Kurt Stier & Chicago Iron!!!!!!!

[Trapeze Fan]

I purchased a used Para-Baby off eBay and it arrived w/no power supply other than the internal 9v battery. Knowing that makes me the worst kind of customer a business in these depressed times could possibly have.........I contacted Chicago Iron w/a great deal of angst about whether they would answer my "power" questions. Within hours of my emai to their site, Kurt Stier responded and answered all my questions. We then had a multi-email correspondence about effects rigs which was extremely cool. He is just finishing an exact replica setup exactly like David Gilmour's "Pulse" tour rig. I sent him pics of my Geezer bass. He turned me on to some really interesting info about all of the new stuff he just sent Geezer for his '09 tour! What an incredible asset to the music and bass playing community and an overall really nice guy!!!! Patronize Chicago Iron because merchants like Kurt Stier deserve your business and work hard to get it. He could have ignored me, but he didn't!!!!!

[bigchiefbc]

Good to hear that you had a good experience with them. It's always helpful when a business cares about customer experience.

On the other hand, I will never give Kurt a cent of business. He showed up in a thread last year about a new Wilson wah based on the Parapedal, slammed Kevin Wilson (who is quite respected around here), and acted like a petulant f&*^ing child. He lost the respect of pretty much everyone who saw how he acted. Anyone interested in what I'm talking about can see it here.

[Trapeze Fan]

Gee bigchiefbc, I don't know but it sounds like he knows what he's talking about. As an attorney with 30 years of practice under my belt.....and that's not "office practice"; it's all trial work in the trenches fighting and scraping for everything I could get for my clients within law and ethics........I don't think he's being petulant at all when he defends his patent/trademark identity. That's sort of the point of going thru all the litigation he went thru to own the marks, and I can only imagine the attorney's fees involved. Of the over 3,000 lawyers we have here in San Antonio, the 8th largest city in the nation, there are only about 5 trademark/patent lawyers in town. I graduated from law school 30 years ago with one of them, and they charge an astronomical amount of money per hour. I charge $350 per hour in court and patent lawyers charge at least twice that for every hour they work. Having spent all that money to do it the right way and own the name, I can see why he's mad when someone takes it without asking. Also, if he's right about the inferiority of the other product IN HIS MIND ALONE, that's all that matters. As the owner of the mark, he has a right to be offended if he believes an inferior product might damage the name and goodwill of his product he has fought to own and produce. If you invented something and built your livelihood around it and it was what fed your family, you'd probably feel the same if someone just came along and tried to take it away from you. I'm one of these people who supports people like Lars and Metallica in their fight to own their product and make money off it just as I support the old black delta blues men in their quest to make the people who have ripped them off pay them for their work, their genius and their courage. I'm not into socialism and everyone owning what I've worked for. I'm an unashamed capitalist..............and I happen to be a liberal democrat who voted for Obama too!!!!!!!!!!! And before you jump to any other conclusions, I grew up in Odessa, Texas, played football at Odessa Permian in the early 70's and was a linebacker.............so, no, I'm not some Ivy League sissy with white guilt. I just believe you have a right to own what you've worked for.........to own what you own..........and to defend it against anyone you believe is trying to rip you off. But, then again, maybe I'm wrong about all this. Nobody's perfect.

[bigchiefbc]

Originally Posted by Trapeze Fan

Gee bigchiefbc, I don't know but it sounds like he knows what he's talking about. As an attorney with 30 years of practice under my belt.....and that's not "office practice"; it's all trial work in the trenches fighting and scraping for everything I could get for my clients within law and ethics........I don't think he's being petulant at all when he defends his patent/trademark identity. That's sort of the point of going thru all the litigation he went thru to own the marks, and I can only imagine the attorney's fees involved. Of the over 3,000 lawyers we have here in San Antonio, the 8th largest city in the nation, there are only about 5 trademark/patent lawyers in town. I graduated from law school 30 years ago with one of them, and they charge an astronomical amount of money per hour. I charge $350 per hour in court and patent lawyers charge at least twice that for every hour they work. Having spent all that money to do it the right way and own the name, I can see why he's mad when someone takes it without asking. Also, if he's right about the inferiority of the other product IN HIS MIND ALONE, that's all that matters. As the owner of the mark, he has a right to be offended if he believes an inferior product might damage the name and goodwill of his product he has fought to own and produce. If you invented something and built your livelihood around it and it was what fed your family, you'd probably feel the same if someone just came along and tried to take it away from you. I'm one of these people who supports people like Lars and Metallica in their fight to own their product and make money off it just as I support the old black delta blues men in their quest to make the people who have ripped them off pay them for their work, their genius and their courage. I'm not into socialism and everyone owning what I've worked for. I'm an unashamed capitalist..............and I happen to be a liberal democrat who voted for Obama too!!!!!!!!!!! And before you jump to any other conclusions, I grew up in Odessa, Texas, played football at Odessa Permian in the early 70's and was a linebacker.............so, no, I'm not some Ivy League sissy with white guilt. I just believe you have a right to own what you've worked for.........to own what you own..........and to defend it against anyone you believe is trying to rip you off. But, then again, maybe I'm wrong about all this. Nobody's perfect.

wut

























Just kidding, I love doing that.

A few things.

First of all, calm the &U^% down. I wasn't insulting you. I was expressing an opinion about Kurt personally that many others on this forum shared in the thread I linked to. I don't think he sold any units with that appearance here.

Second of all, don't give me your resume. I'm not impressed. That is not a good way to win an argument. I can sit here and say that I'm an attorney as well. Is that true? Yes. Does it matter? No. Does that give you or me any inherent authority when arguing about things? Absolutely not, it is an appeal to authority rather than making an argument.

Third, (this is an admittedly minor point) Kurt didn't invent *&^$. He now owns the rights to the Tychobrahe line, but he bought it; he didn't invent it. Don't make it sound like people are ripping off the guy who invented this great product.

Four, AND MOST IMPORTANTLY, Wilson effects absolutely did not claim that this was an authorized reproduction of the Parapedal. Trademark law is primarily concerned with not fooling the consumer into thinking that two things are the same or related when they are not. Patent Law is absolutely not relevant to this conversation, as there is no patent at issue here.

And lastly, even if we toss out all the preceding points, Kurt did not help Chicago Iron at all with exploding in a forum full of consumers like that. If he wants to sell units, he should learn something about the way you carry yourself in a public place, and the way that it can affect your sales. Because everyone here was completely turned off to him, and several people in that thread said they would never buy his pedal because of how he acted.

[rcubed]

I think we need to ban lawyer talk in the effects forum. Save it for the bass and amp forums.

[Thunderscreech]

Originally Posted by rcubed

I think we need to ban lawyer talk in the effects forum. Save it for the bass and amp forums.

Seconded.



Also: Personal opinion (OH NOES!!!! I AM PERMITTED TO HAVE ONE!!!) I don't really see how dude from Chicago Iron is coming across as a douche. I really don't.

[Thunderscreech]

Originally Posted by bigchiefbc

Good to hear that you had a good experience with them. It's always helpful when a business cares about customer experience.

On the other hand, I will never give Kurt a cent of business. He showed up in a thread last year about a new Wilson wah based on the Parapedal, slammed Kevin Wilson (who is quite respected around here), and acted like a petulant f&*^ing child. He lost the respect of pretty much everyone who saw how he acted. Anyone interested in what I'm talking about can see it here.

[grygrx]

Necro Posts deleted. Closed.