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  #1  
Old 12-27-2008, 06:16 PM
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Digitech Grunge / English Muff'n Clips / Comparison

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As most of you know, I love my English Muff'n (aka EM), and was searching for a 9VDC compact equivalent. Im here to tell you, I've gotten REAL close with this one. And its not even the Valnott

I'm gonna start this with the samples, then my conclusions, then get a little in depth.

Samples. The clean->em->grunge are litterally done in that order. The mojo ones are clean->lpb->lpb+em->lpb+grunge. Settings are as follows:

LPB: boost=9 o'clock

EM: gain=max
bass=noon
mid=max
treble=min
level=9 o'clock

Grunge: grunge(gain)=11 o'clock
treble=min
bass=2 o'clock (max on "+bass" samples)
level=8 to 9 o'clock



This was how I had them set up. They also run thru a TU-2, Micro POG, and an LPB-1. The amp was set to a little grind (about half way on the gain), flat bass, 4db 420Hz boost in the mids and the treble a MINIMUM I had to set it up like so to get sound from the FX loop, as the send doubles as a "CD in". I also had to run the laptop off batteries cus of ground loops. This folks, is why my next purchase is gonna be a DI of some sort.



Anyways, the samples:

clean->em->grunge
clean->em->grunge+bass
mojo->em->grunge
mojo->em->grunge+bass

Personally, I like both the EM and grunge. With the +bass settings I can get the grunge fairly close IMHO, to the sound of the EM. I find the grunge has a little more midrange, but has a slight "sqeak". If I played live I'd prolly use the grunge, but use the EM for studio recording. There are 3 reasons why I'd do this:

1) Price. I may have got the EM at a good price (slightly)used, but replacing it would be costly. The grunge only cost me 60$. Not a lot of change if it breaks or I need a new one. New, the EM is about 4 times the price.

2) Power. The grunge runs nicely with my other 3 9VDC pedals, even chained. The EM takes 12VAC, and barring the fact that it doesn't fit on the lunchbox very well, needing a 2nd wart just sux.

3) The sound of the grunge is close enough to the EM that most people listening to my music wouldn't prolly even notice (LOL)

Theres not much else to go into (all the controls on both are pretty self evident), but I would like to point out a couple of things:

-- The grunges bass knob DOES affect the actual bass frequencies, and appears to be a shelving type deal (as with the treble), but it does need to be turned up quite a bit. Sitting at noon there is some bass loss, but it is easily corrected. A note to Thunderscreech (and anyone else thats interested): I would say that the bass control on this is more useful than the Mega Distortion type low knob. The MD is meant for use with downtuned guitars, and I believe that the grunge is designed along the same lines, but where the MD just adds a bunch of almost-lows-but-more-like-low-mids, the grunge excels with its bass knob. Also, the grunge's treble knob allows the taming of the sizzlely-digital-artifact stuff, whereas the MD had a tone that added more low mids. You would end up with a lot of push but no rumble. Plenty of rumble with the grunge

-- There is some squeakyness to the grunges sound that doesn't really dissapear or change even in different positions of the gain knob. Cranking the bass and minning the trebs does seem to make it fall into the background, but it doesn't totally eliminate it.

-- The gain knob on the grunge doesn't appear to DO a whole lot. It starts off distorted and ends that way, and theres not a whole lot of range. You do get more bass responce the lower the gain is and loose bass the higher you set it. Somewhere around noon seems like a happy medium IMHO. If your looking for low-gain, look elsewhere, same with if your looking for fuzz territory.

-- The switch is like the one that broke on my weeping demon when I got it. If the grunge breaks I may be tempted to pick up a metal zone to see if I can get a distortion like the grunge but with the ability to remove the sqeek. It does seem sturdier than the WD switch, and everything seems to be fairly well designed and placed for it to handle some roughing around. Even if I do end up replacing the grunge, the EM would still be more of a pain/worry in a live setting. There might be a guard over the tubes, but the last thing I would want to do is be trying to get glass out of it. Never mind the cost of replacing the tubes.

Hope you find this of some interest
  #2  
Old 12-27-2008, 06:21 PM
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REALLY?
  #3  
Old 12-27-2008, 06:22 PM
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Sounds good dude, but a MetalZone won't get a similar sound, I don't think it would anyway.
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  #4  
Old 12-27-2008, 06:23 PM
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Squawk is a great way to describe the Digitech Grunge. Stick with the English Muff'n.
  #5  
Old 12-27-2008, 06:26 PM
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i found similar results with the grunge. bass all the way up, for me, gain all the way down. only my clean sound is a lot less.. well.. bassy.
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  #6  
Old 12-27-2008, 06:43 PM
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i dont believe you
  #7  
Old 12-27-2008, 06:54 PM
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me? my bass is all high mid grind. i listen to way too much punk music for my own good.

i couldnt hear what i was playing if i didnt high that kind of articulation. to each his own, but i couldnt play like that.
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  #8  
Old 12-27-2008, 07:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chronicle View Post
REALLY?
Really, what?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Darkstrike View Post
Sounds good dude, but a MetalZone won't get a similar sound, I don't think it would anyway.
Based on the clips I've heard I kinda think the same thing, but I am open to trying one out still.

Quote:
Originally Posted by OptimusPrime View Post
Squawk is a great way to describe the Digitech Grunge. Stick with the English Muff'n.
Find me a way to *cheaply* mod the EM so that it will run 9VDC and I will Till that day Ill stick with the grunge for getting close enough I should take in the guard and some measurements to the sheet metal guys 2 doors down from us electricians and see if they can make me a better tube guard...

Quote:
Originally Posted by sonic assassin View Post
i found similar results with the grunge. bass all the way up, for me, gain all the way down. only my clean sound is a lot less.. well.. bassy.
My clean tone softens things up. After that it gets dangerous. I had to wear a reinforced haz mat suit like in half-life in order to safely record those clips...
  #9  
Old 12-27-2008, 07:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DanielTulip View Post
Based on the clips I've heard I kinda think the same thing, but I am open to trying one out still.
It can sound good on bass, but won't have that much low end. Even with the treble at zero and bass at 10.
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  #10  
Old 12-27-2008, 07:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DanielTulip View Post
Find me a way to *cheaply* mod the EM so that it will run 9VDC and I will Till that day Ill stick with the grunge for getting close enough
I looked into it for you a while back. It's just not gonna happen cheaply and efficiently.
  #11  
Old 12-27-2008, 08:58 PM
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Sorry, I just thought the comparsion between the two pedals was like comparing a peanut and hagan daz chocolate cone caramel ice cream. One awesome, one okay.
  #12  
Old 12-27-2008, 09:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OptimusPrime View Post
I looked into it for you a while back. It's just not gonna happen cheaply and efficiently.
Hehe, didn't think so Either way, I love that I've found a cheaper close alternative.

Like I said, the EM is totally staying for recording purposes

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chronicle View Post
Sorry, I just thought the comparsion between the two pedals was like comparing a peanut and hagan daz chocolate cone caramel ice cream. One awesome, one okay.
It's more a comparison to the only 2 gain pedals I have Since I've been looking for a close alt for the EM since I got my 1st, I figured it made sense. Think of it like comparing cheap [insert fav flavor] ice cream to hagan daz
  #13  
Old 12-27-2008, 10:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DanielTulip View Post
Hehe, didn't think so Either way, I love that I've found a cheaper close alternative.

Like I said, the EM is totally staying for recording purposes



It's more a comparison to the only 2 gain pedals I have Since I've been looking for a close alt for the EM since I got my 1st, I figured it made sense. Think of it like comparing cheap [insert fav flavor] ice cream to hagan daz
I gotta go get some ice cream now
  #14  
Old 12-27-2008, 10:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chronicle View Post
I gotta go get some ice cream now
Me too

Damn all the references to food on TB.... Carrots, Bacon, ice cream.... :hungry: (we need a hungry emote too)
  #15  
Old 12-27-2008, 10:09 PM
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That's not a fair comparison, you have to use the English Muff'n at a decent sounding setting it sounds terrible with the gain cranked. I would (and have) use an English Muff'n and leave it on all night, but I wouldn't be caught dead with a Digitech Grunge pedal, especially because I play in a grungish rock band. That's SO not grunge! The Carpenters are more grungy than using a Digitech Grunge pedal! If you really want a grungy tone, and have to have it in a pedal, get a Durham Electronics Crazy Horse, it's the best pedal representation of the tone of The Man himself. Check it:

http://www.soundclick.com/bands/page...songID=7133684

I'd like to hear the Grunge pedal do Powderfinger with any kind of sincerety! So maybe it still doesn't sound half as good as The Man himself but it still makes me all happy when I hear it!
  #16  
Old 12-27-2008, 10:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DanielTulip View Post
Carrots & Bacon ice cream....
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  #17  
Old 12-27-2008, 10:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark Olson View Post
That's not a fair comparison, you have to use the English Muff'n at a decent sounding setting it sounds terrible with the gain cranked. I would (and have) use an English Muff'n and leave it on all night, but I wouldn't be caught dead with a Digitech Grunge pedal, especially because I play in a grungish rock band. That's SO not grunge! The Carpenters are more grungy than using a Digitech Grunge pedal! If you really want a grungy tone, and have to have it in a pedal, get a Durham Electronics Crazy Horse, it's the best pedal representation of the tone of The Man himself. Check it:

http://www.soundclick.com/bands/page...songID=7133684

I'd like to hear the Grunge pedal do Powderfinger with any kind of sincerety! So maybe it still doesn't sound half as good as The Man himself but it still makes me all happy when I hear it!
Um... oops? If you look in my sig and notice the link titled "stoner doom"?

Ill admit I was lazy and was looking for an alternative for the sound I currently get out of the EM. I guess I could do some various settings.....

Remember, you don't have to play grunge with a grunge pedal, and everything sounds better on sharpies

Speaking of which, I picked up a "Magnum" sharpie today....

Oh and im sorry you think the EM sounds like **** with the gain cranked. To me it sounds like sex with a hot Asian chick while on various illicit substances whilst in orbit around Saturn.

Last edited by Nyarlathotep : 12-27-2008 at 10:22 PM.
  #18  
Old 12-27-2008, 10:29 PM
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If a digitech grunge is inappropriate for grunge (which I think we've established that) it's even less appropriate for stoner/doom. Unless it's the Behringer style stoner/doom that I saw live earlier tonight! No, great stuff.

Whatever makes you happy tone wise is fine, don't listen to me, but after hearing the Grunge pedal my fiance was actually very pleased with the sound of my Neil Young soundclips, hahahaha!

But look, I'm going to forego any smartass remarks about the sharpie comments and the sex with a hot asian comment, oh man there are just so many things to say which to choose? This is very hard for me to ignore so please accept my charity here! Hahahaha!

Last edited by Mark Olson : 12-28-2008 at 12:21 AM.
  #19  
Old 12-28-2008, 06:04 AM
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Ok so I've drank enough so let me give you one tip, if you're going to BS about your tone being like sex with a hot asian chick while on various illicit substances, don't do it with a guy who has actually done it. And it's nothing like your tone... mine maybe . Yours, no.
  #20  
Old 12-28-2008, 06:35 AM
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English Muddin'?

Not feeling either of the pedals at the given settings, and the grunge sounds nothing like EM to me. Are the Muddin's really so weak that they regularly break tubes? Custom sheet metal? Seems a bit extreme..
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