitar.
British gets the most use for the heavy stuff, Liverpool gets to work on mellower music.
I'm getting the British myself for my guitar setup.

old-fashioned · #14 02-23-2010, 06:39 AM

I have a BDDI and also a VT Bass. I can not find the BDDI's drive tone on the VT. Most peole say it is there, but I just can't find it. And I miss it. Maybe it's because the compress that BDDI makes by default is missing on the VT.
But it's certain that the VT can give you nearly anything about driven bass sounds.

12bass · #15 02-23-2010, 06:39 AM

If you're looking for an Ampeg-type tone, the VT Bass seems the most logical choice because it already has that sort of flavor. My suspicion is that the BDDI has a somewhat more flexible range of tones. Interesting about the SVP-Pro, as I've been thinking of selling mine now that I have the VT Bass, as the pedal makes more sense for "kicking in" some Ampeg overdrive.

Rickett Customs · #16 02-23-2010, 06:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bass dan

the bddi is a one trick pony.

I will respectfully disagree with you here.

Either one of these (VT or the BDDI) a 1 trick ponys in a live setting, unless you're gonna fiddle around with them on stage.

However, the programmable DI, is not. you can easily do 3 completely different settings, without re-setting them.

The VT and BDDI are a bit different. The BDDI does not have as much "Grind" as the VT, but not everyone is looking for grind, this is where the BDDI works fine.

And of course The BDDI has a balanced DI out, the non-deluxe VT does not by default.

**bass dan** · #17 02-23-2010, 07:32 AM

I agree, on stage they are both one trick ponies, unless you have the deluxe bddi. I guess what i should have said was, MY favorite setting with the bddi was able to be acheived with the vt. I personally only really liked one setting on the bddi. It just seemed to me the vt had more useable settings than the bddi. That was just my taste. For instance i would never consider the "kings x" suggested setting to be usable for anything i would do. I think they are both great pedals.

I am currently playing thru a iamp800 into 2 vl108 speakers. This of coarse is a very clean sounding combo. Having the vt is like having a few different ampeg amps with the ability to go ultra clean.

My original comments were very broad. The best thing to do is get both and try them for yourself then flip the one that did'nt work for you.

Rickett Customs · #18 02-23-2010, 07:55 AM

Yeah, I had figured that term was a bit broad, but you are correct, the VT will be favored over the BDDI, on most counts. I'm just in waiting now for my VT deluxe (pre ordered), but I do plan to offload my programmable BDDI shortly, I will have no need for it, once I get the VT deluxe. Either one of these is constructed rock solid nonetheless.

Quote:

Originally Posted by bass dan

I agree, on stage they are both one trick ponies, unless you have the deluxe bddi. I guess what i should have said was, MY favorite setting with the bddi was able to be acheived with the vt. I personally only really liked one setting on the bddi. It just seemed to me the vt had more useable settings than the bddi. That was just my taste. For instance i would never consider the "kings x" suggested setting to be usable for anything i would do. I think they are both great pedals.

I am currently playing thru a iamp800 into 2 vl108 speakers. This of coarse is a very clean sounding combo. Having the vt is like having a few different ampeg amps with the ability to go ultra clean.

My original comments were very broad. The best thing to do is get both and try them for yourself then flip the one that did'nt work for you.

brandtb · #19 02-23-2010, 08:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JimmyM

vomit has a lot of different smells, so i'm going to say that would be the vt in your comparison.

You tell him, Jimmy!

faivy · #20 02-23-2010, 08:57 AM

I've got a 66 B-18 and a 78 SVT and although I've never tried the BDDI, I bought a VT and it does exactly what I want, which is get me really near those Ampeg sounds when I don't have the inclination or option to bring my own gear. I even tried it at a practice with my Walkabout and GS 112 which have their own excellent sound and the VT added a great Ampeg like option.