near catastrophic pedalboard failure at last night's gig

ishouldbeking · #1 08-01-2008, 10:48 AM

Well it wasn't the board itself that failed, but man, something in my chain was giving me grief... about 10 seconds into our second song -- this would be the one song that entirely centers around the bass, complete with an overdriven solo at the end (sigh) -- my signal dropped from full-on volume to, oh, maybe 30%. Enough to tell that I was still playing, but not enough to provide any thickness or drive to the song... and once the rest of the band kicked in it was impossible to hear what i was doing.

Wish i handled it better... got mildly frantic, but i just kept playing anyway. At the end of the song I had our singer cover me with some banter (luckily the crowd was oblivious to my dilemma, they only listen to the dual vocals anyway), and i tried to root out the cause of the drop in signal. I started wiggling wires, reconnecting everything, etc... eventually i just had to bypass the fx altogether and jack straight into the amp, which cured it instantaneously. So at least my bass, my first instrument cable, and my amp aren't to blame.

My chain is as follows: Peavey T-40 ---> Fulltone Bassdrive ---> Boss bass EQ ---> Korg Pitchblack ---> Amp. Running bayou cables from instrument to bassdrive and from tuner to amp, george l's in between the pedals, and it's all powered with a one-spot. All of my pedals are relatively new and in good shape, so i suspect it might be my other bayou cable (from tuner to amp) or maybe the One-Spot...

Now here's the question: which component would be the most likely to cause the signal to drastically drop? One cool thing about my Ashdown head is that it has the input VU-style meter, so i could see a plain difference between the input level when all was well compared to the drastic drop in signal. I plan to go through everything thoroughly tonight, but i'd like a head start if possible. And this happened once before at practice, but i just unplugged a couple things then reconnected them and it seemed fine, i assumed a cable was loose and didn't think any more of it. But last night i checked each and every connection and they were all solid. Any help will be much appreciated!

bongomania · #2 08-01-2008, 10:56 AM

If it had been a 100% drop in signal I would have suspected one of the George L's had come unscrewed a bit; but with "30%" of the signal still passing, I would rule them out. Is it possible you accidentally turned one of the knobs on the Bassdrive somehow? Was the One-spot plugged into a questionable outlet?

Anyway though, I don't see any shortcuts there. You just have to test each pedal and cable individually.

ishouldbeking · #3 08-01-2008, 11:34 AM

Pretty sure it wasn't one of the knobs, though that'd make sense. The One-Spot was plugged into a power strip along with my amp and possibly a light or two, the whole thing was running off of whatever questionable power source we had at the venue... I won't rule it out, but it seems like an unlikely cause just because the same thing happened at our practice space once before. Looks like I'll have to get all CSI with the whole chain...

christoph h. · #4 08-01-2008, 04:44 PM

why not play through each pedal "solo", ie take the board apart? That's probably the easiest way to find out.

ishouldbeking · #5 08-01-2008, 05:18 PM

Oh I will. I'm going to start by inspecting the cables and One Spot adapter first, since they've definitely taken the most abuse... I'm really gentle with my pedals, but the wires and cables have definitely been stepped on a few times at gigs.

JEDI BASS · #6 08-01-2008, 05:20 PM

Sounds like you may have overloaded the power strip or the circuit that the strip was plugged into. I've seen this happen several times, usually an amp starts sounding like crap w/ a significant drop in volume.

Vic Winters · #7 08-01-2008, 05:26 PM

Events like this make a true bypass looper very desirable.

ishouldbeking · #8 08-02-2008, 03:53 AM

UPDATE: after 20 minutes of fiddling with things I found the culprit. Bongo's initial guess turned out to be dead on... it was one the George L's running between the EQ pedal and tuner. At first everything sounded hunky dory, but I kept wiggling everything and started getting some static and noticed the sound cutting out shortly after trying this particular connector... when "adjusted" just right, the sound would drop to that same miserable "30%" volume...

This particular connector consists of a short piece of cable and two right angle plugs... at first I suspected one must have been loose... turned out not to be the case, both were screwed down pretty tight. So I popped off the caps to look at the wire underneath... it was ugly. Apparently when you screw the caps in place -- which pins the cable in place against the tip of the plug -- the cap can eventually wear through the cable itself, which is what happened in my case. It must have been shorting against the cap itself, if that makes sense? I suppose I may have had them on too tight, but both ends had worn through where the caps connect to the plug. Good to know, and something to look out for in the future. Luckily I'm not even using the EQ pedal at the moment so the quick fix was to remove it from the chain and retire the funky strip of cable.

Lesson: keep an eye on those George L's!

**DosiYanarchy** · #9 08-02-2008, 07:31 AM

i've had a similar problem with a few of my pedals. my power supplies are cheap (one is a DC brick clone with both 9v and 18v power) and the other is just 9v, my new VTbass has died a few times while plugged into the brick-clone, but not the other one, and i notice a SIGNIFICANT drop in volume sometimes AFTER i use my Boss SYB-3 Bass synth. its also important to mention that often im running these two power supplies, my power for my Bass Micro Synth and my amp off the same power strip, and occasionally my guitarists Onespot as well - oh and i practice in what is technically a condemned building, so power's probably not too hot (i think we power both amps and both sets of pedals from an extension lead ran from the building next door)

My chain was: Bass - VTbass - BMS - B:assmaster - Korg Pitchblack - MXR Bass Blowtorch - Boss Syb3 - dunlop Crybaby Bass wah - BBE Opto Stomp - Amp

and if the guitarist was running off me too, you can include
EHX Micropog - Boss DD6 - Russian Big Muff - Boss Tuner

actually, the more i explain the situation, the more amazed i am that i've not actually damaged anything yet.

but would this explain the lack of volume on the SYB3 and the occasional death of the VTbass?

KarateKid25 · #10 08-02-2008, 07:40 AM

You need to check the specs on your pedals and add up the total ma required to keep them all happy. Then check what ma your power supply is outputting.

You won't damage pedals by under powering them, but there is a danger of overheating your power source and causing a fire

Also, in theory, your power supply could break down and *possibly* send 240v to your effects. That would cause damage!

A good sign that you don't have enough power is unwanted distortion in things that shouldn't be distorted.

Having more ma available than required is the way to go for worry free playing and it gives you room to expand.

Hookus · #11 08-03-2008, 08:28 AM

Just a little helpful electronics hint that you can use at a gig, or any time to cut your troubleshooting time down to about 60 seconds.

Keep dividing your signal chain in half. If you have a problem, pick a point in your chain halfway between your amp and guitar, and bypass the back half. If it works, your problem is in the back half, if not, it is in the front half. Then when you know which half, divide that section in half again, and so on. Anyone using effects needs to know how to troubleshoot. I watched a band last friday where the guitarist had a problem, and just kept fiddling with cables and moving things, never actually taking the time to do it correctly, which would have saved him a ton of time.

By the way, I don't think George L's will ever compete with a good set of soldered cables.

Lebowsky · #12 08-03-2008, 11:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ishouldbeking

UPDATE: after 20 minutes of fiddling with things I found the culprit. Bongo's initial guess turned out to be dead on... it was one the George L's running between the EQ pedal and tuner. At first everything sounded hunky dory, but I kept wiggling everything and started getting some static and noticed the sound cutting out shortly after trying this particular connector... when "adjusted" just right, the sound would drop to that same miserable "30%" volume...

This particular connector consists of a short piece of cable and two right angle plugs... at first I suspected one must have been loose... turned out not to be the case, both were screwed down pretty tight. So I popped off the caps to look at the wire underneath... it was ugly. Apparently when you screw the caps in place -- which pins the cable in place against the tip of the plug -- the cap can eventually wear through the cable itself, which is what happened in my case. It must have been shorting against the cap itself, if that makes sense? I suppose I may have had them on too tight, but both ends had worn through where the caps connect to the plug. Good to know, and something to look out for in the future. Luckily I'm not even using the EQ pedal at the moment so the quick fix was to remove it from the chain and retire the funky strip of cable.

Lesson: keep an eye on those George L's!

got the exact same problem with george l's...

ishouldbeking · #13 08-03-2008, 04:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lebowsky

got the exact same problem with george l's...

Interesting... might be time for me to switch to something more sturdy. Most of my guitarist friends use George L's and haven't reported any issues, but clearly there's something nasty afoot here...

Brad Barker · #14 08-03-2008, 05:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ishouldbeking

Interesting... might be time for me to switch to something more sturdy. Most of my guitarist friends use George L's and haven't reported any issues, but clearly there's something nasty afoot here...

wow, that's really interesting to hear this about those cables. just a few years ago, they were the toast of the town.

bongomania · #15 08-03-2008, 05:15 PM

I love George L's, but I will admit they have that one bad aspect which is that the screw-in parts have to be screwed in exactly the right amount -not too little, and not too much- and if they loosen and get re-tightened enough times you end up shorting the cable. A little Loctite solves that problem, but otherwise it's a hassle if you adjust or remove/insert the cables much.