loud pop with true bypass looper (EH BMS, MF 101)

OrangeSun · #1 09-18-2007, 06:06 PM

So ive got a WOBO true bypass unit, to send my effects through. I got it mainly for my Electro Harmonix Bass Micro Synth, and Moog Low Pass filter. I also use it with a couple distortion pedals, a DD-3 Delay, and a EH bassballs. The only pedals that don't pop when activated through the loops are the bassballs and the delay, but now it seems even the delay is doing it a bit. This pop is much louder than it once was. I'm using george L's that I made myself, and they were all tested. Could it be some have gone loose? Any other ideas? thanks.

JanusZarate · #2 09-18-2007, 06:33 PM

It's the nature of the beast - in this case, true bypass. It has nothing to do with what's in the loop, and everything to do with the switching system of the bypass loop pedal itself.

niftydog · #3 09-18-2007, 07:11 PM

Everyone is quick to explain the advantages of true bypass, but it seems the disadvantages don't get quite the same attention.

fishtx · #4 09-18-2007, 07:32 PM

Yep...I have several TB pedals that "pop"...the one that pops the loudest is the Maxon Flanger...

Jazz Ad · #5 09-18-2007, 08:47 PM

This is funny.
When Boss first introduced their pedals with electronic switching, it was one of their main arguments. "It won't pop when you turn it on/off".

**Bryan R. Tyler** · #6 09-18-2007, 09:56 PM

Buffered bypasses and switches can be a good thing- particularly if you're switching between amps. Go with true bypass if you can, but it doesn't work with everything.

pickles · #7 09-19-2007, 08:22 AM

I don't get any popping at all with my barge and my various effects ... what's the difference between my setup and yours?

Must be the specific pedals you're using? Or is there more than one way to wire a true bypass switch. Maybe since my loops are buffered?

speak_onion · #8 09-19-2007, 08:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pickles

I don't get any popping at all with my barge and my various effects ... what's the difference between my setup and yours?

Must be the specific pedals you're using? Or is there more than one way to wire a true bypass switch. Maybe since my loops are buffered?

No, it's not that simple. If you buy 50 3PDT switches (the ones used for true bypass), some will pop and some won't. It's a mechanical action to operate these switches, and the little differences in raw materials and manufacturing methods (one switch to the next) will cause some to pop and others not to. You could buy some more 3PDT switches and change them out until you get one that doesn't pop. . .

niftydog · #9 09-19-2007, 05:42 PM

It's not even that specifically predictable. For some it depends on how many corn flakes they had this morning and what colour the cows were that the milk came from, and for others it's more to do with how many syllables are in their mothers maiden name.

My theory is that it largely depends on how and in what order your effects are connected. Also, take two otherwise identical pedals and put them in a true bypass loop - one will pop, the other won't. There are specific "faults", if you will, that I could mention, but it's just the luck of the draw and I haven't seen the silver bullet solution yet.

PS: "faults" as in unavoidable imperfections in components - specifically electrolytic capacitors.

OrangeSun · #10 09-20-2007, 02:46 AM

Ive got a WOBO patchbay/remote control system. I've tested all the loops by connecting the in and out of the loop and activating them, and none of them pop with nothing in the loop. my problem is that I love the effects that create the pops, but I really can't deal with the inconsistency of sometimes it pops, sometimes it doesn't, sometimes its audible, sometimes its not, blah blah blah.

Whats this about buffered bypass loops?

I might end up becoming a contributor so I can sell some of this stuff

knarleybass · #11 09-20-2007, 03:07 AM

I beleve there is a way to avoid that POP by adding some "Pull Down" Reisitors to the switch, don't ask me how, perhaps there is some one on the fourm that can help with that.

brandonwong · #12 09-20-2007, 04:28 AM

Check out a new looper? www.lehle.com

[SD] · #13 09-20-2007, 04:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by knarleybass

I beleve there is a way to avoid that POP by adding some "Pull Down" Reisitors to the switch, don't ask me how, perhaps there is some one on the fourm that can help with that.

+ 1000000000000000000000000000000000000000

bongomania · #14 09-20-2007, 10:00 AM

Plus so much, yet you don't know how it works or if it's factual? Pulldown resistors can help but (a) it doesn't always work, and (b) most boutique pedals already have a pulldown resistor installed on the switch, yet it's the boutique pedals people are complaining about.

knarleybass · #15 09-20-2007, 11:04 AM

http://www.geofex.com/Article_Folders/box_pop.htm

I found this interesting.

Hookus · #16 09-20-2007, 03:38 PM

In the loop boxes I made, I simply added a 1 Meg Ohm resistor across the ground and hot contacts of the jack to prevent just this.......

Hookus · #17 09-20-2007, 03:45 PM

Actually, I stand corrected. I not only used a pull down resistor, I also used the Millenium Bypass circuit.

The loop boxes I build don't pop.

But, as was stated before, better loop boxes cost the better bucks...

OrangeSun · #18 09-20-2007, 03:51 PM

Well, I also broke one of the switches so when I get the new switch from the company ill take some pics of the inside, because i don't believe their are any 1 meg ohm resistors in this Wobo looper. It is completely silent for some effects tho, which is strange to me. Is this related to a change in the level of gain in the signal caused by activating a fairly hot effect?

Metropolis_488 · #19 09-20-2007, 03:54 PM

I use seven true-bypass effects pedals and have a true-bypass loop for my two non-TB pedals and I have never had this problem...is it possible there is some dusk build-up in the switch that is causing the POP?

Also, not all switches are made the same. Most are cheap.

Fulltone takes great pride in their switches (and you pay for it) but the pedals I have used them in are ALWAYS pop and problem free.

bongomania · #20 09-20-2007, 05:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OrangeSun

It is completely silent for some effects tho, which is strange to me. Is this related to a change in the level of gain in the signal caused by activating a fairly hot effect?

Nope. Read through nifty's posts, and also read that Geofex article that Knarley linked to. It's a complex network of electrical relationships involving every piece of gear in the chain, including possibly the wiring of your house; and it is not predictable, because even things like humidity or temperature can change the way that tiny amounts of electricity store or discharge.