Cave Passive pedals

[simenandreas]

Hey! I was wondering if anyone have experienced these pedals? I was looking at the grind mkII, witch got me very interested. It is a bass drive/overdrive/boost pedal. The youtube demo guy is really boring, but the sound of the drive pedal was very clean and tasty. And these pedals dosen´t need any power at all! I have a strong belief of this pedal will cut in the mix.
Here is the link to it:
Cave Passive Pedals Grunt MKII demo - YouTube
The sound of it starts at 4:35

Thanks in advance

[weemac]

I use the B-drive (updated grunt pedal) as my main overdrive pedal now.
I have used it on Rickenbackers, Waterstones and a Musicman all with good results...
My own mini review would go something like:

The Cave pedals are very sensitive to the differences from one bass to another. I kind of see it as a good thing, there is no more organic sounding overdrive/boost available but they may not work on every bass.
They sound wonderful on octave basses (8 or 12 string) where most other overdrives get too agro, the cave drive just hangs there without wiping out the rest of your tone.
They are also very sensitive to what comes after the pedal, I have found they give off their best going into another buffered pedal or into the Hi input of the amp...
If I was to sum up the sound all round I'd say that:
"The Cave passive drive pedals remove a bit from your highs and add it to the mids and have an optional variable but gentle fuzz effect"

Hey, Aussie Mark is not boring, he is just presenting the facts without any BS.

emac.

[dave zilla]

I owned a b drive for a short time and while I liked the sound it dropped my signal by half. So it went back, I play a 92 fender jazz.

However the dude that runs passive is the most helpful dude. Any question just email him

[Mark Latimour]

How does a passive pedal offer boost? Presumably the only thing you can do with passive electronics is cut so the "clean boost" is probably cutting something out of the signal.

[Pollinator95]

Originally Posted by Mark Latimour

How does a passive pedal offer boost? Presumably the only thing you can do with passive electronics is cut so the "clean boost" is probably cutting something out of the signal.

I don´t think they offer any boosts. If they did, it would probably be like a valve amp attenuator, or the Farndurk Afterburner.

[cybersnyder]

I don't see the appeal of a passive pedal. It's cool from a novelty perspective but why would you limit yourself to passive only? Seems like trying to design a tank for the Army but not using an engine. IMHO.

[Mark Latimour]

Originally Posted by Pollinator95

I don´t think they offer any boosts. If they did, it would probably be like a valve amp attenuator, or the Farndurk Afterburner.

In the video in the OP the presenter claims that with the drive turned fully off the pedal works as a clean booster.

[takfar]

Well, the Villex PRTB system does offer a real, very noticeable, volume boost without using power. I suppose the "cutting a bit of the highs and redirecting energy to mids" is the key to making the signal audibly louder without active electronics.

[cybersnyder]

Originally Posted by takfar

Well, the Villex PRTB system does offer a real, very noticeable, volume boost without using power. I suppose the "cutting a bit of the highs and redirecting energy to mids" is the key to making the signal audibly louder without active electronics.

I wonder if the Villex system starts with hot pickups and then cuts everything halfway as it's "flat" setting. Then you can "boost" lows mids and highs.

[father of fires]

They use old school crystal radio technology. A lot of radios use to be passive back in the day. I like the ideas but I haven't been convinced by the sounds.

[caeman]

Interesting.

Cave Passive Pedals - Technology

But, his marketing speak still doesn't the question of HOW, except it is taking from the voltage of the pickups and re-using it.

Very interesting.

[seanm]

I have the Grunt MKII and it does have some boost. I have to turn it down a bit if I want the same volume on and off. It is enough that you can hear the difference, but not enough to use as a boost pedal IMHO. I am not sure you would notice the volume boost live.

I use it mainly to add some warmth/grit when practicing at home straight into a mixer. Since it is passive, I can leave it plugged in and "on" 24/7 without worrying about batteries or parasitic power supplies.

[alec]

It is a strange technology which spins me out a bit. Heath Cave says that the early pedals were passive.

I tried the G4 on my 18v active Schecter and got a nice warm growl but I got a significant reduction in volume. Most people in the tour of duty say it works better with passive basses than active, but one recently said the opposite.

It also responds differently to different pedals that follow it in the signal path.

[Taylor Livingston]

I don't know anything about these pedals in particular and won't say anything about them specifically.

Regarding the general concept of passive boost - a transformer can change a low impedance output, as from an active bass or an active pedal's output (low voltage, high current) to a high impedance (high voltage, low current). If you have a low impedance output feeding the transformer, and a high impedance input after the transformer, this can act like a boost since the high impedance input is sensitive to voltage, and you've just created a voltage gain.

This is why such a device would depend so much on what's before it and after it.

[seanm]

In my application I have a passive bass => Grunt => loooper => mixer.

I don't know what the input impedance is on the mixer, the specs just say "all other inputs 20k or greater" But I would guess I have a high impedance into a lower impedance. If I get keen I could still a DI between the bass and the mixer and see how it changed things.

[takfar]

Originally Posted by cybersnyder

I wonder if the Villex system starts with hot pickups and then cuts everything halfway as it's "flat" setting. Then you can "boost" lows mids and highs.

Nope. No such tricks. The pickups themselves have controls that can cut both highs and mids, but the PRTB system is something else entirely. You can install the Villex PRTB in basses with non-Villex pickups and it WILL boost your volume.

[weemac]

I have run the pedal with everything from an 8 string Rickenbacker to a Musicman Sub and it boosts on all of them (the Sub is really loud once boosted)

What comes after the pedal is more important than what comes before.
The bypass is hard wired so it has only very slight loss when it is off. The pedal is a boost pedal not a bypass cut pedal....
Anyone who wants to write these pedals off before trying them is doing themselves a disservice.
No, they are not the most gnarly overdrive pedal around but once you use them you realise how fake your previous pedals sounded..
The Cave pedals sound warm, slightly hairy and organicaly fuzzy. And they don't cost a bomb either.....

Eden.

[caeman]

I would be very willing to trial a few of them, but shipping from Oz to the midwest USA might make that an expensive trial.

[seanm]

Originally Posted by caeman

I would be very willing to trial a few of them, but shipping from Oz to the midwest USA might make that an expensive trial.

Shipping for one pedal was about $25 to Canada. Probably about the same to the US.

[caeman]

From the description:

The Octa-Bass gives your bass an Octave Up frequency or a sound similar to Ring-Modulators if two or more notes are played simultaneously.

Removes the original note being played from the signal.

That is certainly different. Most bassist want the original and octave'd signal blended together.