safest way to use subsonic effects at high volume in a rock band?

bovine mind · #1 05-21-2009, 12:36 PM

This topic has spillover to the effects and amps forums. For the last year i've been trying to figure out the safest way to use sub bass effects such as the Moog LPF, Boss OC-2, etc both clean and with absurd amounts of high gain fuzz.

currently i'm using an SVT-CL + 810e. My band is in the doom metal realm but has crossover into electronic genres as well.

I'm trying to figure out how to get the loudest clean sub bass tone with my Moog + OC-2, and also be able to kick in my Depth Charge fuzz for a very aggressive, possibly speaker shredding sound. When i kick the fuzz on with the setting i like to use without the sub fx, the sound is incredible but sounds very detrimental to my speakers. It would be a hassle to have to bend down and adjust it to a less intense setting each time i want to use both sounds in the same song. I'd rather not add another fuzz pedal for this.

what are the best ways to protect my speakers but get optimum volume?

ideas:

add a subwoofer with crossover. Active? Needs to be Cheap. Would it be safe to power one of the other output of my SVT-CL, and would i have enough power for this? It seems most are 8 ohms, i'd like a 4 ohm model.
compressor / sonic maximizer or sub sonic filter to roll off the extreme lows? Worried the latter will kill the punch and room rattling dynamics i love from the sub octave fx.

redneck2wild · #2 05-21-2009, 01:00 PM

Some Crossovers & EQs have a switchable subsonic filter or low cut on them. You probably need something like that in combination with a Sub that can actually safely produce those sub lows.

rnilson · #3 05-21-2009, 01:44 PM

So is it the loud fuzz with out the the subs that are killing your speakers or the subs alone? I could't quite make it out in your post.
If it is the volume jump of the fuzz when not behind the filter you could use a volume pedal. If it is the subs a crossover and good sub cab would work, but it is not gonna be cheap.

bovine mind · #4 05-21-2009, 02:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rnilson

So is it the loud fuzz with out the the subs that are killing your speakers or the subs alone? I could't quite make it out in your post.
If it is the volume jump of the fuzz when not behind the filter you could use a volume pedal. If it is the subs a crossover and good sub cab would work, but it is not gonna be cheap.

it's the fuzz i'm mainly worried about, so far my 810e seems to take it alright but i imagine over time and with sustained notes i'll damage it. a volume pedal is definitely a good idea. i'd also like the clean sub bass [ at the moog LPF setting your recommended in my other post ] to be louder without getting too dirty. for this i think a sub/crossover is needed. my limit is around 400-500 for the entire package if possible.

newbold · #5 05-21-2009, 08:22 PM

well you could get a single bypass loop and put an EHX signal pad in with your fuzz.

If you're running an 810 you shouldn't have to worry about your low end getting dirty.

I never had problems with dirty low end without drive or fuzz while using an oc-2 even when I was underpowered.

My speaker shredding tone is:
green ringer (octava in my OFO) >
fuzz (fuzz in my OFO)>
EHX Bassballs>
Octave/filter (BMS) >
notched phase (ep-1).

The EP-1 isn't absolutely necessary but it really tweaks the grit nicely and lets the right sawtoothy rip from my octava/fuzz/balls come through. If I had a Moog LPF after that I think it would be just ridiculous...and coming out of an SVT 810??

My BMS realy just does filter duty. I rarely set it to sweep anymore. What a neat tool but I have an OC-2 coming in the mail and am a little scared that I'll want to get rid of my BMS since I'm getting some really crazy synthy grit from my bassballs and OFO. I'm thinking that I could get more out of a good Parametric EQ than my BMS.

If you have some distortion you like, lots of low end, a good filter, and a big rig AND are going to get more stuff then you're gonna have one mad summer.

Another suggestion I have is to get a BYOC Armstrong Twin - green ringer and orange squeezer together...You can get them premade from 'Axe and you Shall Receive'.

My OFO's octava distortion is (i think) quite a bit like the green ringer, and a squishy compressed green ringer before a big snarly fuzz might just be the best thing before your OC-2 and it'll cost a lot less than a sub/crossover setup. That sub octave would pack a wallop after a compressor.

bovine mind · #6 05-22-2009, 11:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by newbold

well you could get a single bypass loop and put an EHX signal pad in with your fuzz.

If you're running an 810 you shouldn't have to worry about your low end getting dirty.

I never had problems with dirty low end without drive or fuzz while using an oc-2 even when I was underpowered.

The EP-1 isn't absolutely necessary but it really tweaks the grit nicely and lets the right sawtoothy rip from my octava/fuzz/balls come through. If I had a Moog LPF after that I think it would be just ridiculous...and coming out of an SVT 810??

If you have some distortion you like, lots of low end, a good filter, and a big rig AND are going to get more stuff then you're gonna have one mad summer.

thanks for input. most of the threads i've read on TB on this subject address the use of intense sub fx without ear shredding fuzz or distortion. i'm on the far end of bass fuzz, i go for as dirty and dense as possible. even those who use sub fx in clean setups warn to be very careful with speakers, so adding the amount of dirt i do is cause for alarm. i'm all out of board space, so rack and cab options are what i'm looking at.

i think a dedicated sub is the best approach. the DBX sub units have that subwoofer out option, while this would be ideal for beefing up my clean signal, how well would a sub handle a huge amount of fuzz?