Blend pedal clean sound?

manchild · #1 01-14-2010, 04:31 PM

Hey all,

Im thinking of using a blend pedal with a distortion sound, and thinking of using the Boss LS-2 but im concerned about the clean signal being effected by the fact that its not true bypass.

Im quite a tone purist, and although I know some buffered pedals are good, i cant help but think that il be essentially losing my clean signal altogether if I use this, or any other buffered blend pedal.

If anyone has used the Boss can you put my mind to ease on this? Or are there true bypass pedals roughly in the same price range that would be better?

Many thanks.

scotch · #2 01-14-2010, 05:15 PM

I take it you're using a passive instrument & want to maintain optimal tone?

Honestly, the BOSS buffer is a pretty decent buffer. I'm a tone freak myself, and while I can detect a slight change in tone & feel when running 3 or more BOSS pedals in series, I honestly think that a single BOSS buffer in your chain is probably a good idea! The more buffers that get stacked, the worse in my opinion- but if you're using pedals & such, a good buffer is probably wise.

It all depends upon your entire setup (other pedals, preamps, cable lengths, etc...), but if you are running any significant length of cable between your instrument and 'target' device (amp, di, mixer, interface)- you need something to help combat cumulative capacitance.

The Barge VB-jr's seem popular. I use an Xotic X-Blender (top of the food chain, in my opinion), but it's more expensive.

pbfj84 · #3 01-14-2010, 05:37 PM

Radial tonebone and lehle are other brands to look at

moose23 · #4 01-14-2010, 05:56 PM

The vast majority of blend pedals are buffered when engaged so when you're actually using the pedal you are buffering your clean tone. If the pedal doesn't have this buffer in the blend you run into all sorts of feedback loop problems. With this in mind I wouldn't be too concerned about the buffered bypass.

I'd also echo what scotch said about the quality of the boss buffer.

manchild · #5 01-15-2010, 02:36 AM

Hey thanks for the replies, i only intend to use the one distortion device with the blend pedal, so with that in mind as you have all said, the Boss shouldnt have any real change in the clean sound that is blended?

So are all blend pdals non true bypass due to how they work? Or are barge and tonebone different? I think for the money I will go with the Boss if it is that good.

dannybuoy · #6 01-15-2010, 03:50 AM

I for one can detect the degradation in tone from Boss/Digitech buffers I've tested. I did a load of A/B tests using good quality headphones and found that the buffer in the Tech 21 VT Bass and XXL was very transparent, but I could hear the difference when going through a HM-2, OC-2 or Bad Monkey. YMMV.

I use a Barge VB-Jr, and for a simple blender I highly recommend it. You can also get phase reverse switches or an expression pedal input added as optional extras. The Xotic gets extra points for having EQ and a bigger knob you can turn with your foot, but it's bigger and more expensive.

manchild · #7 01-15-2010, 05:33 AM

Yeah i had a look at the Barge VB-Jr. I understand its a 1 loop blender with a blend knob (so you set the volume of your effect to match the clean volume and blend from wet to dry?)

Do you find the bypass signal on the VB-Jr to be quite transparnt?

I live in Scotland and cant seem to find anywhere that does Barge Concepts in the UK - anyone know where i could get one???

dannybuoy · #8 01-15-2010, 06:01 AM

It's true bypass so yes, it's as transparent as you can get. I bought mine second hand from basschat.co.uk, there's one there now (although it's €85 inc shipping from Portugal):

http://basschat.co.uk/index.php?show...70815&hl=barge

Otherwise just order from the US I suppose!

BassBrass · #9 01-15-2010, 06:03 AM

Like you I was concerned about the Boss buffer, but after a lot of testing in different configurations I use one in the middle of my board after the overdrives, before the fuzzes and ONLY with one pedal in a loop. One loop is set 25/75 and a Devi Ever BIT sounds amazing that way. The other, at 75/25 has a low end retaining distortion (like ElectroniX or Zvex). I don't use both of them at the same time... The LS-2 did not sound good when it was in a passive loop. In my main line this way it's fine, no losses heard with fuzz mixed in or bypassed. Everything before and after is true bypass.

#10 01-15-2010, 07:18 AM

Xotic X-Blender.

Jazz Ad · #11 01-15-2010, 07:20 AM

One can not achieve proper blending without buffers. They're essential to the process.

moose23 · #12 01-15-2010, 07:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jazz Ad

One can not achieve proper blending without buffers. They're essential to the process.

This was essentially the point of my long winded late night post but I think the OP is concerned about the buffer in bypass mode rather than in the blend mode.

manchild · #13 01-15-2010, 08:18 AM

Ah i see, so any blender when being used has to use buffers? I prob wouldnt use it switched off as im blending by base sound to start with and can add other effects as and when is needed.

dannybuoy · #14 01-15-2010, 08:22 AM

Yes, but the Barge has a very good buffer in it. Buffers are in no way a bad thing, it's just some are better than others!

manchild · #15 01-15-2010, 08:32 AM

Cool - thanks for the info - think il go with the barge if i can get one

moose23 · #16 01-15-2010, 08:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dannybuoy

Yes, but the Barge has a very good buffer in it. Buffers are in no way a bad thing, it's just some are better than others!

I wouldn't be surprised if the barge has better buffers than the boss, I wasn't trying to state otherwise. I just wanted to clarify that there's always buffers involved so the notion of true bypass isn't all that important imo.

I'm in the process of building one of moosapotamus's paraloopers with the high and low pass filters myself and It'll be true bypass.

scotch · #17 01-15-2010, 09:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by moose23

I wouldn't be surprised if the barge has better buffers than the boss, I wasn't trying to state otherwise. I just wanted to clarify that there's always buffers involved so the notion of true bypass isn't all that important imo.

I'm in the process of building one of moosapotamus's paraloopers with the high and low pass filters myself and It'll be true bypass.

I do think that Barge's Burr-Brown based buffers do sound better than the Boss. I have a dedicated Barge GLZ-1 buffer for my setup. I cannot honestly say that I hear any significant difference live (in a band context) between my Barge & say, a a single Boss TU-2 bypassed... But, in the studio I can definitely hear & feel a difference with the bass solo'ed! Not huge, but enough to understand that not all buffers sound the same.

manchild · #18 01-15-2010, 09:13 AM

Sure thing, thanks guys

GrooveWarrior · #19 01-15-2010, 09:21 AM

I always considered myself a tone snob, and I love my LS-2. It is great. I have a OC-3 and a Bass Big Muff in one loop and a Bass Blogger and a Bassballs in the other loop, and it is phenomenal. I have had so many people ask me what my pedalboard has on it.