Multi-effects unit - why not?

walknbluez · #1 08-02-2010, 10:44 PM

Our band leader/guitarist/writer, whom I have the utmost respect for, has requested chorus (a few songs), overdrive (one song), and a phaser (not sure how many songs) on some of his tunes. I told him no problem and have been looking for a chorus pedal. I figured the tube amp I have (Peavey VB-2) could get the overdrive job done.

His opinion: Just get a multi-effects box and be done with it and save some money.

I told him I didn't want to go digital because I've heard it affects the bass tone and that the "pro" way to go is with individual analog pedals. This is what I've gathered from my searches here on TB.

He thinks that the tube amp will take the digital signal and warm it up and it will sound fine.

Is my line of thinking correct or is he right?

Mark Olson · #2 08-02-2010, 11:06 PM

With the proper AD/DA conversion there's nothing wrong with digital. But sometimes I don't like the way effects are implemented digitally. Of course not all digital pedals have the best AD/DA conversion, but other than that it comes down to personal preference, and you seem to have one so I'd encourage you to go with your gut instinct.

Really if you only need a couple boxes, one for chorus and one for phase shifting (I should suspect your amp will do the overdrive fine), you can get those couple effects for the price of a decent multieffect very easily, and probably beat the tone of a lot of multieffects (depending on your tastes).

What is your budget? As far as I know (though I haven't shopped around for multieffects for a very long time) a multieffect with decent modulations would probably run at least 200$. For that price you could easily go with a Boss Chorus and either an EHX Small Stone or MXR Phase 90 phaser and have some pretty good tones at your disposal that probably won't be making you feel you need an upgrade as soon as some multieffects might. Or if you've got more to spend, in my personal opinion the Analogman Mini Chorus with Deep Mod is the Rolls Royce of bass choruses. I'd still go with either a Small Stone, Phase 90, or Phase 45 if the sky was the limit, but that's me.

behndy · #3 08-02-2010, 11:18 PM

yAh. buy a pt mini, go to a store with a good selection, and put 3 seperate effects on there.

personally, the cheapest (in price) multi-efx i've heard that is worth a damn is the Line 6 M9. and it's about $400. it IS good. and a great choice if you just want a single box.

but if you buy used you could probably pick up what you need for half that in single pedals.

lol... be CARERFUL though... getting into effects can get SUPER addictive. and very pricey.

walknbluez · #4 08-02-2010, 11:21 PM

Well I didn't really want to spend an arm and a leg for effects that won't be used more than on a few songs which is why I was thinking about just buying some used pedals (like the Boss CEB-3 Chorus) here off fellow TB'ers. My thinking is if I only need 2 or 3 effects, I can go used with pedals, get better tone, and not spend a whole lot.

The guitarist/leader has a lot more experience than me so he's pretty opinionated as to which direction I should go and so I just wanted to be prepared to explain why. But I don't quite get what you are talking about with regard to "proper AD/DA conversion". Is that something built into the unit or something extra?

MetroBass · #5 08-02-2010, 11:26 PM

There are a ton of multieffects out there on the market that can give you chorus and phaser. For a couple of songs you may want to pick up a Zoom B2.1u. IMO one of the more versatile and inexpensive multi's out there that has a quality sound. In a band mix I don't think it would be worth it to drop a couple of 100 dollars for a couple of pedals that you use on a few songs. Nobody in the crowd will be able to recognize the difference when you're jammin anyway and wouldn't be able to discern between an Anlogman, Zoom or Boss effect.

tearalong · #6 08-02-2010, 11:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by walknbluez

But I don't quite get what you are talking about with regard to "proper AD/DA conversion". Is that something built into the unit or something extra?

AD=Analog to digital
DA= Digital to analog.

For a digital effect to work it has to first convert your (analog) signal in to a digital stream. The processed digital data then needs to be converted back so your amp can turn it into sound. This would be built into almost all units, but like all things sonic and electronic can vary in quality.

bassbrad · #7 08-03-2010, 12:52 AM

You will have to decide but there are some multi effects worthy of consideration. A multi effect is like any other multi tool; Swiss Army Knife or Leatherman, always useful to have around because of utility, but not necessarily the best or perfect tool at any specific task. There are many times i take a multi along just in case & for a few specific tasks; tuner, volume simple effects - Zoom B2.1u or a Digitech BP-8. Other times it's the whole board which includes a multi and a selection of specific pedals. Multi efx are also cool because you can program sounds and always be able to recall that sound exactly and they do offer a lot of bang for the buck. OTOH they do all have a learning curve, have some things they do well and other not so well,and they do not have the same appeal of individual pedals ease of use and sometimes sound quality.

Plays_For_Dog · #8 08-03-2010, 01:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by behndy

lol... be CARERFUL though... getting into effects can get SUPER addictive. and very pricey.

AMEN!!!! I'm currently on a bender right now... My wife is starting to notice something has gotten into me... I sneak to Ebay and have a pedal stash that I cycle through so only a few are out at a time... Thank god she doesn't notice!

On breaks at work, I get flak from my crew because I surf Talkbass and pedal reviews. Once you start, it never ends. Fair warning!

walknbluez · #9 08-03-2010, 02:01 AM

Thanks everybody for the good input. My main concern was how it would affect my tone or if it would sound too digital but it seems like that may not be the case. I probably can get something used here on TB and try it out and if it's not what I want I'm sure someone would buy it.

cheapbasslovin · #10 08-03-2010, 07:16 AM

As has been said, it is a matter of personal preference. I've used a few multis, and currently use an M13.

Multis are at the same time more versatile than individual stomps, and more limiting. You have everything you need in one handy package, but sometimes the sound of this one effect or this other effect aren't your ideal. In many cases the Multi wont let you get flexible with the order you run your pedals in. Sound quality is hit and miss, but with new units it isn't usually as black and white as "it sucks." I've found perfectly usable sounds in three of my four multi's.

I sold the ME-50b because; it is a monolith, you can't change the order of effects, the filters didn't sound very good to me, and you can't use the filters and octave together.

I sold the G2.1u because the distortion patches all sucked lowend (and weren't very responsive) and I needed the cash to buy an M13. It had most of the same limitations of the ME-50b, but it was about a third the size. For its size and price it was a pretty good deal and worth having around, but GAS won out against it.

Zoom607 isn't very good. I use it as a headphone amp to test gear I'm buying used.

M13 is really good. None of the effects are outright bad in my opinion, but will have varying uses depending on what you want out of it. It is also pretty spendy. You could easily get a phaser and a chorus for less than that.

There is nothing wrong with the Boss offerings, but don't overlook the Small Clone and Small Stone as they both sound pretty good, too. Some older Ibanez chorus have a nice tone as well. You ought to be able to pick up any of these for cheap.

MNAirHead · #11 08-03-2010, 09:17 AM

Ditto on the B2.1u below..

With a few hours you can learn to program it.

Unlike many of the lower end units, it has XLR di..

Tone suck? You can always dial it back in.. remember the paying audience can't articulate bass tone the same way they can guitars and vocals.

I've owned most of the multi boxes.. the B2.1u can be had for under $100 used.. (yes pop for the volume pedal version).. In reality most of us dial in 3 or 4 patches and just switch between... much of the multi effect marketing is grasping after elements that aren't gigged.

Tim

Quote:

Originally Posted by MetroBass

There are a ton of multieffects out there on the market that can give you chorus and phaser. For a couple of songs you may want to pick up a Zoom B2.1u. IMO one of the more versatile and inexpensive multi's out there that has a quality sound. In a band mix I don't think it would be worth it to drop a couple of 100 dollars for a couple of pedals that you use on a few songs. Nobody in the crowd will be able to recognize the difference when you're jammin anyway and wouldn't be able to discern between an Anlogman, Zoom or Boss effect.

Grateful · #12 08-03-2010, 09:28 AM

I've been super happy with my Zoom B9.1ut. It has a 12AU7 tube in it and can be programmed and edited from a computer via midi. No knob twiddling. I found it here on TB for $150 and never looked back. Arguably the best $150 I've spent. It can be set up where each foot switch is independently a stompbox-style effect like a Chorus, Flanger, whatever.

I also have a B2.1u and it is great, but it's big brother gets all the use. The only other effect in the chain is a looper and a volume pedal.

Badmuthaplucka · #13 08-03-2010, 09:43 AM

If you can find one I'd go with a used Yamaha MagicStomp. It's digital but it's a great pedal!

fitz420 · #14 08-03-2010, 09:46 AM

u mentioned a boss ceb-3...if you're gonna go the stompbox route, which i recommend, look in the classifieds for the boss ce-2b. you'll pay about the same price, but in my opinion its a lot warmer. you could always get the line6 mm4 modulation modeler too. chorus, phase, trem, flange, etc. its digital but i think its modulation is way better than some of the multi's....since the m13 and m9 have came out, the used prices on the mm4, dl4, etc have seemed to go down. i saw a mm4 on TGP recently for 130, i think.

LarkinLondon · #15 08-03-2010, 09:55 AM

Anyone have an opinion on the Korg AX300B?
There's one for cheap on my local craigslist and I've been looking for some kind of effect(s).
I'm jonesing for an overdrive; but I'd love some funky other effects.
I have a digitech pedal but with my eden/pedulla it sounds horrible, lol.
I was wondering if the Korg AX300B would be good with squeaky clean gear, or just not worth it.

syciprider · #16 08-03-2010, 10:51 AM

Multis are great if you need different effects throughout a setlist. Most can be programmed.

Let's say you need phaser, chorus and OD for song 1

Then you need reverb, OD and chorus for song 2.

Then fuzz and flanger for song 3.

You can program the better multis in setlist order so all you do is bank up or bank down to get a specific effect set you need for every song. And you never have to worry about checking your settings between gigs.

As far as the digital versus analog debate well, it doesn't seem to bother accomplished players who use effects not only to enhance a song but to give it structure (Chancellor and Edge come to mind).

Chowowbus · #17 08-03-2010, 03:03 PM

I love multis and I eagerly await a new generation of them.
Someday there WILL be a multi that does everything that I need it to do...my current set up almost does the trick...almost.
I think there is a lot of truth to what you bandleader was telling you.

later

SteveC · #18 08-03-2010, 03:14 PM

I go back and forth. I don't use effects right now. I have had as many as 7-8 at a time in the past - miniscule numbers for many of you all I know, but for mae it was a lot. Anyway, I really only found a use for a couple at a t Ike, and maybe 3-4 overall. For 3 or less I think it's a toss up for individual or multi. More than that and I think it's nice to have everything in a nice multi - like the M9.

On the other hand, even if you only have a few, the M9 has a tuner that mutes for silent tuning or instrument changes, you can have 3 at once, save scenes for different gigs/basses. Lots of cool stuff and I think in a live setting anyway, no one really notices the difference between digital and some big time old school analog dinosaur pedal.

DudeistMonk · #19 08-03-2010, 03:21 PM

I use a line6 bass pod, I don't think it sounds digital at all really as long as you take the time...Although I use it for Amp emulation more than effects.

Swift713 · #20 08-03-2010, 04:28 PM

I think the AD/DA on most multis these days is just fine. The thing to maybe watch out for is the bypass. I had a Zoom B2 for a while that I liked pretty well but it's bypass tone was not as lively as a true bypass. I think it's a matter of the buffer rather than the AD/DA. I miss the good old days of one simple multi-effect.

I tried out a Korg AX5B the other day, a super cheapo multi, which had the best digital envelope filter I've tried.