Delay--DL4 vs. DD20 vs. Memory Man

[Dr. Lobotomy]

Sorry for the repeat thread, don't know why I can't bring up the thread I started last week on search. Likely has something to do with my funky computers here at the hospital.

So...
I think I'm gonna pull the trigger on a delay pedal. The big boys (DL4, DD20), likely have more functionality than I can use immediately. But, I think I'll grow into them.
I definitely want some looping features and I think these are the ones that are appropriate for the things I want to do.

What can the DL4 do that the DD20 can't? I think the DL4 offers more bang for the buck, but maybe I'm mistaken about this. The DL4 comes highly recommended to me by my old guitarist, I just want to make sure I'm not missing out on something that the DD20 can do for me.

Also, the outlier in the decision is the Memory Man. I love EHX stuff, and the videos for the Memory Man look VERY cool. But, doesn't seem like I can set presets, and the looping functions appear more limited.
What would I get out of the Memory Man vs. the DL4?

Thanks again for the input.

[DosiYanarchy]

im assuming the Stereo Memory Man with Hazerai? as opposed to the regular or Deluxe memory man pedals?

you can set one preset on each of the modes on the SMMH and i think you have about 30 seconds of loop time - far more than most of us need.

[Dr. Lobotomy]

Originally Posted by DosiYanarchy

im assuming the Stereo Memory Man with Hazerai? as opposed to the regular or Deluxe memory man pedals?

you can set one preset on each of the modes on the SMMH and i think you have about 30 seconds of loop time - far more than most of us need.

yeah, smmh.
Didn't know you could set presets on it. Veddy intevestink. Sure you don't need an accessory pedal for that?
30 seconds is just fine for looping. Don't see myself looping more than that, otherwise I would get a boomerang.

anything on those comparisons?
DL4 vs. DD20?
DL4 vs. SMMH?

[coreyfyfe]

I've owned all three, and currently have both the DD-20 and DL4 on my board. The DD-20 is pulling main duty as my delay, DL4 as my looper.

The DL4s delay options are endless, and each setting on the dial comes with three pre-sets which are factory set to give very different sounds, but you can save your own so there is a ton of variety. The fouth button acts as your tap tempo so you can adjust any setting to your current tempo. The looper is shorter (14 or 16 seconds) but you can add in delay and modulation to the loop which is what lead me into having two delays. The delay time of the loop isn't tap tempo controlled, it's set by dialing the knob, so I ended up getting a separate delay just for the purpose of being able to control the delay on my loops.

After trying a few other pedals, I eventually settled on the DD-20 as my main delay. The DD-20 has the digital readout so you can see the delay time, either in ms or bpm, and allows you to all kind of switching for the delay note (quarter, eighth, triplets, etc). The feature I take the most advantage of is that you can store delay times, so I use three different stored delay times with different note values and mode settings for different songs, so I don't have to tap them out, they're pre-set so we can just jump right in. The Sound-on-Sound (looper) of the DD-20 is a lot longer, but not as versatile. Once you stop it, you can't recall it later. The DL4 definitely wins over the DD-20 as a looper, especially with the added feature of the "play once" button which can be used to do some cool punch-in type effects with short loops or as a way to bring a loop up to tempo if the band speeds up or something.

The SMMH was cool, and I was hoping it would be able to replace my DL4 as a looper since it has tap-tempo/quantize on the loops, but the quantize didn't play well with loops in odd time signatures so I returned it. I didn't give it much play as a delay, since I mostly wanted the looper function, but it didn't win me over as a replacement for the DL4 so I stuck with that.

If I had to choose just one, it would definitely be the DL4. The delay options are really endless and the looper is one of the better live loopers that comes bundled in a delay (IMO of course). I think what I really need is to get a dedicated loop station, but I've gotten so used to the DL4 that I really don't want to let it go.

Either way, good luck with your search.

[Spacelordmother]

Originally Posted by coreyfyfe

I've owned all three, and currently have both the DD-20 and DL4 on my board. The DD-20 is pulling main duty as my delay, DL4 as my looper....

+1 to everything he said.

[icarussmicarus]

Had a DD-20 is my main delay, got surplanted by the Echobox for delay duties

About to pick up a DL4 specifically for easy but powerful looping.

[Spacelordmother]

I'm considering dropping a Headrush after my DL4 to further expand my delay/looping capabilities.

*think think*

[Jared Lash]

Great post from coreyfyfe. He covered things very well.

What I've always said is that the DL4 is the best stombox in terms of delay AND looping. I think there are better delays, and there are definitely better dedicated loopers, but the Line6 is the best combination of the two on the market IMO.

The only downsides to that pedal are that there have been some reports of durability issues and the bypass isn't as good as it could be. But apart from that (and the size if that matters) it's a great pedal.

EDIT: Corey, I was checking out your profile and checked out your band's myspace page. Really nice stuff. I was bummed that there was only one song. Some hints of Minus the Bear and a few other familiar elements I'm having trouble putting my finger on at the moment.

[varunkapahi]

Originally Posted by coreyfyfe

I've owned all three, and currently have both the DD-20 and DL4 on my board. The DD-20 is pulling main duty as my delay, DL4 as my looper.

The DL4s delay options are endless, and each setting on the dial comes with three pre-sets which are factory set to give very different sounds, but you can save your own so there is a ton of variety. The fouth button acts as your tap tempo so you can adjust any setting to your current tempo. The looper is shorter (14 or 16 seconds) but you can add in delay and modulation to the loop which is what lead me into having two delays. The delay time of the loop isn't tap tempo controlled, it's set by dialing the knob, so I ended up getting a separate delay just for the purpose of being able to control the delay on my loops.

After trying a few other pedals, I eventually settled on the DD-20 as my main delay. The DD-20 has the digital readout so you can see the delay time, either in ms or bpm, and allows you to all kind of switching for the delay note (quarter, eighth, triplets, etc). The feature I take the most advantage of is that you can store delay times, so I use three different stored delay times with different note values and mode settings for different songs, so I don't have to tap them out, they're pre-set so we can just jump right in. The Sound-on-Sound (looper) of the DD-20 is a lot longer, but not as versatile. Once you stop it, you can't recall it later. The DL4 definitely wins over the DD-20 as a looper, especially with the added feature of the "play once" button which can be used to do some cool punch-in type effects with short loops or as a way to bring a loop up to tempo if the band speeds up or something.

The SMMH was cool, and I was hoping it would be able to replace my DL4 as a looper since it has tap-tempo/quantize on the loops, but the quantize didn't play well with loops in odd time signatures so I returned it. I didn't give it much play as a delay, since I mostly wanted the looper function, but it didn't win me over as a replacement for the DL4 so I stuck with that.

If I had to choose just one, it would definitely be the DL4. The delay options are really endless and the looper is one of the better live loopers that comes bundled in a delay (IMO of course). I think what I really need is to get a dedicated loop station, but I've gotten so used to the DL4 that I really don't want to let it go.

Either way, good luck with your search.

thanks! thats a great review

[coreyfyfe]

Originally Posted by TheBigO

EDIT: Corey, I was checking out your profile and checked out your band's myspace page. Really nice stuff. I was bummed that there was only one song. Some hints of Minus the Bear and a few other familiar elements I'm having trouble putting my finger on at the moment.

Thanks! I'm bummed there's only one song too haha, we've got a bunch of others that are constantly being remixed or re-recorded in the process of making our EP. They are (once again) in the final stages of mixing and should be done soon. My favorite is the one in this video http://www.youtube.com/transcardia and it's a good example of how I use the DL4 for live looping.

The loop I recorded has an attack delay style filter from my HOG, delay from the DD-20 and is looped on the DL4. In the beginning you can hear it looping, then I mess up and hit the wrong button shutting it off, and then bring it back in using the "play once" feature. It comes back in the choruses as well, and I used the "play once" to keep it in time.

In the chorus, it's hard to hear the loop over everything else, so I use a volume boost added in to give the looped track a little more umph. It's normally not an issue, but since we're timing things to the loop I use it to make sure it can be heard.

[Jared Lash]

Good stuff. PM me when your EP comes out. I'll definitely buy a copy.

[SoonerMatt]

Have you considered a Boss RE-20?

[fightthepower]

The RE-20 Space Echo can does a great tape delay, but it is very limited compared to the other 3.

[TaySte_2000]

I feel strongly that the EHX SMM/H is the best out of the 3 or even 4 if you consider the headrush as well.

It's tone is very organic, the tape and analog delay settings are stunning, not quite perfect but way better than the boss and just enough better than the DL-4.

In terms of looping the SMM/H is the best bar none, you can pitch shift up or down 2 octaves, reverse, have loops decay, you have 30 seconds of loop time. It also has a load of tricks in the delays you can use so you can do the swell delays of the DL-4, some sorta sample and hold type sounds etc, I had a thread with the settings and with these you realise how much better the SMM/H is over all the others.

You can store 7 presets and use the looper in all of them, though you can only store a preset for that delay type instead of just 4 of any delay, it's a inconvenience but not the end of the world unless you need to be changing delays mid song, other thing is no trails when you click it off, but you do get true bypass so your tone isn't affected

I guess a down side would be no LCD screen like the DD-20 if you wanted to precisely set a time for a song, but the DL4 doesn't have this and end of the day this is what tap tempo is for.

Only looper/delay I found to be more controllable than the SMM/H is the Eventide Time Factor and there is a huge difference in price there.

I regretted selling mine from day one and I'm now in the market for another and to me I'm only considering the SMM/H or the Time Factor, or I'll be going for the Boss RC-20XL or Digitech Jamman and have to have another delay which in the end will likely be the SMM/H and my Echobox (Echobox is the best delay I've ever used but if you need tap tempo and reverse delays etc.)

[Spacelordmother]

Originally Posted by coreyfyfe

The DL4s delay options are endless, and each setting on the dial comes with three pre-sets which are factory set to give very different sounds, but you can save your own so there is a ton of variety.

Wait... what? I know you can save 3 of your own settings, but can you explain this further?

[Dr. Lobotomy]

Hmmm...so far I'm thinking DL4 vs. SMMH.
I gotta say, I like the coolness factor of the SMMH, but I'm still leaning DL4.
Easy of use?
Ease of getting to preset delays?
Ease of looping?
Ease of shifting pitch and delay speed (I would probably get the expression pedal for the DL4)?
I'm gettin' a little overwhelmed with all of the delay/looper functions between the two as I have virtually no experience with these types of pedals.

Appreciate the continued debate and advice...please continue...

[Happynoj]

Originally Posted by TaySte_2000

I feel strongly that the EHX SMM/H is the best out of the 3 or even 4 if you consider the headrush as well.

It's tone is very organic, the tape and analog delay settings are stunning, not quite perfect but way better than the boss and just enough better than the DL-4.

In terms of looping the SMM/H is the best bar none, you can pitch shift up or down 2 octaves, reverse, have loops decay, you have 30 seconds of loop time. It also has a load of tricks in the delays you can use so you can do the swell delays of the DL-4, some sorta sample and hold type sounds etc, I had a thread with the settings and with these you realise how much better the SMM/H is over all the others.

You can store 7 presets and use the looper in all of them, though you can only store a preset for that delay type instead of just 4 of any delay, it's a inconvenience but not the end of the world unless you need to be changing delays mid song, other thing is no trails when you click it off, but you do get true bypass so your tone isn't affected

I guess a down side would be no LCD screen like the DD-20 if you wanted to precisely set a time for a song, but the DL4 doesn't have this and end of the day this is what tap tempo is for.

Only looper/delay I found to be more controllable than the SMM/H is the Eventide Time Factor and there is a huge difference in price there.

I regretted selling mine from day one and I'm now in the market for another and to me I'm only considering the SMM/H or the Time Factor, or I'll be going for the Boss RC-20XL or Digitech Jamman and have to have another delay which in the end will likely be the SMM/H and my Echobox (Echobox is the best delay I've ever used but if you need tap tempo and reverse delays etc.)

Did you ever get your SMM/H converted to have the on/stomp/off switch for the looper rather than the on/hold/off? (If you understand what I mean).

[Happynoj]

Originally Posted by Dr. Lobotomy

Hmmm...so far I'm thinking DL4 vs. SMMH.
I gotta say, I like the coolness factor of the SMMH, but I'm still leaning DL4.
Easy of use?
Ease of getting to preset delays?
Ease of looping?
Ease of shifting pitch and delay speed (I would probably get the expression pedal for the DL4)?
I'm gettin' a little overwhelmed with all of the delay/looper functions between the two as I have virtually no experience with these types of pedals.

Appreciate the continued debate and advice...please continue...

The SMM/H can do this. What more do you need?


EDIT: The clip might be a little quiet, and it is a little bit more insane when you add a fuzz in front of it.

[Mr. Pickle]

I'd be interested in that....


Any links?

[TaySte_2000]

Originally Posted by Happynoj

Did you ever get your SMM/H converted to have the on/stomp/off switch for the looper rather than the on/hold/off? (If you understand what I mean).

The only mod you can do is to make it like a Maneco looper where it's time based, similar to the old Digitech PDS units, basically you set the time knob, click the switch and it starts recording when the time is up it goes straight into overdub mode, not a great mod but very useful for drone and noise stuff.