I think I want a fuzz...

[Unrepresented]

But have yet to like a single soundclip posted here or on retailers' sites.

With absolutely no disrespect intended to those who take the time and effort to try and bring us samples and reviews, I'm left wondering if it's the recording process or the fuzz "genre" itself that's leaving me cold.

Am I misunderstanding what a "fuzz" should sound like? Is the big slab of biting, but thick and brassy, slashed speakers, but gated and still thoroughly controllable goodness in my head more in the distortion family?

Does fuzz into a soundcard lack all the special speaker and amplifier qualities that transform it into something special instead of the oversaturated sound of fizziness?

Andrew Seward gets a great tone at the end of "Animal" and searches have led me to believe he uses a Prescription Electonics Depth Charge on this track, however, any clips of the Depth Charge seem lacking in whatever studio magic was there during Against Me!'s recording, and I'd prefer not to drop $250 on a pedal I only assume I'll like...

Oh, and dare I mention that I really love Tim C's tone on Evil Empire or will that derail this thread?

I know I'm not looking for smooth. I know I'm not looking for sustain. I know I'm not looking for excessive bright overtones, but at the same time don't want something dark that will fall into the bottomless chasm of a rockband mix...

Something that grunts. Something organic. Something that's controllable, and still allows for the rhythmic aspect of the bass to play its role. Something with enough clarity to hear the notes.

Help me Fuzzy Talkbassers, you're my only hope.

Justin

[Ryan Mohr]

I think a Fuzz Face or clone would be good for your description.

[bongomania]

I don't. To me the Face has always meant smoothness and sustain.

FWIW I do think something marketed as a "distortion" will probably get you closer to the sound you're describing. Fuzzes pretty much always muddy up the signal (in a good way, if that's the sound you want).

As far as "studio magic", it's worth noting that a lot of pro productions involve two or three channels for the bass, each channel processed differently and recombined "to taste" by the engineer. It's hard to get those tones just plugging a bass into a single fx pedal and then into a single amp. Also the recording/mixdown devices themselves are often a key part of the tone.

[Ryan Mohr]

Originally Posted by bongomania

I don't. To me the Face has always meant smoothness and sustain.

FWIW I do think something marketed as a "distortion" will probably get you closer to the sound you're describing. Fuzzes pretty much always muddy up the signal (in a good way, if that's the sound you want).

As far as "studio magic", it's worth noting that a lot of pro productions involve two or three channels for the bass, each channel processed differently and recombined "to taste" by the engineer. It's hard to get those tones just plugging a bass into a single fx pedal and then into a single amp. Also the recording/mixdown devices themselves are often a key part of the tone.

The reason I recommended a Fuzz Face is because when you roll down the volume knob a little on your bass you can get a grittier sound.

[brucebruce]

I hate to burst your bubble... but in my experience, good fuzzes and distortion and/or O/D pedals do NOT come cheap. I use the Colorsound Bass Fuzz, $300. In my opinion the warmest fuzz on the planet (no tone suck). In terms of O/D I use the Tech21 XXL Bass Edition; it's not the most brutal O/D available... I use it as my dirty channel, very gritty sound... combined with an EQ it gets the job done...

I really don't think you'll find what you are looking for in a $100 pedal... and I totally agree with 'bongomania', ignore studio tracks... you can create boundless tone with modern multi-track recording (especially with a big budget)... listen for the sound you seek through a simple set up BASS > PEDAL (?) > AMP...

Hope this helps... NB: I totally agree with you regarding the online samples... often they are a complete misrepresentation of the product/pedal in question...

[Unrepresented]

Originally Posted by bongomania

I don't. To me the Face has always meant smoothness and sustain.

Sustain doesn't have to be a dealbreaker for me, but I really want something that's got enough chop to it that I can control the notes when needed.

Originally Posted by bongomania

FWIW I do think something marketed as a "distortion" will probably get you closer to the sound you're describing. Fuzzes pretty much always muddy up the signal (in a good way, if that's the sound you want).

I know there's gray areas over how much clipping qualifies as fuzz v. distortion and that's part of my question, since there doesn't seem to be an international convention over where the official boundary lies... perhaps I like more distortionl-like fuzzes but less extreme versions?

Originally Posted by bongomania

As far as "studio magic", it's worth noting that a lot of pro productions involve two or three channels for the bass, each channel processed differently and recombined "to taste" by the engineer. It's hard to get those tones just plugging a bass into a single fx pedal and then into a single amp. Also the recording/mixdown devices themselves are often a key part of the tone.

Absolutely. And on the other end of the spectrum home hobbyists recording bass samples directly to their soundcard are likely not going to sound as good as a quality bass and rig live in person will. I'm just trying to figure out how much of the issues lies in the limits of home recording ease, and how much of it is me not knowing which end of the distortion v. fuzz spectrum I think I want.

Would you consider the Tendbender and clones to be a fuzz or distortion?

[Unrepresented]

Originally Posted by brucebruce

I hate to burst your bubble... but in my experience, good fuzzes and distortion and/or O/D pedals do NOT come cheap. I use the Colorsound Bass Fuzz, $300. In my opinion the warmest fuzz on the planet (no tone suck). In terms of O/D I use the Tech21 XXL Bass Edition; it's not the most brutal O/D available... I use it as my dirty channel, very gritty sound... combined with an EQ it gets the job done...

I really don't think you'll find what you are looking for in a $100 pedal... and I totally agree with 'bongomania', ignore studio tracks... you can create boundless tone with modern multi-track recording (especially with a big budget)... listen for the sound you seek through a simple set up BASS > PEDAL (?) > AMP...

I think the cheapest pedal I own is $150 street price, I'm aware I'll need to drop dough, and prepared to go the boutique route if need be.

I'm open to suggestions, and while cost will likely play some role in making a decision, I mostly used the example of the $250 for the Depth Charge to complain about the difficulties of experiencing and hearing the pedals. I'm okay with spending $250 on a pedal I like. I just don't want to make it a habit of dropping that on pedals I don't.

Originally Posted by brucebruce

Hope this helps... NB: I totally agree with you regarding the online samples... often they are a complete misrepresentation of the product/pedal in question...

Yeah, that's my issue. I have a feeling I'm writing off quality pedals because of what I may presume are unflattering clips.

[brucebruce]

The Colorsound Bass Fuzz I mentioned earlier is the Tonebender tailored specifically for Bass... both made in London by Colorsound...

[(b)Assman]

If you're going to get a fuzz for the love of god get one that still has bottom end to it or else you might as well be playing 6 string. I have a MXR 181 which is nice. I hear Bassballs and Way Huge Swollen Pickle are good too.

[Unrepresented]

Originally Posted by brucebruce

The Colorsound Bass Fuzz I mentioned earlier is the Tonebender tailored specifically for Bass... both made in London by Colorsound...

Ah, I think that's actually what I'd been thinking of. There's a clip of it on youtube sounding very much like what I have in mind.

I've been curious about the Barber Trifecta because it's a clone of the Tonebender as well as two other fuzzes if it can comp the tone in a smaller and more convenient package as well as have more versitility then it might be worth picking up.

Originally Posted by (b)Assman

If you're going to get a fuzz for the love of god get one that still has bottom end to it or else you might as well be playing 6 string. I have a MXR 181 which is nice. I hear Bassballs and Way Huge Swollen Pickle are good too.

I definitely want to retain low end, but tone is equally important to me. I have a blender that I can run it through if need be to get fundamental back -- the Guyatone TZ-2 clips are promising for that reason. There's a youtube clip of a guy biamping one and it sounds great.

[rhcp32291]

Originally Posted by jayarroz

Big Muff

Big muff loses a lot of articulation.

[bongomania]

Originally Posted by jayarroz

Big Muff

Classic example of somebody reading the thread title but not actually reading the post.

[RickenBoogie]

Actually, I love when that happens. More curiously interesting reading.

[bass_is_lyfe815]

i'd say go to your local music store and try the mxr d.i. pedal. i find that pedal to be amazing

[dannster]

Check out this article from Bass Player Magazine.

Tons of audio clips. from all kinds of pedals. Although limited to one tone track per pedal. I found it an awesome starting point.
I ended up getting the T-Rex Bass Juice for its versatility and tone.


http://www.bassplayer.com/story.aspx?content_id=24670

[kevteop]

The MXR Blowtorch remains pretty usable and tight even when cranked and has lots of tone control on-board, plus a clean blend, and you might even find one in a store you can try out to see if you can get a sound you like out of it.

Also, have you listened to the samples on Chunk Systems' website for the Brown Dog? That's about as sharply gated a fuzz as I've ever heard, but it's very modern-sounding - not sure if that's what you're after.

[B.C.]

I would check out one of the Electronix pedals.

http://www.musicelectronix.com/

Both are really articulate and controllable.

[Unrepresented]

Originally Posted by kevteop

The MXR Blowtorch remains pretty usable and tight even when cranked and has lots of tone control on-board, plus a clean blend, and you might even find one in a store you can try out to see if you can get a sound you like out of it.

Also, have you listened to the samples on Chunk Systems' website for the Brown Dog? That's about as sharply gated a fuzz as I've ever heard, but it's very modern-sounding - not sure if that's what you're after.

Used to own a Blowtorch. Felt it was too "fizzy" and not nearly organic enough for my tastes. The samples suggest the Chunk Systems is too, but again, that's my issue, how to tell if the samples are doing a pedal justice?

Originally Posted by dannster

Check out this article from Bass Player Magazine.

Tons of audio clips. from all kinds of pedals. Although limited to one tone track per pedal. I found it an awesome starting point.
I ended up getting the T-Rex Bass Juice for its versatility and tone.


http://www.bassplayer.com/story.aspx?content_id=24670

I've checked that out before, it's hard to imagine the pedals actually being run into the tone changing qualities of an amp/speaker set up, there's a lot of potential for coloration...

Found what was perhaps the worst sample of the Bass Juice (for my tastes at least) on youtube by what sounds to be a talented bassist...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JDn45pM38xk

Definitely the opposite sound of what I'm going for, again hard to tell if it's the active bass, the poor eq, the recording itself, or the pedal....

Originally Posted by bass_is_lyfe815

i'd say go to your local music store and try the mxr d.i. pedal. i find that pedal to be amazing

I'll check it out. I've got a good local boutique pedal dealer I've gone to before to check out bass fuzzes from and that time I ended up buying my BassDrive. Happy with the bassdrive, but getting that craving for a fuzz again to expand the possibilities.

Originally Posted by bongomania

Classic example of somebody reading the thread title but not actually reading the post.

Yeah, I didn't want to say outright in my first post that I'm not looking for a muff clone, but was hoping it was kinda implied...

[bigchiefbc]

Devi Ever makes a few gated fuzzes that retain a lot of low-end, although they tend to be on the synthier side of fuzz, not as organic as you're probably looking for. The Bass Fuzz, the Bit and I think the Cherry Pop are all known for retaining a fair amount of low-end. There is a clip in the wiki of me playing a Bit through my rig, and then miked (albeit with a crappy computer mic), so its a little different than a direct-to-soundcard clip.

Also, have you thought about a Zvex Wooly Mammoth? I would consider that one organic yet gated

[Unrepresented]

Originally Posted by bigchiefbc

Devi Ever makes a few gated fuzzes that retain a lot of low-end, although they tend to be on the synthier side of fuzz, not as organic as you're probably looking for. The Bass Fuzz, the Bit and I think the Cherry Pop are all known for retaining a fair amount of low-end. There is a clip in the wiki of me playing a Bit through my rig, and then miked (albeit with a crappy computer mic), so its a little different than a direct-to-soundcard clip.

Also, have you thought about a Zvex Wooly Mammoth? I would consider that one organic yet gated

Found some clips of the Devi Ever stuff on youtube. It sounded as if it had some boominess added on and the tone wasn't quite what I'm looking for.

I've tried the Mammoth out twice with high expectations, neither time was what I was hoping for. I remember having issues with it using a G&L bass, probably because of the high output, and it wasn't a standout, especially for being a $300 one trick pony.