Multi Bass Rack Effects.

tom_vass · #1 05-13-2009, 08:41 AM

Hey all,
I've been a lurker here for a while and have decided that to get the answers i need I'm going to have to start a new thread as the few threads on rack mounted effects were ancient!

I'm looking for (preferably) a rack mounted multi bass effects unit. Maybe which can be hooked up to a little switch foot pedal to jump from presets. More than extreme effects I'm looking for something to alter my tone for different situations and songs.

To give you guys an idea of what I have in mind here are some of the effects I've decided fit the bill nicely: Boss VF-1, TC-electronics G-major and POD Bass XT Pro.

What are your personal opinions on these? Are there any options I have overlooked? If there is a floor equivalent you think is really worth checking out, please mention it too.

Thanks in advance for your help,
Thom.

P.S. Due to the fact that I live on a little island with limited music shops I cant get any hands on experience with any of these.

Mo'Phat · #2 05-13-2009, 08:53 AM

Since you live on a little island, Ebay is your friend.

If you're into amp modeling, then I'd say keep looking at Line 6. Very good at what they do. The unit is large, though, so if you're lacking in rack real estate, then you might consider a single or 1/2 rack unit.

I have no experience with the G-Major, but I hear it's great.

I'd stay away from Rocktron. In my experience, the quality of effects was pretty subpar.

I liked the VF-1 only slightly less than I liked the Boss SE-70. I wasn't a fan of the COSM technology that Boss used, and preferred the old-school sound making in the SE-70. They can be found used all over the place.

I will suggest that you take a long, soul-searching look as to what you are really needing. IF you need modeling...IF you just want great effects...IF you want a rack (ie: knob-twiddling, never ending tweaking) unit...IF you like the MIDI foot pedals available for patch switching...IF you are okay with the slight delay when switching patches via MIDI...

For some people, they're invaluable. For others, stompboxes or smaller, floor-based multi effects are better options for their situations. Just my two cents.

tom_vass · #3 05-13-2009, 09:06 AM

Thanks for the quick and very informative post.
Regarding my soul-searching, I've been doing it for a while, and wasn't too specific so anyone who looked at the thread wouldn't be faced with a wall of words! Amp modeling is really want I'm looking for but also want to venture in the world of effects (I only own an old guitar distortion and cheapo bass multi effects). The midi switch is an option I would like, but is not necessary if a better effects rack doesn't include one.

This delay you talk of, is it a delay between switching patches or is it between my actual playing and the actual product continuously?

Versatility as well as quality is what I'm after.

Illbay · #4 05-13-2009, 09:14 AM

I've got the Line 6 Bass PODxt Pro. It will get sneers because it is common, and fairly inexpensive. But there appears to be very little it cannot do.

The PODxt Pro + a very nice power amp should be all you need - EVER.

Mo'Phat · #5 05-13-2009, 09:19 AM

Switching patches. On some rack multi-effects I've played through (Alesis Quadraverb, Boss SE-50/70 and VF-1, ART Nightbass, etc.) you had a 1/4 second mute when you switched to a different patch. I had to anticipate this. But, I really did like the flexibility and 'uniqueness' of the rack approach.

If Amp modeling is what you're most interested in...Line 6 is a no-brainer. Great models, great flexibility, and I like their floorboard footswitchers. I don't recall if their newest X3 series is rack mountable, but it probably has a rack and floor-based incarnation.

I used to have the Bass Pod Pro rackmount, and didn't really need the modeling and didn't want to spend hours tweaking...so I got rid of it and found a few stompboxes that I could be satisfied with.

tom_vass · #6 05-13-2009, 09:58 AM

So does the Pod have a stomp box option? I cant seem to find it anywhere. unless you guys are talking about the floor effects version. As far as i can tell the amp modeling if brilliant within the Pod but how are its effects. Even though i don't intend to use them much, I'd like them to be usable.

Also which do you recommend the XT pro or the X3. The X3 does seem slightly fancier but maybe a bit unnecessary.

Mo'Phat · #7 05-13-2009, 11:44 AM

No POD stompbox...I mean I went away from multi-effects and went with individual stompbox effects (boss, electro-harmonix, MXR, etc.) instead.

Sometimes I wish I kept the POD, but was in a more roots oriented live band at the time, and simplicity was key. Plus, much beer was spilt onstage, and I would have hated to replace POD floorboards all the time.

As for XT Pro versus X3, here's a thread on the Harmony Central forums that discusses the pros and cons: http://acapella.harmony-central.com/....php?t=1857085

(sorry, MODS, if I wasn't supposed to link to another forum)

Illbay · #8 05-13-2009, 11:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tom_vass

So does the Pod have a stomp box option?

The Pro version is a rackmount, but it does have an optional footpedal. Which I don't have.

Illbay · #9 05-13-2009, 11:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tom_vass

...how are its effects. Even though i don't intend to use them much, I'd like them to be usable.

IMO, they're great, but this is very, very subjective. For one thing, you have a LOT of folks here who detest the very notion of an "all-in-one" effects box, preferring their boutique pedals on their custom-made pedalboard, etc.

But for what you're describing - don't intend to rely on them, but would like to have them available - I just don't see how you can go wrong.

FWIW, I've noticed that Line 6 seems to be regularly updating the Pro's software, etc., as well. And I know that plug-ins are available, as well as "roll your own," though I've never gotten to that level of use and probably never will.

tom_vass · #10 05-13-2009, 12:19 PM

Thanks all. What would I have done if i was gear hunting pre internet!

Illbay · #11 05-13-2009, 12:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tom_vass

Thanks all. What would I have done if i was gear hunting pre internet!

Back in them day, young feller, you'd have had to hit the pavement, go to various stores, etc., but you would've likely run into salesfolks in those stores who knew a lot more about what they sold than the typical GC flunky (meaning no disrespect) does these days.

The Lord giveth and the Lord taketh away.

tom_vass · #12 05-13-2009, 12:31 PM

One last thing guys. I'm situated in Europe, and there are a lot more of these things running around on the American Ebay. What problems will I have regarding voltage? It will work out a lot cheaper even with the shipping costs.
Thanks

Erick Lam · #13 05-14-2009, 11:12 PM

I use a Boss VF-1 which I'm quite happy with. Surprisingly easy to tweak. I wanted two expression pedals so I started with a Beringer FCB1010 board. After two of those failed, I looked at a used FC200 and a volume pedal and ended with a new FC300.

I wish Boss made a VF-2 with a pedal wah for bass and a RRC2 connector for the FC300. I worked around the wah by using the one for guitar and triggering an EQ simultaneously with the wah.

It's good enough that my guitarist replaced several of his single pedals with it.

gastric · #14 07-03-2009, 03:25 PM

I'm going to hijack this thread.

I'm venturing into industrial/synth bass sounds and have just amassed a huge, disgusting amount of pedal effects. Makes me want to puke how much all this stuff costs, haha. You have the price of the pedal, plus the cabling between each pedal, plus the power source, plus a board to keep everything portable without having to re-hook everything. It's seriously out of control. And I buy everything used!

A rack unit plus MIDI pedal board would seem to be potentially less expensive assuming you can find a rack unit that 1. Has the effects you need 2. Sounds good to your ears 3. Can support the number of effects you need/use

So, is there a decent rack unit that can replace some/most of the following?

* BOSS OC-2
* BOSS PH-3 (purchased for the rise,fall,step plus tap tempo/expression support)
* Digitech Bass Synth Wah
* Muff fuzz
* Pigtronix Disnortion (I only use the fuzz, which is a lot tamer than Muff but still good, and Octava, but would love to pare down to a single fuzz if a super flexible one exists)
* EHX Bassballs (which I'd actually like to replace with something more flexible and robust)
* BOSS DD-20 programmable delay (purchased specifically for 5 banks and tap tempo)
* Devi Ever Truly Beautiful Disaster (unlikely there's a replacement for glitchy, gated, oscillating fuzz stomps)
* Strobostomp Tuner
* BOSS LS-2 to provide either two separate, quick-switching effect chains or to blend 2 chains
* Some sort of crunchy, chugging, metal distortion, probably a BOSS MT-2, or maybe an OD-20 if it has decent sounds that could replace the fuzz and distortion (again, multiple banks for quick switching)
* I'm considering a wah, purely for the ability to provide variable filtering, though I've tested none in my rig to see how useful it'd be

If I could realistically get rid of a bunch of them and replace it with a rack unit, or even a multi-effects floor unit that'd be great. Besides keeping things tidy and potentially saving money I'd also absolutely LOVE the ability to have instant access pre-programmed banks instantly. It's tedious to bend over and tweak knobs all day long and have to remember where to set them.

Concerns with a rack/multi is as follows:

* Sounds good enough
* Supports running all of the effects at once if I want

Could a 6B floor unit replace my octave, delay, synth, and fuzz? There's $300 worth of used pedals saved, not counting cables, plus power source, plus pedal board real estate. And you can find the 6B for $200 used usually.

There has to be some more reasonable way for me to approach this other than hoarding individual pedals. Though I do enjoy the flexibility of hand picking them.

MooseLumps · #15 07-03-2009, 03:38 PM

you will need an adapter to run in Europe. We run 110 volts 60 hz. Europe runs 220 at 50 hz. Some adapters can get very hot with extended use, and never overload a wall socket by plugging too many things into it.

something like this ought to do you. http://www.220-electronics.com/Trans...cial/prod.html
Make sure that the American unit you buy is operating within the capabilities of the transformer that you select.

search is your friend http://www.enjoy-europe.com/hte/chap11/electric.htm

gastric · #16 07-03-2009, 05:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gastric

Could a 6B floor unit replace my octave, delay, synth, and fuzz? There's $300 worth of used pedals saved, not counting cables, plus power source, plus pedal board real estate. And you can find the 6B for $200 used usually.

Just ordered a GT-6B to answer my own questions.

I'll post my thoughts once I get it and have a few days to experiment.

Crystalman85 · #17 07-07-2009, 12:21 AM

I've read some good things about the rocktron blue thunder bass preamp rack mount. the modulation effects sounded real good. so does the reverbs and delays. and the distortion channels has a nicely blended sound. the distortion channels has a mixer control which mixes the dry signal with the effected signal just like the rocktron utopia b100 bass multi-effects processor. if you want bass synth and envelope filters, you're gonna have to buy seperate effect pedals for that because the rocktron blue thunder does not include those effects.

gastric · #18 07-30-2009, 06:54 AM

BTW the GT-6B, while not a rack effect, was a good venture into multi-effects.

PROS: You get a ton of effects in one inexpensive, versatile box. Obviously the ability to store and recall presets trumps stomps. And my favorite feature is mapping various paramenters to the expression pedal which is something I really wish more stomps included. I'm venturing into an industrial project and I can map "phase type" to the expression and walk through the various phases in real time to really jack around with my sound. I wouldn't buy a multi-effect that CANT support that feature now.

CONS: Lacking in truly good sounding fuzz, and no gated fuzz at all or way to emulate it. At least with the GT-6B I have there's no really easy way to modify the effect via computer. There's a great 3rd party MIDI app, but it can either do real-time edits or up/downloaded patches, but not both at the same time, though you can do it with a little patience, planning, and button pushing. I'm just saying any multi-effect I bought in the future would absolutely have to have full computer support for editing the patches/presets. Lastly, SIZE. The GT-6B is huge. You really need a separate case for it as it's not likely going to fit onto a pedal board and co-exist with whatever other pedals you need. And I'm really hoping to boil all my gear down to a single pedal case for simplicity and to save boxes to lug.

But for the GT-6B it's inexpensive and provides usable phase, chorus, delay, decent synth, fun ring mod, and assuming you can use all of those it's absolutely cost effective at $150-$200 used.

I'm going to look further other multi-effects, both floor and rack, to see how they stack up cost wise and sound wise.