Lot of Options

m3t4lhed · #1 01-11-2008, 12:09 AM

Ok usually there are a lot of EQing options when someone uses a redular setup with an Active Bass.
The EQ on the bass, the EQ on the Preamp pedal and the EQ on the amp. If i had this setup (which i will in sometime) it would confuse the f*** outta me and i would end up cracking my skull against the amp. I want to know how you guys overcome this problem and the step by step procedure of you finding your tone

bongomania · #2 01-11-2008, 12:17 AM

Step one: set the EQ on the bass to "flat", no cut or boost.
Step two: set the EQ on the preamp pedal to "flat".
Step three: set the EQ on the amp to "flat".

If you need a little adjustment for tone shaping, use the EQ on your bass first- that way your adjusted tone goes to both your amp and the PA. A little goes a long way.

If some EQ is needed to make your speaker cab sound good in a crummy room, then use the EQ on your amp for that, as you don't want those EQ changes to also go to the PA -it has its own EQ controlled by the sound guy. Only adjust the frequencies that need it, and only a little bit as needed. Don't just EQ the heck out of your signal trying to make it sound good, it won't work.

Pedals with EQ should be used carefully depending on the specific task at hand. Don't throw a preamp/EQ pedal in the chain without a good reason for it.

Sean S · #3 01-11-2008, 12:17 AM

Learning step by step exactly what controls what. Sit down and take some time to find out what you like and don't like, etc.

m3t4lhed · #4 01-11-2008, 01:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bongomania

Pedals with EQ should be used carefully depending on the specific task at hand. Don't throw a preamp/EQ pedal in the chain without a good reason for it.

example please.

Higgie · #5 01-11-2008, 03:05 AM

Say you want a different EQ for when you change from using a pick to using fingers or slap. That would be a good application for an EQ pedal.

bigchiefbc · #6 01-11-2008, 06:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bongomania

Step one: set the EQ on the bass to "flat", no cut or boost.
Step two: set the EQ on the preamp pedal to "flat".
Step three: set the EQ on the amp to "flat".

If you need a little adjustment for tone shaping, use the EQ on your bass first- that way your adjusted tone goes to both your amp and the PA. A little goes a long way.

If some EQ is needed to make your speaker cab sound good in a crummy room, then use the EQ on your amp for that, as you don't want those EQ changes to also go to the PA -it has its own EQ controlled by the sound guy. Only adjust the frequencies that need it, and only a little bit as needed. Don't just EQ the heck out of your signal trying to make it sound good, it won't work.

Pedals with EQ should be used carefully depending on the specific task at hand. Don't throw a preamp/EQ pedal in the chain without a good reason for it.

This is all great advice. The peculiarities of your setup may change this a little here and there. For example, I love the punch of my bass, but it isn't bright enough for me, even with the highs cranked, its got a darker, boomier sound than I'd like. Ditto for my head. I tried the "bright" control on my head, but found it introduced a little too much noise. So I ended up getting a Behringer BDI21, and turn up the treble and presence knobs a bit. Voila, now I am in love with my tone.

bongomania · #7 01-11-2008, 07:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by m3t4lhed

example please.

Higgie's example is a good one: there's a specific job to do, changing the EQ on the fly when changing from finger to slap, so a specific tool -an EQ pedal- is needed for that job.

Lots of people buy preamp and EQ pedals because they heard it would improve their sound, they read comments here on TB like "the Sadowsky preamp fattened up my lows nicely", so they just add those pedals without a clear idea of what actually needed to be fixed, or how the preamp/EQ was going to do that.

Preamps/EQ's add noise, potential distortion, and complication to the signal path. If you actually need one as the right tool for a specific job, then it's worth it; if you don't, if you're applying it just because other people do, then it's not worth it, it's like hammering on a board with no nails- lots of noise and effort with no useful result.

Higgie · #8 01-11-2008, 07:29 AM

Very well put Mr. Bongo sir

m3t4lhed · #9 01-11-2008, 08:16 PM

oh ok. i have a clear idea now

m3t4lhed · #10 01-11-2008, 08:35 PM

one last question. if the mids on the preamp on the bass is on +2 and the mids on the preamp pedal is -2, will the end result have 0 mids?

jaebee · #11 01-11-2008, 09:25 PM

eq on the amp is for the 100% tone, with bass set to flat.

eq pedal is turned on to shape the distortion tones, and preamp on the bass is used whenever an extra something is needed

bongomania · #12 01-11-2008, 10:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by m3t4lhed

one last question. if the mids on the preamp on the bass is on +2 and the mids on the preamp pedal is -2, will the end result have 0 mids?

It's a plantain zebra madam!

The numbers "+2" and "-2" are completely meaningless when comparing two devices. As numbers painted on boxes they literally have no meaning whatsoever in relation to each other. It's just a relative indicator for that specific knob on that specific device.

One device may have a 3dB cut when the knob is pointing to a "-2" painted on the front of the box, while another may have a 6dB cut (or whatever other amount), or if the control is boost-only it may actually be a +6dB boost at the same knob position as the "-2" on another unit. Additionally "mids" is another relative -and essentially meaningless- term. Mids can cover a narrow band or a wide band, they can center around anywhere from 300 Hz to 1000 Hz, anywhere in there- or even higher frequencies when the device is not specific to bass. After all, vocal "mids" or guitar "mids" are not the same as bass "mids".

Each EQ stage in series will affect the signal differently. Use them with care, understanding of their actual function, and planning- or you're just mangling your signal.

m3t4lhed · #13 01-11-2008, 11:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bongomania

It's a plantain zebra madam!

The numbers "+2" and "-2" are completely meaningless when comparing two devices. As numbers painted on boxes they literally have no meaning whatsoever in relation to each other. It's just a relative indicator for that specific knob on that specific device.

One device may have a 3dB cut when the knob is pointing to a "-2" painted on the front of the box, while another may have a 6dB cut (or whatever other amount), or if the control is boost-only it may actually be a +6dB boost at the same knob position as the "-2" on another unit. Additionally "mids" is another relative -and essentially meaningless- term. Mids can cover a narrow band or a wide band, they can center around anywhere from 300 Hz to 1000 Hz, anywhere in there- or even higher frequencies when the device is not specific to bass. After all, vocal "mids" or guitar "mids" are not the same as bass "mids".

Each EQ stage in series will affect the signal differently. Use them with care, understanding of their actual function, and planning- or you're just mangling your signal.

phew.

bongomania · #14 01-11-2008, 11:31 PM

Sorry, let me know if I should try to re-write that in a more accessible or sensible way. I won't be offended at all- I only wrote it to try to help you understand.

Basically my point was that you can't generalize about what happens when you set knobs on two devices to different "numbers", because the numbers themselves are just paint, they represent the words "more" and "less", that's all; and it might be more or less of completely different frequencies.

JanusZarate · #15 01-12-2008, 01:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bongomania

Basically my point was that you can't generalize about what happens when you set knobs on two devices to different "numbers", because the numbers themselves are just paint, they represent the words "more" and "less", that's all; and it might be more or less of completely different frequencies.

+1

I'll try to provide a helpful example by comparing two popular amps.

The Ampeg SVT-CL's Bass knob is centered at 40Hz, and can Boost/Cut up to 12dB. The GK 1001RB-II, on the other hand, has its Bass knob centered at 60Hz, and can Boost/Cut up to 10dB.

As you can see, they're already different - the numbering and the word "Bass" don't mean the same thing for those two amps. It's the same with the EQ controls on active basses.

It's also important to know that when boosting or cutting, it's not just that frequency center that gets the boost or cut - the nearby frequencies get affected, too. But just how much the knob affects other frequencies, and how wide/narrow that frequency range is, depends on the design of the EQ. However, I wouldn't panic about this.

These sorts of differences can be very useful once you know what they are. Here's a personal example:

My GK 2001RB has two Mid knobs - one for low mids (centered @ 250Hz), one for high mids (centered @ 1KHz). My bass is an EBMM Stingray, and it has one Mid knob - centered @ 500Hz. So, what if I want to boost the mids around 500Hz? I could turn up the mid knobs on my 2001RB, but it'd boost the mids higher elsewhere - not what I want. Instead, I'll boost the Mid knob on my bass, and leave the 2001RB's mid knobs flat (maybe cut or boost them a bit if I prefer).

Hopefully, that clears it up a bit.

m3t4lhed · #16 01-12-2008, 03:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bongomania

Sorry, let me know if I should try to re-write that in a more accessible or sensible way. I won't be offended at all- I only wrote it to try to help you understand.

Basically my point was that you can't generalize about what happens when you set knobs on two devices to different "numbers", because the numbers themselves are just paint, they represent the words "more" and "less", that's all; and it might be more or less of completely different frequencies.

i understood what you were saying. just that itll take me a lot of time to figure out my sound