effect pedal for slapping?

[melkinsbass]

It seems like when I slap, I get mostly more highs and and attack sounds than substance. I haven't noticed this problem before, but I have a new amp and new bass. I thought using some of the onboard compression would help, but it hasn't seemed to. My amp is a Roland D-Bass 210 and the bass is a Stambaugh with Aero pickups (2 J Bass humbuckers. 1 P Bass) and a Mike Pope 4 band preamp. I run the amp flat and the Pope is flat with the exception of a slight cut in the low mids.
I'm not very savvy with effects; I've always ran clean. Do I need a limiter or comp? Maybe an EQ pedal? I am quite happy with my sound when playing fingerstlye or with a pick. Your advice is appreciated.

[funkstag]

An envelope filter is the solution to all your slap needs.

[melkinsbass]

How would the envelope filter help? When I've heard them they seemed to have a wah-like or modulatory effect. Are there other ways to use it?

[UncleJimmy]

An envelope filter could be cool if you're looking for that Funkadelic "Bawomp". If you are looking to just beef up the lows and give it more punch, an eq pedal is probably the way to go. I use the eq for a slap tone to bring out the lows and fill out the tone a little more. It's also usefull to bring the volume down a little bit so it isn't a huge difference from your regular level. A lot of folks will swear by a compressor, but I find it kills the dynamics. Just be careful, I've blown up more than my share of tweeters messing around with slap tones.

[JehuJava]

I would mess with the eq, first. Remember...those knobs were meant to be turned, they weren't put on to stay in the middle. My point is that I used to be afraid to use the eq because I didn't want color my sound or make it less true instrument sound so to speak...even if I was unhappy with my sound.

[sricks3]

+1 for EQ first. Sometimes it doesn't take much though, so turn those knobs slowly.

That being said, you said you want a little more substance, and it sounds like you may have a surplus of highs/attack. Why not put the low mids on the Mike Pope back to center (for a little extra substance) and pull the high mids down a little bit (to take out a little of your surplus attack)? It might not work for you, and I've never used a Mike Pope preamp, but it was the first thing I noticed in your post that sounded like a quick solution.

If leveling the low mids and cutting the high mids doesn't work for you, it might still be a good starting point. When you boost the low mids, is that the right frequency where your "substance" is at? If not, are you looking for a lower or higher frequency? The same goes with finding your "attack" frequency. When you cut (or boost) your high mids, is it affecting the "attack" the way you want it to be? Maybe so, or maybe you need to be adjusting treble knob instead. Let your ears tell you what's working and what's not.

Play that game with the controls on your bass and with the ones on your amp, and you'll find that you have much greater awareness and control over your tone. You still may not find the exact tone you're looking for (in which case a good EQ pedal, maybe even with parametric mids might be in your future), but you'll know how to get a lot closer.

The last two things that popped into my head are as follows:
1) If you're slapping closer to the bridge than the neck, try slapping closer towards the neck.
2) I'm not sure what pickup combination you're using when you slap, but consider favoring (or even soloing) the bridge pickup. Also, killing the P pickup while slapping might get you closer to what you're looking for.

I hope this helps you get a little closer. Good luck!

[devilock76]

I find a P pickup has more thump than J's when I slap, and I slap near the neck. On my P/J I pretty much solo the P pickup most of the time, sometimes mix in some of the J for certain songs. This is just in general slap or otherwise. On my J I am 100% on the neck pickup and 60-80% on the bridge pickup, if I slap though they are both on full. It is like an auto mid scoop for slapping.

My experience, may not apply to your ear or playing style.

Ken

[fivestringgecko]

Adjusting the EQ might help some, but using it to dial out some of your highs for slapping may affect your fingerstyle playing negatively and you may lose definition on notes. It sounds like a good compressor is what you're looking for. When you slap/pop, it creates some pretty wild peaks (volume spikes) in your sound. A compressor rolls off those peaks above a set point, smoothing out your sound rather than dialing out frequencies.

My experience with on-board compressors is that while they may be decent, you may be better off with a separate one. An "after-market" compressor will have more features and control which will let you sculpt your compression, rather than just the one knob that your D-bass has. I've tried a few different amps that have had on-board compression, and have never really liked it when compared to an actual out-board compressor.

I haven't tried it yet, but the new MXR Bass Compressor seems to be getting some good praise... you can control the attack and release on each note, which I suspect would be the key control that would benefit you the most. I just picked up a 3Leaf PWNZOR, which also has an Attack control. Very nice for controlling how fast the compressor defines the front of a note. I previously had (and still own) an EBS Multicomp... no Attack control (which I've really come to like with the PWNZOR), but still a good compressor. Not overly squishy and fairly subtle/transparent.

I tried my board without a compressor for a while, because like UncleJimmy, I felt that I wasn't quite as expressive as I could be. But with the recent purchase of the PWNZOR, I've reapproached compression, paid more attention to how I'm using it and realized that it can be a valuable tool for taming the peaks you're talking about and adding punch to my sound.

I'll point you to Bongomania, the resident TB compressor fanatic. He's got a couple of great pages up, which have helped me out quite a bit: Compressor FAQ and Compressor Reviews.

With a good compressor, you should be able to set the controls in a way that doesn't affect your fingerstyle playing, but helps control the slap stuff. I had to sit down with my PWNZOR to really figure that out, but now that I did... I'm glad I have a compressor back on my board.

5sg.

[melkinsbass]

Thanks for all of the suggestions! I do slap where the strings meet the end of the fingerboard. My problem with tweaking the preamp is that it would be mid song. There are a couple of tunes we do that I go back and forth between slapping and fingerstyle between songs. I'm not sure I could do the tweaking in enough time.
It would be easier for me to solo the P pup, so that is definitely one of the things I will try.
I'll also try borrowing an EQ pedal and see how that works. The comp on the amp sounds fine with the other styles of playing (I don't use much) but not with slap. I realize it's a one trick pony deal and there are dedicated units which are way better. Any suggestions on comps or EQ pedals I should take a look at?

[bassjam]

+another for working with your EQ first.But-

Like in my case I go from finger style to slap alot during the night.For that Id suggest a preamp pedal that has a couple presets.Right now Im liking the VT Deluxe pedal and also the BDDI Programable.Im auditioning both at the moment.Ive also tried several others.But you can preset the fingerstyle tone you like as well as the slap tone you like and switch with a stomp.Its worked pretty well for me.You can also do it with the EQ on your bass but we go from song to song pretty fast and I find I was dropping out to turn knobs.

[fivestringgecko]

Bassjam has a really good suggestion for pedals that have presets.

Me personally, I'm a set-it-and-forget-it guy though, and I try to eliminate things I have to think about during a show. I've worked long and hard on my rig/technique so that I can switch between the two styles of playing without having to adjust controls or stomp a switch.

5sg.

[bassjam]

Originally Posted by fivestringgecko

Bassjam has a really good suggestion for pedals that have presets.

Me personally, I'm a set-it-and-forget-it guy though, and I try to eliminate things I have to think about during a show. I've worked long and hard on my rig/technique so that I can switch between the two styles of playing without having to adjust controls or stomp a switch.

5sg.

I would love to be able to do that-My finger style tone and slap tone are miles apart from each other.Ive tried though.

Funny thing though-for some reason as time goes by Im growing toward a fatter rounder finger tone-they may one day be in the same universe.Lol.

[JehuJava]

Also...if you set the eq for you slap and that's too boomy for fingerstyle, try altering the position where you play. Moving towards the bridge for fingerstyle may help even out your sound.

[bassjam]

Originally Posted by JehuJava

Also...if you set the eq for you slap and that's too boomy for fingerstyle, try altering the position where you play. Moving towards the bridge for fingerstyle may help even out your sound.

Oh believe me-Ive tried it all.Not to get to off topic from the OP's question-I find my bass has a sweet spot where I love the finger tone I get-moving my position looses that sweet spot for me anyway.Im actually loving both tones I get(slap and finger),but it is two different EQ settings for sure.Small price to pay really.

[melkinsbass]

Fivestringgecko:
Thanks for the reference to the Bongomania site. It's a huge wealth of information: amazing?
I think I might venture to try a comp...maybe the Aguilar TLC or Markbass Comp. I'll see if it does the trick. I won't be able to get before this weekend's gigs, so that'll give me some time to mess with the EQ. I'm a little leery about it, though, since I like the fingerstyle (and occasional pick) tone I'm getting, but it's worth a try... and cheaper :-)

[melkinsbass]

that was supposed to be "amazing" with a !, not a ?
whoops