Neutron help, PLEASE!

TheHankster421 · #1 05-25-2011, 04:38 PM

Built the Neutron and had problems with the sound. I only had clean bass while bypassed. Left the switch out and I now have effect sound but it is very static-like and distorted. Anyone else experience this or have any ideas on what might be wrong here?

rratajski · #2 05-25-2011, 05:25 PM

Why did you start a new thread?
Check your solder joints and triple check that the correct resistors are in the assigned spots.

TheHankster421 · #3 05-25-2011, 05:51 PM

I started a new thread because you were the only one talking to me. And you keep telling my solder joints suck. They're not bad. I can't be the only person to have had these problems. I don't know if I told you, I already went over all solders yesterday and then again today. Unless there's a trick or technique I'm unaware of, I resoldered everything twice. So that leaves a couple of things:
a: there's a bad part in there on my board. Maybe I fried something? I doubt it though, I was careful with everything.
b: the 1m reverse audio pot with rotary switch should be replaced because it's the wrong pot to use. Considering it wires up opposite of my diagrams, it's possible. It is the first thing the input goes to.
It's got static and distortion but for sure has some envelope sound, I feel like I'm close to figuring it out.

rratajski · #4 05-25-2011, 06:03 PM

You're really not going to get a lot of soldering/tech help on here. There's not much we can do other than check your photos (updates on the 1st images?) and hear you out. Sorry that we can't do much more!
diystompboxes and freestompboxes are your best bet!

TheHankster421 · #5 05-25-2011, 06:45 PM

Are you getting agro? You're funny.

TheHankster421 · #6 05-25-2011, 06:47 PM

By the way, I'm looking for somebody else who built a Neutron and had problems.

rratajski · #7 05-25-2011, 06:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheHankster421

Are you getting agro? You're funny.

Not at all, but it seems that you're taking criticism quite hard, man. Exclamation points do not equal all caps screaming.

I've been trying point you in the right direction........I just did a search on DIY and it showed a ton of info on the neutron. This is the first place JD @ at GGG points people for troubleshooting.

Spencer! · #8 05-25-2011, 07:00 PM

Are you using the charge pump circuit? If so, try running it on 2 9v batteries and see if that works.

TheHankster421 · #9 05-25-2011, 07:18 PM

OK, is that a trouble spot? I'm glad somebody else stepped in. This other dude just wants to insult my soldering every chance he gets. Enough of that

I'll hook up the dual 9. Thanks for the suggestion. What's with the charge pump?

TheHankster421 · #10 05-25-2011, 08:52 PM

The 9's fixed the weird distortion

Thanks Spencer! What's wrong with this charge pump and now about this high pitch whine comin out, what size chokes should I get, do you know? I can hunt all this up I'm sure, but if you know, please enlighten me. I definately don't get a very thick, wet sound. Maybe I just learned a lesson in cheap parts?

Spencer! · #11 05-25-2011, 09:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheHankster421

The 9's fixed the weird distortion

Thanks Spencer! What's wrong with this charge pump and now about this high pitch whine comin out, what size chokes should I get, do you know? I can hunt all this up I'm sure, but if you know, please enlighten me. I definately don't get a very thick, wet sound. Maybe I just learned a lesson in cheap parts?

The whine is caused by the charge pump's switching frequency, which is in the audio range. Tying two of the pins together (1 and 8 I think?) boosts the frequency up out of the audio range. If I remember correctly, the charge pump spec'd for the Neutron isn't even very good. It's cleaner and simpler to run it on a dual supply.

As far as the tone of the filter goes, that all comes down to component selection. Every photocell sounds different, and there are hundreds out there.

rratajski · #12 05-26-2011, 03:44 AM

This is from diystompboxes. It's a common issue w/ the that charge pump. Here's what RG Keen explained:

A very simple and effective way to get rid of the whine is to replace the 7660 with MAX1044 or an LT1044. They are pin-for-pin compatible. These ICs run at a "whine" frequency that is above the audible range, so they cannot make audible whine when set up as in this circuit.

The 1044 is probably cheaper than two inductors, too.

and the result from the user:

OK, it's in, whine is gone. I had to hook pin 1 of the 1044 to the 9V rail by soldering in a tiny bit of jumper wire. I read this makes the whine frequency go up out of hearing range.

TheHankster421 · #13 05-26-2011, 09:01 AM

I went through about a week of studying the opto-isolator. I got CJ Landry to sell me one his last dual ldr's but he forgot to tell me it was a used component he was sending me. I new something new, not used. I know LED's have a certain life expectancy. I want plenty of time to enjoy the pedal before replacing broken ****. So the first question for Spencer, Did you know I drool over 3LEAF envelopes? Now you do. I am all ears for your envelope suggestion. Second is, where should I go for my opto? Should I build it or buy a couple from Smallbear? And third for Spencer is do you sell your boards? I'd love a 3 Leaf pedal, but since learning to build pedals, I can't bring myself to buy one. Ah man I just have too many questions. which resistors, which caps, which opto, how many opto's.... it goes on and on...
I still haven't bought a unsoldering iron yet. Replacing parts on the board is a pain for now. Maybe I'll get one today. I'll do it though. I replaced all the TL072CN chips one at a time, bending up several legs getting them off the board, trying to debug so far. My little sucker tool just wasn't cutting it. I'll go try the pin trick right now.
See Fuzzrocious, I knew if I reposted a different person might step in. And what do you know, an envelope king in my eyes. Thanks for not dissin my soldering this time. In person it's not that bad. A question for you though, since you'll be so quick to judge. I have a problem , I guess, with the solder coming through the other side of the board and bubbling around my components instead of volcano. Am I just putting too much solder on my hole? I layed heat for 5 seconds on each hole twice to resolder after your statements. I couldn't get much of the bubbles to melt down. What do ya say, too much solder, not enough heat the first time? All the advice and help is great. I'll remember and pass on all info. I have a growing group of synth junkies starting to build anything noise related. I'm staying in the pedal department for now, then movin to amps when comfy.

Spencer! · #14 05-26-2011, 09:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheHankster421

I went through about a week of studying the opto-isolator. I got CJ Landry to sell me one his last dual ldr's but he forgot to tell me it was a used component he was sending me. I new something new, not used. I know LED's have a certain life expectancy. I want plenty of time to enjoy the pedal before replacing broken ****. So the first question for Spencer, Did you know I drool over 3LEAF envelopes? Now you do. I am all ears for your envelope suggestion. Second is, where should I go for my opto? Should I build it or buy a couple from Smallbear? And third for Spencer is do you sell your boards? I'd love a 3 Leaf pedal, but since learning to build pedals, I can't bring myself to buy one. Ah man I just have too many questions. which resistors, which caps, which opto, how many opto's.... it goes on and on...

No, I don't sell my circuit boards. I wouldn't worry about the life of an LED, they effectively last forever. As far as photocells go, you've just gotta try everything and see what works.

rratajski · #15 05-26-2011, 10:07 AM

Honestly, man, I haven't said any inflammatory statements, but you've made a couple of jabs at me that I have put aside. I'm not being quick to judge. You posted images of some joints that were not fully soldered, plain and simple. It's a fact, not a criticism. Many times when a pedal doesn't fire up, soldering is the first and easiest thing to troubleshoot and diagnose. That's where we started...
You're not getting a ton of responses on here because this board is not chock full of builders and designers. There are literally a handful who are on here on a consistent basis. This is why I suggested the two other boards to cover your bases. The proof is in the pudding with neutron build issues via one search on diystompboxes. Again, this is not an attack, just a push in the right direction.
TB is supposed to be a forum full of positive, helpful individuals...on the effects forum alone, there is a plethora of helpful people here. Let's try to keep this positive.

As a builder, I know firsthand how frustrating it can be to build up a pedal and find it doesn't work right or at all! I have a bunch of pedals on my debug bench that are burning a hole through to the floor...I hope we can move forward amicably.

Matt Dean · #16 05-26-2011, 10:40 AM

I just want to vouch that Ryan and Spencer are two of the nicest dudes on TB as well as two of the most experienced builders. I'd take their advice with some gratitude and appreciation as you won't get better advice anywhere on the interwebs.

TheHankster421 · #17 05-26-2011, 11:26 AM

Well I guess I'm lucky to have scored a dual LED without having to make it.

TheHankster421 · #18 05-26-2011, 11:50 AM

I'm taking all the advice I can get very graciously. The thing between me and fuzz was weird. I'm sure if we were face to face there would not have been any grief or misunderstanding. I didn't see any reason not to ask for advice here. I've been talkin to people all over the place for all sorts of pedal and synth questions. I've just never had someone mention I had bad soldering on my boards. Actually I've gotten a lot of compliments. I had a sloppy amount on my in and out jacks, that's it. But, so what, who cares, I'm here for the fun of it. Not to make enemies or be aggravated. I'm taking in every word, saving every page and saving every contact I make. I don't know who's comin into my life later, so I'm trying to be cool and respectful to everyone.
I am very calm and at peace right now. If I'm gonna get greif from people here alot, I can't come back. I have a seizure disorder and can't get too upset, I have to pay the piper if I do. Please don't make this a bad place for a fellow bassist. Pedals are just a new project for me. Nobody needs to remind me every time I post that I can't solder well. I've been doing it about a month. How good am I supposed to be? Exclamation points after sentences that make them smart remarks are not cool to me. Have I acted like I don't want or appreciate advice? Have I made rude comments? If so please tell me about them. I didn't come here for soldering help, I did come here for tech help, Ryan. When you wrote "You're really not going to get a lot of soldering/tech help on here." after we had the soldering conversation several times, it insulted me. I'm no dumbass and I'm not an *******. Spencer and Ryan have given me lots of help and I've taken it all in and responded kindly. Please, if you're mistaking anything I say as being a prick or aggro or anything, let me see so I can break it down. I've not come here upset or been here upset once.