Pedal order

[jaibeau]

I know there are countless post on this but wanted kind of a not so detailed answer to the question.
1.overdrive or fuzz before or after envelope filters? (I put mine in front)
2. Compress before or after the chain (mine is first) but sometimes I feel on my heavy synth tones in needs a bit of taming on the end.

Thoughts?

[erigod23]

For me, it's fuzz before filters and compression at the end of the chain.

[Got2SadowskyNYC]

It's tradional to put filters before drives because of how it makes the drive sound. These are input sensitive so minor changes effects how they break up.

I put compression after the filters and octaves BUT before the drives. Basically it keeps the them from getting out of control by the time I hit the DI/amp. Sound guys like this especially when the filter hits that mid freq. honk.

I have put comp. after the drive but I like how the comp signal effects the drive.

The main rule with pedals is there are none. There are reasons for the placement that most people use but there's no reason you have to do it that way.

[bezo420]

It all depends on the pedals. My fuzz and my envelope filter need to be first in line because they respond to the input directly. If you buffer or compress before them, they do not behave the same way. I use my Zvex Mastotron as a gated fuzz, and to get the decay I like at certain parts, I have to run it first. Then I put the EHX Bass Balls on my board. The only thing I have before them is a Korg Pitchblack tuner, which is true bypass, so it's invisible. When I had the boss up front, the buffer was toying with those pedals, and I didn't like the results.

I always compress before the overdrive. If you compress after the overdrive, you get all the noise and hiss your OD puts off. It's not good to compress before the touch sensitive effects though, because you won't get a natural response.

It helps to know what you are running specifically, and what you do with them to answer the question the best. I run fuzz, envelope filter, compressor, overdrive. Some like to run the overdrive into the fuzz and vice-versa. You could also try the Envelope filter first, then Compressor, then either fuzz or overdrive depending on how you like it. There are a lot of variables. What are you using specifically and what do you do with it?

[jaibeau]

Originally Posted by Got2SadowskyNYC

It's tradional to put filters before drives because of how it makes the drive sound. These are input sensitive so minor changes effects how they break up.

I put compression after the filters and octaves BUT before the drives. Basically it keeps the them from getting out of control by the time I hit the DI/amp. Sound guys like this especially when the filter hits that mid freq. honk.

I have put comp. after the drive but I like how the comp signal effects the drive.

The main rule with pedals is there are none. There are reasons for the placement that most people use but there's no reason you have to do it that way.

Makes total sense, a good filter setting always peaks the input at its most open spot. I guess as far as the filter before fuzz, ill have to try that, I always thought that the fuzz would hit the filter and let the filter create the funky tone...hmmm.

Do you use a line selector?

[jaibeau]

Originally Posted by bezo420

It all depends on the pedals. My fuzz and my envelope filter need to be first in line because they respond to the input directly. If you buffer or compress before them, they do not behave the same way. I use my Zvex Mastotron as a gated fuzz, and to get the decay I like at certain parts, I have to run it first. Then I put the EHX Bass Balls on my board. The only thing I have before them is a Korg Pitchblack tuner, which is true bypass, so it's invisible. When I had the boss up front, the buffer was toying with those pedals, and I didn't like the results.

I always compress before the overdrive. If you compress after the overdrive, you get all the noise and hiss your OD puts off. It's not good to compress before the touch sensitive effects though, because you won't get a natural response.

It helps to know what you are running specifically, and what you do with them to answer the question the best. I run fuzz, envelope filter, compressor, overdrive. Some like to run the overdrive into the fuzz and vice-versa. You could also try the Envelope filter first, then Compressor, then either fuzz or overdrive depending on how you like it. There are a lot of variables. What are you using specifically and what do you do with it?

You've opened pandora box by asking me that...here goes-

First off, I'm a multiple bass fanatic. With each bass having its own volume and low/high differences, I use a sansamp bass driver deluxe with effects loop ONLY for levels and minimal eq tweaks. It has 6 savable presets so every change is seamless.
Here goes-
1. Effects loop out into boss noise reducer.
2.send out of noise reducer into Aguilar TLC compressor.
3.out of TLC into b3k bass OD (stays on)
3. Out of B3K into EH big muff pi.
4.out of EH into mxr Envelope filter
5.out of mxr to noise reducer return.
6. Out of noise reducer into a Klark Technic Active DI
This then goes to house and to my "dirty/effected" amp

My effects chain never returns to the effect return on the sansamp but just goes straight to house and my "effected" amp....

The DI on the sansamp goes to house as Dry/uneffected signal and the 1/4 goes to my clean amp. (I use Two markbass 2-10 combos. Wet and dry.


I do this because I play in several bands. That require a synthy keyboard style sound but don't jeopardize my general sound.

Sounds crazy but its actually pretty simple.

Thoughts?

[HolmeBass]

I am having trouble using fuzz before my filter- too much gain to keep the fuzz worthy on its own, so it ends up not working with my filter settings that work with my clean sound. Maybe a filter with programmable settings, one for fuzz, one for clean? I don't much like to tweak knobs on the gig.

I do have great success using an almost unity gain OD (very slight boost to help compensate for low-end drop) in front of my filter; sounds great. And filter into fuzz can sound killer, with the right fuzz (sounds great in front of my TAFM where I am using a large amount of clean along with the fuzz).

I used compression at the end of the chain to try to control some excessive resonant peaks in the filters I was using back then. I dropped the comp and switched to a different EF to solve the excessive resonant peak / volume boost problem. But of all things, you should really try the comp out in both places for yourself- many people swear by comp first.

[blastjv]

FWIW, I do this (I have other pedals, too, but I'll stick to the ones relevant to your question):

Touch-sensitive light Overdrive
Filter
High Gain Fuzz (which I never use with the filter, but sounds great into the wah)
Powerful Wah (which is a type of filter)
High Gain Distortion (I never use this with the filter, but it sounds great after the wah)
Mild Compression (smooths out peaks)

I have no problems using light compression after fuzz or overdrive. I would definitely not use it before my overdrive because I want to control the amount of OD with the strength of my attack.

Also, in the studio I did use a fuzz into a filter (old Tall Font Russian Muff into a EHX Microsynth) and got a great sound.

It's good to understand why one arrangement MIGHT produce a particular result, but you really need to just monkey with your rig in many combinations and you'll find what works and what doesn't.

-JV

[jaibeau]

Problem with fuzz after filter is if you want sustaining synth like tones, the fuzz really needs to feed the filter the juice to do its thing, otherwise the fuzz will only receive the bottom of filters attack and the filter needs that sustaining fuzz...Hmmmmm, damn pedals-

[Matt Dean]

Here's my signal chain: CO2 (octave)>Rusty Box (overdrive)>B3K (overdrive)>QF2 (distortion)>TFR (distortion/fuzz)>Wonder Love (Filter)>Proton (Filter)>Tremolessence (tremelo)>Psilosybe (phaser).

[Snakeman1066]

good article on the subject

http://www.gmarts.org/index.php?go=222

[cheapbasslovin]

Originally Posted by Got2SadowskyNYC

It's tradional to put filters before drives because of how it makes the drive sound. These are input sensitive so minor changes effects how they break up.

I don't know that I agree with the tradition part of this statement. Filter before fuzz keeps the dynamics of the filter and pushes a narrow range to the most harmonic distortion. Filter after fuzz kills some of the dynamics on the filter but applies the filter to a broad harmonically rich signal. Some like one way some like the other. Subtlety isn't usually my gig, so I mostly go for filter after fuzz. Anecdotally most boards I see around here go fuzz>filter or use a filter with an effects loop (which is just the greatest), but that could just be me reaffirming what I like to do.

And to show that I'm not a total tool that doesn't read peoples complete post I recognize this statement as a piece of great truth:

Originally Posted by Got2SadowskyNYC

The main rule with pedals is there are none. There are reasons for the placement that most people use but there's no reason you have to do it that way.

[jeffgnr90]

Well I'm waiting on a tech 21 red ripper to come in the mail, in the mean time I'm trying to figure where I'm going to place it.

I have a digitech rp80 I use for just the compressor
Sansamp bddi deluxe
Boss oc-3

What would you guys do as far as the order? The way I have it set up now is DigiTech > oc-3>sansamp>head. The DigiTech does also have a filter setting, so idk what I'm gonna do as far as placement goes with that pedal. Having the compressor and filter on st the same time might be screwy? I suppose the only way to tell is to try it out and see.

[fisticuffs]

I like my fuzz before my filter. It really makes the filter stand out by giving it some high end buzz to effect. I go tuner>Preamp>Octave>Fuzz>Envelope Filter>Chorus> amp (with built in compression).

[jeffgnr90]

Originally Posted by fisticuffs

I like my fuzz before my filter. It really makes the filter stand out by giving it some high end buzz to effect. I go tuner>Preamp>Octave>Fuzz>Envelope Filter>Chorus> amp (with built in compression).

What preamp do you use? Jw

[fisticuffs]

Just got the MXR M80, had the Hartke pedal before that. Effects like drive, fuzz, etc generally go up front. if this were a channel strip on a mixing board they would all be the preamp. Then your inserts (compression, gate, EQ) then aux sends for other effects like delay filters verb. I put the Octave before the fuzz because it tracks better with a clean signal that it does with a fuzzy signal.