I want to be an effects junkie but it’s proving harder than I thought

[Implosion]

Background
My basic signal chain is made of the following: Bass > Pitchblack > Multicomp (always on) > PBDDI (as a preamp, always on, usually close to the ‘distorted bass’ preset) > Power amp > Cab. Even though the PBDDI is set to approximate the distorted bass preset, I hear it more as a borderline of strong overdrive and slight distortion.

The problem
I've always been interested in effect pedals and I like to be able to construct my sound with out a separate amp (thus the pedal preamp solution). So I began my effects acquirements last year (even bought a Gator pedal board) and here is what I’ve been through so far. First I bought the Digitech Bass Synth Wah but I found out I didn’t need an octaver and had no use for synths, filters and wahs. So when I found out that those things were not for me I ventured into the world of modulation.

I got an EBS Unichorus but was quite disappointed with it. The chorus was just meh, the pitch modulation was useless for me and the flanger was too mild. From what I’ve understood from reading TB, the flanger mode on the Unichorus just increases the delay time on the pedal so I figured I need a real flanger pedal. Enter the Boss BF-2: awful, just plain awful. Too zingy and artificial, I couldn't dial out anything that would convince me to use this pedal. This got me thinking that maybe a phaser would suit me better than a flanger because it seems that TB is loaded with phaser vs flanger topics and people usually favor one over the other. Therefore I got myself a Boss PH-3. Nope, it didn’t do a thing for me. Then I thought that what if these modulation pedals I have tried have just not been the right presentation of what is out there; maybe I should get something that gives me a broader horizon over modulation. So I went out and bought the Line 6 MM4. This purchase convinced me that modulation just isn’t my thing. All the effects were just too mild and lame (could be also the fact the effects modeled on the MM4 are ‘vintage effects’ and don’t have that much edge in them).

When modulation didn’t seem to work for me, I thought that the only way to go from here is the realm of distorted sound. I have never liked the sound of fuzz on bass and I have the Sansamp for overdriven sounds, so I thought that I would try a dedicated distortion pedal. I bought the Tech 21 XLL Bass Edition and pretty much from the first time I kicked the pedal on I didn’t like anything that came out of it. The XXL had way too much distortion and noise (not as the sound of noise, but as in the music style) for my taste.

To sum it up. I’ve spent lots of time with these pedals tweaking and twisting out all the possibilities and also trying different settings on my preamp at the same time, but no matter what I did, there was nothing that was able to convince me on the abilities of these pedals. Therefore I have ended up with selling them all (luckily everything was acquired used and I’ve made a small profit on selling them so this hasn’t actually cost me anything).

Now I turn to you fellow TB’ers and ask for suggestions on what I should try next or should I just give up on effects. Have the effects that I have tried just been poor presentations of what is out there or is it just that effects are not for me? There are two things/sounds that I’m after. First one is the ethereal and atmospheric sound for delicate parts and the second one is the end of the world type of explosion that is perfect for song endings. So, what to do and where to go? I’m open for suggestions.

[Diddii]

i have few questions for you first

1) didn't you like the effects when you were playing alone or with the band? (this can make a diffrence, i've owned pedals that sound great alone and just don't make it when i'm playing with others - i quess this can go the otherway around to..?)

2) what kind of music do you listen to? (i got the idea of effects while listening to other bands, i even posted a thread here called "what band/musician did inspire you to use effects" to see how people get ideas to use effects)

What i've experienced is that although i don't find the use of an effect right away, there is always a time when i have it on my board and can try it when my band is writing originals..

[Azalin]

You have tried the ebs unichorus which is supposedly one of the best chorus pedals out there. It's analog too so i guess this wasn't about being too digitalized.Just not your thing in the end. The chorus i mean.
You have tried the boss phaser. It's a good phaser overall with various settings and options, but most of the people that don't get along with the boss effects is because they are somewhat digital compared to the better/analog/more expensive ones. Hence the lower price.
Kinda same with the boss flanger as well.
If you didn't like any of the sounds coming out of them, i guess phaser/flanger ain't your thing either.
You also tried the XXL distortion pedal. It's one of the most extreme pedals out there (along with the odb-3 imo), and that's convenient enough for the people hat actually look for that effect. Not for you either =p
You seem to be pleased (as most of the people that use it) with the overdrive section of the VT bass. I'm not, due to the absence of the mids knob. There are cooler ODs out there for you to try, cause i kinda think what you really prefer is an OD in regards to "bass distortion".
You really need to try a cool reverb to be able to reach that ethereal sound you're looking for the most atmospheric moments. There were times i hated my reverb and was totally against it for bass, and others i used it all the time. I'm in the second one right now.
This reverb along with distortion and/or some delay experimentation, will also help for the all out ending of the songs.
My viewpoint comes from a post rock/space rock/doom rock sound.
If you described what kind of sound you would like to reach, it would be much easier.

[cheapbasslovin]

I don't always use my effects in any gig. Sometimes it's just some me time to be obnoxious.

I think you may be at a point where you wait until there is a sound you want that you can't get (preferably with a sound clip) and then ask how to do it.

I will say that using a BassSynthWah as en example that you don't need octave/filter/wah may have been a bit premature. BSW has its place, but it isn't the standard bearer for the class and doesn't really sound like most other pedals in that class.

With modulations, there seems to be a little disconnect about what you want: Too mild and lame on the MM-4, too zingy and artificial on the BF-2. Are you looking for the porridge that's just right, or do you just not like modulation when it gets thick enough for you to notice in a mix?

For phaser I recommend a Small Stone. with the color switch up it's a pretty notable sound, which I know isn't in the MM4 and I don't think you'll get from the Boss. You may also want to take a look at delay options. They don't change your tone at all, just play your tone back.

[old-fashioned]

Trying to find a reason for adding a new effect into a song which I've already got used to play without that effect is usually difficult for me. In my case new effects work better in new songs.

[TheDude007]

+1 to Small Stone. I use the Phase 90, and there's some debate between which one's better. I like them both. I run like this: Bass > Pitchblack > Bass Big Muff > Phase 90 > Memory Boy > M80 DI > amp. I dig the Phase 90 because the one big knob can be adjusted on the fly with your foot. Also, by running the muff before it, you can get some awesome sounds with the distortion through the phaser. I usually keep the phaser wave speed turned down pretty low. I'd say that it never goes above like 10:00-11:00.

[Robertron]

Honestly, Implosion, effects may really just not be your thing! ()

Now, your experience with the BSW should not prevent you from trying any other octave pedals or envelope filter pedals. A dedicated envelope filter that has some more control over the tone may be what you prefer instead. Try out the DOD FX25 or FX25B, EHX Bass Balls, Source Audio Bass Envelope Filter, Iron Ether Xerograph, EHX Enigma QBalls, or 3 Leaf Audio Groove Regulator I or II. Try searching for them through youtube, searching for clips on this forum, or trying them out yourself. If after that you still don't like filters then I guess it truly isn't an effect for you

Don't let the BSW discourage you from octave pedals either. The Boss OC-2 or OC-3, the Foxrox Octron I or II, EHX MicroPOG or POG2, MXR Bass Octave Deluxe, and Aguilar Octamizer all get used and mentioned on this forum. Each of these pedals has either more flexibility in sound or better tracking than the Octave effect on the BSW so don't give up on octave's yet!

Being an effects junkie like some of us isn't something you can force. You either are or you aren't.

[RNV]

I too just started to get GAS for effects. I'm in an original trash/death metal band and really have no reason to use effects except a chorus every once in a while and my VT is always on. But I still get them and try them out without the band and try to find a place for them. I have written a lot of songs that are effects friendly and my band agrees that the are great for the riffs I wrote, but the music doesn't fit the band. So I'll write a bunch more and one of my guitarist wants to start a side project with my effected bass lines and we'll go from there. Some music just isn't effect friendly and that may be your hangup without realizing it.

[onosson]

I'll vouch for the MXR Phase 90 ... but the Phase 100 is even better for bass, IME.

[RNV]

I too have the Phase 90 and love it.

[IncX]

the only effects that stuck on my board are:

1.) Red Witch Moonphaser - it is awesome, but i have to admit, i barely use it on songs.
2.) Snarling Dogs Bootzilla FuzzWah - again, a lot more fun than practical
3.) Visual Sound H2O - i only use it when im playing too many whole notes, and that's rare.
4.) Carl Martin Contour and Boost - just to give my sound a little grit. but for the most part, i just attack the strings harder to get that sound.

in conclusion - i could live without my pedals. the only reason im not selling them is because i dont like selling at a loss

[BigOldHarry]

Don't stress - you don't like fx - then you now have extra money. What's the downside???

[Jumbotron]

I actually have the same basic effects as you do: pitchblack, multicomp and PBDDI always on. Between them, I've got filters galore and some dirt. I love it. One recommendation I have is that when you try other effects out, you might think of reducing the drive on the PBDDI a bit. Some folks find that they like overdrive before modulations and filters, rather than after, and that may be part of your problem. I run my PBDDI pretty clean (a little warm, if anything) and then use other pedals in front of it (a Leeds, which is awesome, and some forthcoming fuzz) when I want overdrive.

[Jojoe972]

Originally Posted by Diddii

i have few questions for you first

1) didn't you like the effects when you were playing alone or with the band? (this can make a diffrence, i've owned pedals that sound great alone and just don't make it when i'm playing with others - i quess this can go the otherway around to..?)

2) what kind of music do you listen to? (i got the idea of effects while listening to other bands, i even posted a thread here called "what band/musician did inspire you to use effects" to see how people get ideas to use effects)

What i've experienced is that although i don't find the use of an effect right away, there is always a time when i have it on my board and can try it when my band is writing originals..

I love my big muff by myself, but when i hate it when playing with others. I love distortion though...so I'm still experimenting.

[kevteop]

If you don't like the sound of effects on your bass then don't use them and save yourself a small fortune.

In most rock bands effects on the bass (other than subtle modulation or overdrive) don't really work very well anyway. And in many other types of bands whether the sounds work or not you're only going to get disapproving looks from the guitarist just for trying.

[Matt Dean]

Originally Posted by Robertron

Honestly, Implosion, effects may really just not be your thing! ()

Now, your experience with the BSW should not prevent you from trying any other octave pedals or envelope filter pedals. A dedicated envelope filter that has some more control over the tone may be what you prefer instead. Try out the DOD FX25 or FX25B, EHX Bass Balls, Source Audio Bass Envelope Filter, Iron Ether Xerograph, EHX Enigma QBalls, or 3 Leaf Audio Groove Regulator I or II. Try searching for them through youtube, searching for clips on this forum, or trying them out yourself. If after that you still don't like filters then I guess it truly isn't an effect for you

Don't let the BSW discourage you from octave pedals either. The Boss OC-2 or OC-3, the Foxrox Octron I or II, EHX MicroPOG or POG2, MXR Bass Octave Deluxe, and Aguilar Octamizer all get used and mentioned on this forum. Each of these pedals has either more flexibility in sound or better tracking than the Octave effect on the BSW so don't give up on octave's yet!

Being an effects junkie like some of us isn't something you can force. You either are or you aren't.

+ 1... on all of the above.

While I seriously love effects, I actually use them judiciously in the bands I play in. I also use them in a range of intensity... i.e., sometimes the effect is barely on... sometimes the effect dominates.

Lastly, I'm a sucker for high-end analogue effects... I just think they sound better. When I use an effect, I want it to sound as good as my uneffected tone.

So, I guess, what I'm trying to say is follow you ears... just don't attempt to be an "effects junkie" just because you think it cool or you can afford to; start walking this path because it sounds good and of course it's fun, which is why I'm playing music in the first place.

[Crabby]

I went through a phase of having a huge pedal board full of mediocre effects and found that it was really quite silly. I have since found a few choice pedals that really work well for bass and am really enjoying having a smaller pedal board with a few high end analog pedals that I actually use. This is what I settled on:

Bass into Pitchblack tuner, Xotic Robotalk 2 filter, Xotic BB preamp (overdrive), Homebrew Electronics Psilocybe (phaser).

Three effects and a tuner mounted on a Pedaltrain Mini. Sometimes a little less is more!

[Matt Dean]

I'm with you Crabby... although I have six choice pedals plus a tuner.

[Implosion]

Whoa, nice response! Thank you fellow TB'ers!

Some of you asked about the music that I play and what kind of bands / type of music are the tonal goals that I have. I kinda let that one out on purpose because in my current band my basic signal chain gives me the sound that I want. Well close enough anyway. There actually isn't that much room for effects in the music that we play (tech(ish) death metal in B-standard in the vain of Origin, Psycroptic, Decapitated, etc.). The only times that I feel that effects could add something to the texture are the slower and longer tapping parts. I tried the modulation effects for this, but it just didn't work out. The music we play might be a factor because in this case the slower part still equals to eight note triplets at 230 bpm, so I guess there isn't that much room to "paint a scenery". Or maybe I just can't tweak out the sounds to fill my needs.

But where my tonal goals actually are is a secret vice of mine: Post-Metal. ISIS and such. My current needs are for home studio use and possibly live if I'll eventually get to form another band (probably not going to happen until the kids have all grown up. O spare-time where art thou? ). So I guess I'll just have to stick on trying the modulation effects to see if I can eventually find something that I like. I just probably need to take a little break from them. Like you have suggested, I've been thinking about adding delays and reverbs in to the equation because it seems that modulation alone is not filling my needs.

One thing that I have also considered is the basic "problem" with my signal chain as the Sansamp is working as a pre feeding a line level signal to the power amp. This arrangement forces me to place all the effects before the Sansamp because the line level signal otherwise clips their inputs and the only solution is to turn my volume down and then I don't have enough juice running to the power amp. Now this is of course only a problem with a band and not when recording with a DI, but for some reason all the effects I've tried have still sounded better before the Sansamp (might be due to the high-end roll off and sealed cab emulation of the Sansamp). So everything is pre drive and this has got me thinking that maybe I should get the Deluxe version of the Bass Driver which has got a effects loop that is post drive. Maybe that could help me to find the porridge that is just right (nice one cheapbasslovin ). Or maybe it is just that I'm too picky. Which reminds me that for some reason all the modulation and distortion effects sounded better when played with a pick. Unfortunately I am an annoying fingerstyle purist (i.e. don't know how to play with a pick even if my life would depend on it ) so this doesn't help. I probably should investigate on how to add definition/bite/atttack to my playing to get the same kind of results.

And to end with some additional rambling. I also though that the Bass Synth Wah was a bad selection and not all synths, filters and octavers should be held accountable for the sounds that the Digitech produces. Also, why do some effect pedals have so little control over the effect? A single knob? C'mon, I want to be able to tweak the effect so a plethora of knobs is what I like (this might also be the root of all my problems).

[Azalin]

Well for death metal purposes, nothing of the effects you have tried fits right in. And from my experience, death metallers will never like the effects anyway. Especially from bassists. I've seen their looks.

For the post metal stuff, there is pretty much a pattern.
Usually there is more than 1 guitar. Even if it's not, there will be serious reverbing/delaying/looping on the aggressive parts from the guitars to create that wall of sound.
Lots of distortion and lots of extra guitars in that parts too.

So, in order to be able to hear yourself (cut through in the mix), any type of distortion won't help you much (unless you "blend" your clean signal to always leave it there untouched). Your bass will get lost in the wall-sound like another guitar.
Clean bass is the way to go imo. Maybe some light overdrive or distortion just for the "touch", but always blended.

For the building and the more atmospheric parts, chorus or reverb as i already said in my previous post, is always cool, since the bass will be main and guitars will build on that. Isis' bassist mainly uses reverb for example.