Blending a signal?

[Bjazzman]

What are the advantages to blending a signal? i was looking at the barge stuff and it got me thinking. does it benefit someone with lots of effects in a massive looper? think 8+ loops. I know its getting complicated now. Im going to run my inverter after my effects back into the looper so i can put the boomerang last in the chain and invert the rang back to the top so i can mess with the loop that i just made. but what if i blend the signal does it work with me or against?

[JanusZarate]

It doesn't sound like you did your homework on blending.

Someone who would love to run a second bass rig parallel to their current one, for the purpose of one being clean/overdriven/laden with other effects/etc., but can't afford to buy or haul around another amp and cab, would benefit greatly from a blend loop pedal.

So, if this doesn't sound like you, then you don't need a blend pedal.

It's also a nice solution to dealing with pedals that cut low end. You can bring in your clean low end to make up for that, and consequently, a blend loop pedal can make ANY effects pedal bass-friendly.

[Bryan R. Tyler]

Using a large loop strip doesn't change anything for a blend pedal- you just put whatever effect you want in the effects loop of the blender, which can include a loop strip, and it will blend whatever's in there. I have a seven loop Loop-Master in the blendable effects loop of my Xotic X-blender. While I still enjoy true stereo the most and may go back to it, a good buffered blend pedal is the next best solution.

[Bjazzman]

what does it do for you though. sorry im lost

[Bryan R. Tyler]

It blends your clean signal with your affected signal. If the blend knob is at 50%, then 50% of your signal will be clean and 50% will be your affected signal. If the blend knob is at 75%, then 25% of your signal will be clean and 75% will be affected. It allows you to blend in either a little or a lot of clean tone into your affected signal, which is great if your affected signal has a lot of low-end loss. It allows you to blend in a little or a lot of your affected signal into your clean signal, so you can add just a hint of your overdirve pedal on top of your normal clean signal, for example.

[JanusZarate]

Originally Posted by Bjazzman

what does it do for you though. sorry im lost

Okay... attempt #2, with diagrams.

Normal setup:

BASS -------> PEDALS -------> AMP

Typical bi-amping setup:

BASS ---> Y-BOX INPUT

Y-BOX OUTPUT #1 ---> PEDALS ---> AMP #1 (Effected)

Y-BOX OUTPUT #2 ---> AMP #2 (Clean)

See What's going on so far? The bi-amping scenario has a second amp producing a clean signal to run with your effects signal. This is the "secret" that some effect-wielding pro bassists like Tim Commerford (Rage Against the Machine) and Chris Wolstenholme (Muse) use to creative their massive tones.

But what if you can't afford a second rig? A good second rig is expensive. Or what if a second rig is a pain to carry around? We don't all have roadies.

The solution is a blend loop pedal. It produces the same basic result you get from traditional bi-amping (clean signal mixed with your effected signal), but you only need one amp:

BASS ---> BLENDER INPUT

BLENDER SEND ---> PEDALS ---> BLENDER RECEIVE

BLENDER OUTPUT ---> AMP

And as I said before, it doesn't have to be just a bi-amping substitute. Plenty of people use it for pedals that suck low end to make them usable. It's also practical if you want to mix some clean signal with a very strong effect, like an envelope filter or synthesizer or heavy distortion. In short, you can add clean bottom end to pedals that lack it, or make a crazy effect milder by adding in your clean bass tone.

What can it do for you? Any of the above.

Do you need one? That's your call. I don't use one, but that's because my pedals have blend knobs.

Most bassists probably have no use for one, but the more effects you drag in, the more likely you might want some of your clean signal to accompany the crazy noise you plan on making with your pedals.

And if you STILL don't get it after that long-winded explanation... you're beyond help and should seek psychiatric treatment.

[Bjazzman]

NICE!

i really appreciate it. there needs to be a caveman smiley face for me now.

and i need to get me a blender since that is awesome

[jeromebass]

Will someone link some blenders please?

[TrevorOfDoom]

to jump on... instead of a blender pedal, is there a way to take a bi-amp rig, like a GK head, and only run effects through the high end cab?
say a man has a GK1001RB and is bi-amping, highs to a 2x10, lows to a 1x15. is there a way to just put his pedals through to the 2x10, and keep the 1x15 clean? or would something blow up?

[bongomania]

Taking the power amp out will kill any effects pedal. You can only bi-amp effects by taking a crossover output that is at instrument level (for most pedals) or line level (AKA preamp output level) for most rack gear.

Originally Posted by jeromebass

Will someone link some blenders please?

[JanusZarate]

Originally Posted by TrevorOfDoom

to jump on... instead of a blender pedal, is there a way to take a bi-amp rig, like a GK head, and only run effects through the high end cab?
say a man has a GK1001RB and is bi-amping, highs to a 2x10, lows to a 1x15. is there a way to just put his pedals through to the 2x10, and keep the 1x15 clean? or would something blow up?

No. Not even with the 800RB. Feel free to try running effects between your poweramp outputs and your speakers if you like, but please call the fire department in advance, and do it at the house of someone you don't really like.

(In other words... DON'T try it. Instant pedal toasting and fire hazard.)

And by the way, you're misunderstanding GK's "bi-amping" system. The 800RB is the only GK head with a variable crossover and "high"/"low" cab outputs. Modern GK heads do not do this. On modern GK heads, it's called the "Horn Management System" (HMS).

Heads like the 1001RB-II power the tweeters and drivers of cabs separately. There is a 50W tweeter/horn amp built into these heads to power those independently from your drivers.

Normally, a cab with a tweeter has a passive crossover circuit, and you tweak the tweeter volume using a dial on the back of the cab. With GK, they opted for a different approach, letting you control the tweeter from the head.

What's the advantage to that? It benefits people who crank their GK heads for growl and grit, but still want to keep the tweeter clean and distortion-free. Ever heard an overdriven tweeter before? It sounds awful.

Keep in mind, however, that if you're using an effect pedal for overdrive, HMS won't prevent the tweeter from being overdriven.

[Bryan R. Tyler]

For an example on how blenders work, there are a few artist demos using the X-blender on the Xotic page. It also allows you to switch between 100% affected, 100% clean, and whatever percentage of blended clean/affected you want.

For a far less professional and far more crappy example, I use it in my latest vid on Youtube. At about 2:03, I switch between 100% clean to 100% affected and back again a bit later, and at about 3:36 I use a blended signal of about 60% clean and 40% affected, so you get the sound of both.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bfrCGhn9GP8

Originally Posted by bongomania

Barge Concepts VFB and VFB-X
Xotic X-blender
Several Radail products
Boss LS-2

[Pilgrim]

One of my favorite blenders. No, OBVIOUSLY I couldn't resist.

[cheapbasslovin]

Originally Posted by TrevorOfDoom

to jump on... instead of a blender pedal, is there a way to take a bi-amp rig, like a GK head, and only run effects through the high end cab?
say a man has a GK1001RB and is bi-amping, highs to a 2x10, lows to a 1x15. is there a way to just put his pedals through to the 2x10, and keep the 1x15 clean? or would something blow up?

My Carvin R600 allows me to do this with rack gear (although I never have), and the newish BX1200 does the same . It's 300w or 600w per channel, respectively (instead of the GK which has only 50w capability for the horn). I don't know any other manufacturers that do this, but I'm sure that someone does.

[megadan]

A blend pedal seems like a pretty simple thing.
I'm pretty good at building things, anyone have any links for a DIY blend pedal?

[cheapbasslovin]

http://www.seanm.ca/stomp/minblend.html
or, this...
http://www.seanm.ca/stomp/bblender.html

[bongomania]

Originally Posted by cheapbasslovin

My Carvin R600 allows me to do this with rack gear (although I never have), and the newish BX1200 does the same . It's 300w or 600w per channel, respectively (instead of the GK which has only 50w capability for the horn). I don't know any other manufacturers that do this, but I'm sure that someone does.

Before you destroy any of your gear it is important for you to understand that if you take the power amp outputs of any amp it will fry any effects you connect to it. The only way what you're describing will work is if the crossover outputs are coming from the preamp stage, which of course has nothing to do with the wattage of the amp.

[cheapbasslovin]

Originally Posted by bongomania

Before you destroy any of your gear it is important for you to understand that if you take the power amp outputs of any amp it will fry any effects you connect to it. The only way what you're describing will work is if the crossover outputs are coming from the preamp stage, which of course has nothing to do with the wattage of the amp.

Yup, thats where it is. Can be used as a pre out to a poweramp, or as a send/return with a stereo to tip/ring-mono cable. One effect loop for each power amp.

http://www.carvinguitars.com/manuals/BX600-BX1200.pdf

From earlier posts I could see how you may be concerned about my knowledge, but I assure you that I know the difference between the line signal and power output (just not how capable the components are on the line side).