(custom) compressor idea... is this silly?

[René_Julien]

I have this idea in my head for a while. If I were into DIY I would already have (tried) to build it.

Here is what I had in mind:

pedal form

attack: fixed, very fast
release: fixed, very slow
ratio: fixed, I'm thinking somewhere around 1:10
threshold: controllable, something common like -20dB to +20dB (?)
2 gain make-up controls which are actually 2 bands of EQing boost-only: one 250 Hz bandpass with very wide bandwith and the other 1 KHz bandpass with very wide bandwith

So the big idea is compressor/EQ combination.
I know a lot of you will say it might be a bad idea to leave a regular gain control out of it.
But I thought maybe that 2 band EQ with very wide bandwith, frequencies at low-mid and high-mid can do the output level job.
In my estimation... I think it would be better than a tilting EQ. Well for me anyway, I don't like tilting EQ.
Maybe this EQ control would be enough to complement amps with just 3band EQ and peculiar tone stacks.

The compression nature: my idea of those fixed attack, release and ratio. It's based on my use of a TLA 5051 compressor.
This way I have sort of a "bowed" effect my TLA provides. It's hard to describe. It seems like the squeeze effect of the compression swells in after a note is played.
Very cool effect.
I'm trying to find that in a pedal.

So this pedal I have in mind would just have 3 controls:
- threshold
- low-mid gain make-up
- high-mid gain make-up


What I propose might be very eccentric, and definately not marketable.
A lot of people will say to make it more versatile. But this would only be for me. A one-trick pony, but a trick for me.


Is this a stupid idea for a pedal?

[ga_edwards]

Not at all silly. But sounds like a dual/multiband compressor might do the job just as well. Dualbands tend to only have a single crossover or a tilt eq you don't like, but multibands are essential combined compressor and eq. On a full featured device (you're probably looking rack) you can define which frequency bands you want to compress and mix the output of all bands as you wish. The only one that comes to mind is the TC Triple C which is no longer made!

I think the only other way you would be able to get exactly the sound in your head though would be a 2 channel compressor (like a stereo rack device or the fab TC Nova Dynamics that I use) with a parametric eq strapped into each channel which you can tweak to your hearts content.

[cybersnyder]

I'd try to do it with software plug-ins as a proof of concept before committing to what will likely be a very expensive pedal.

[René_Julien]

Originally Posted by ga_edwards

Not at all silly. But sounds like a dual/multiband compressor might do the job just as well. Dualbands tend to only have a single crossover or a tilt eq you don't like, but multibands are essential combined compressor and eq. On a full featured device (you're probably looking rack) you can define which frequency bands you want to compress and mix the output of all bands as you wish. The only one that comes to mind is the TC Triple C which is no longer made!

I think the only other way you would be able to get exactly the sound in your head though would be a 2 channel compressor (like a stereo rack device or the fab TC Nova Dynamics that I use) with a parametric eq strapped into each channel which you can tweak to your hearts content.

Thanks for the advice.

It's not really dualband compression I am looking for. Just thought of the idea of making the gain make-up like a 2 band equalizer. Not shelving like low&high but for low-mid and high-mid control. And very wide bandwith so it isn't exactly usable as a normal EQ, but gives some tone control post-compression.

Actually, you make a very good point bringing dualband up.
Maybe I need to try a dualband compressor out again. I only have experience with the Ashdown Compressor, didn't thought dualband was usable for me.
My BOSS CS-3 has that tilting EQ. I don't mess around with that either.

So I feel that dualband isn't for me... but before I really go anywhere with this idea I'll certainly give it a second thought.

Originally Posted by cybersnyder

I'd try to do it with software plug-ins as a proof of concept before committing to what will likely be a very expensive pedal.

Very true.

Unfortunally I am not familiar with software plug-ins.
Unless someone can direct me where to get started with this.

I'm aware that it will be expensive, and it would be a waste of money if this concept is doomed from the beginning.

I was just wondering what others might think of this.


More likely I can go the DIY route. I can build it and know where to get parts, I just can't design anything yet. Or I need to dedicate myself studying audio electronics. (I'm pretty skilled in automotive electricity and electronics.)

[bongomania]

The DIY approach would not actually be all that difficult. Most of the popular optical comp designs out there have a fast attack and slow release, so all you'd need is one of those readily-available DIY comps. Even the BYOC opto would be fine. Then find a nice adjustable EQ circuit, there should be a few of those around on the DIYstompbox type sites, as well as the DIYaudio forum, and just put that in place of the make-up gain stage on the comp. Relatively easy. The make-up gain stage of a comp is usually just a separate device from the comp circuit itself, so "cut and paste".

If you decide not to go the DIY route, check out the FEA Opti-FET. Its EQ'ed sidechain is not a normal EQ, but you might like the results anyway.

[René_Julien]

well, guess I'll have to search some schematics.

I'm guessing the most common designs are for two-knob compressors, where threshold and ratio are controlled with one knob and the other is gain off course. Right?

Maybe that would be the wisest thing to do, instead of a fixed ratio.

[bongomania]

The second knob is always make-up gain, but the first knob can be a range of different functions, depending on the specific pedal. It can be threshold, ratio, pre-gain into a fixed threshold, any combination of those, as well as (sometimes) affecting the attack and/or release times.

[ga_edwards]

Originally Posted by René_Julien

Actually, you make a very good point bringing dualband up.
Maybe I need to try a dualband compressor out again. I only have experience with the Ashdown Compressor, didn't thought dualband was usable for me.

I've had the Ashdown and IMO I don't think it's a very good example of what dualband compression can do. Actually I couldn't tell if it was actually doing anything as I had to set the input so low to prevent clipping, not to mention the fact the crossover was fixed.

I've also used the Digitech dualband, but that too had it's limitations. Whilst you could define the crossover point, you couldn't balance the low and highs as the compression and makeup gain for highs and lows were combined - the more compression you applied, the more gain was also added, so you couldn't have high compression at lower volume.

That's the problem with stompbox units, they tend to skimp on, or combine functions and feature as there's only so much room. However, I think that one of FEA Labs offerings may fair you better as there are much fuller featured.

[René_Julien]

Originally Posted by ga_edwards

I've had the Ashdown and IMO I don't think it's a very good example of what dualband compression can do. Actually I couldn't tell if it was actually doing anything as I had to set the input so low to prevent clipping, not to mention the fact the crossover was fixed.

I've also used the Digitech dualband, but that too had it's limitations. Whilst you could define the crossover point, you couldn't balance the low and highs as the compression and makeup gain for highs and lows were combined - the more compression you applied, the more gain was also added, so you couldn't have high compression at lower volume.

That's the problem with stompbox units, they tend to skimp on, or combine functions and feature as there's only so much room. However, I think that one of FEA Labs offerings may fair you better as there are much fuller featured.

I just browsed for FEA products.
I understand the limitations of the Ashdown DualBand Compressor.

I haven't tried a decent dual band compressor yet.
I'm still not sure what advantages it would give me.

The FEA Dual Band Optical Compressor-Limiter seems awesome. (expensive though... but considering I spent a lot more on the TL Audio why not )
I'm wondering if I could dial in that slow swelling squeezed effect on the low band and crisper articulation on the high band. And if I would like that.

Something to think about. Going to read the reviews.


I was interested in doing a DIY project anyway... or not a real pedal but a switchboard I can experiment and study with.
(and yes... I am aware of the the dangers and hazards of playing with electricity... wouldn't be the first time I've been electrocuted)
First thing I'd give a shot will be a compressor anyway.

[René_Julien]

Originally Posted by bongomania

The second knob is always make-up gain, but the first knob can be a range of different functions, depending on the specific pedal. It can be threshold, ratio, pre-gain into a fixed threshold, any combination of those, as well as (sometimes) affecting the attack and/or release times.

Don't worry, I'll first try to grasp how it works before I go "copy-pasting".