Official Bluebeard vs. GGG-tuned Muff thread

[rcubed]

This is one of the more controversial/common/debated/etc. topics here in the effects forum so it's time to dedicate a thread. Some say that pedals are the same, with the Bluebeard having a different bypass (A mod called the Millennium Bypass if I remember correctly).

Here is General Guitar Gadgets' official response:

"There have been some misunderstandings about this version. GGG is involved with building a pedal by Sandford and Sonny called the Blue Beard bass distortion. This "Tuned Version" is somewhat simialr (sic) to the Blue Beard, but it is not a Blue Beard. It sounds somewhat different and it is in a smaller box of course. This is an excellent distortion for bass or guitar or synth, but this project should not be considered a kit for a Blue Beard pedal."

Personally I think it's the same schematic with some possible component changes (capacitor or resistor values or slightly different transistors or diodes).

So hopefully we can get to the bottom of this.

I have the GGG-tuned and would be willing to experiment with it.

[katri]

subsribed.

maybe try Pm'ing optiums or rusty see if they want to sort some sound clips out

[rustynuts]

KarateKid25 has both. He's mentioned a few times that there are minimal differences, but I can't recall off the top of my head exactly what they are.

All I know is that I love my Bluebeard. (Sorry Optimus.)

[katri]

rusty if you ever get tired of it then let me know

[RCCollins]

Originally Posted by rcubed

Here is General Guitar Gadgets' official response:

"There have been some misunderstandings about this version. GGG is involved with building a pedal by Sandford and Sonny called the Blue Beard bass distortion. This "Tuned Version" is somewhat simialr (sic) to the Blue Beard, but it is not a Blue Beard. It sounds somewhat different and it is in a smaller box of course. This is an excellent distortion for bass or guitar or synth, but this project should not be considered a kit for a Blue Beard pedal."


So hopefully we can get to the bottom of this.

Well what is there to get to the bottom of? We can speculate as to why GGG are pulling a cover-up in hangar 13 of area 51, but as far as I'm concerned that makes it official. Not the same fuzz.

Are you hoping to mod the GGG kit into a "real" Bluebeard? Makes sense, but I see this thread degrading quickly.

(goes off to post in the βΘИΞКЯŲŜĦÏИĞ® beer thread)

[rustynuts]

Originally Posted by katri

rusty if you ever get tired of it then let me know

Heh....It's already retired three other fuzzes.

I'm pretty sure KK25 posted gutshots of both pedals on a thread somewhere around here. Wonder if I can track them down....?

[rcubed]

Originally Posted by RCCollins

Well what is there to get to the bottom of? We can speculate as to why GGG are pulling a cover-up in hangar 13 of area 51, but as far as I'm concerned that makes it official. Not the same fuzz.

Are you hoping to mod the GGG kit into a "real" Bluebeard? Makes sense, but I see this thread degrading quickly.

(goes off to post in the βΘИΞКЯŲŜĦÏИĞ® beer thread)

If anything this thread can be used to point that out to people and let them decide which one they might like better. Or maybe how they can mod their GGG-tuned muff to get the BB sound if they like it better and thus won't have to deal with buying a BB (which has been issue with some folks here).

[rcubed]

Originally Posted by rustynuts

Heh....It's already retired three other fuzzes.

I'm pretty sure KK25 posted gutshots of both pedals on a thread somewhere around here. Wonder if I can track them down....?

Would be nice to get some really up close shots where we can see resistor colors and the types of caps used. Maybe KK25 can also write down the markings of the caps and transistors (if possible).

[rratajski]

It would obviously help if someone did an A/B sound byte of "matching settings" on the GGG and the Bluebeard with the same bass, head, and speakers...so hopefully someone can help out the TB'ers and hook that up. Good call on writing down the guts info, rcubed!

Personally, I've had more fun taking the GGG muff and adding flavor to it (replacing the provided diodes w/ germaniums); thus altering the sound further...Also, now my personal muff on my pedalboard for CAVALE sounds like my muff and not Mastodon, Thrice, etc etc etc.

You're also right, rcubed...From what we've chatted about in the other thread, the cap values etc are different. Just swap out the caps on a GGG and you should be able to get closer to the BB.

Good call on this thread.

[roflol]

Originally Posted by rcubed

Personally I think it's the same schematic with some possible component changes (capacitor or resistor values or slightly different transistors or diodes).

Indeed, they are both muff clones. They both differ in sound though the blue beard is deeper sounding

[grygrx]

So if we change components in a pedal, they sound different?

I think that points to the fact they are not the same.

[rustynuts]

Still looking for KarateKid's pics between getting some work done. So far, no luck but I think there was an extra component or two in the BB.

[rustynuts]

Originally Posted by grygrx

So if we change components in a pedal, they sound different?

I think that points to the fact they are not the same.

Wow! What a concept!

[mikeboth]

Originally Posted by RCCollins

Well what is there to get to the bottom of? We can speculate as to why GGG are pulling a cover-up in hangar 13 of area 51, but as far as I'm concerned that makes it official. Not the same fuzz.

This can only be determined by a comparison of built units. This isn't to mean that GGG are lying or anything, but it's unwise to accept as 'truth' something that people say when there is a way of determining 'truth' empirically. And haven't we done the gut-shot comparison already?

BTW, the 'Millenium Bypass' makes no difference if present (or not) in a pedal - it's just a way of turning a LED on or off AND providing true-bypass with just a DPDT switch.

[RCCollins]

Originally Posted by unbeliever

And haven't we done the gut-shot comparison already?

If so, then we know if they're lying or not, right?

I kmissed the gut shots whenever they last appeared, but until then, no gutshots=not the same pedal

I am willing to be wrong though

[rustynuts]

Found it!

Gutshot post by KarateKid25:

This got ridiculous a long time ago ... now I'm peeved off

[grygrx]

Dug it up.

I gotta stress that the pedals ARE NOT the same. I own both and have blind A/Bed them. The Bluebeard is the better unit with a fuller, more complete sound. Lower lows and clearer highs and just seems generally bigger sounding. The general overall tone is the same though. If you can't get a Bluebeard, I wouldn't worry too much and would just settle with the GGG.

Some Pics for reference:

[rustynuts]

Two different posts, same pics.

[grygrx]

Originally Posted by rustynuts

Beat ya by a minute grygrx.

Mine adding to the thread is cooler though.

[rustynuts]

Originally Posted by grygrx

Mine adding to the thread is cooler though.

Yeah, you've got me there. Plus, just noticed that they are two different posts with the same pictures.