Sawtoth Waveform?

newbold · #1 10-09-2008, 10:10 PM

Gonna be looking to make my BMS bite more in the next year.

Anyone know of any good useful mod tools that have a sawtooth waveform?

Switchable?

Any help is appreciated.

B.C. · #2 10-09-2008, 10:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by newbold

Gonna be looking to make my BMS bite more in the next year.

Anyone know of any good useful mod tools that have a sawtooth waveform?

Switchable?

Any help is appreciated.

Hmm, not off hand. This might be impossible to do without digital signal processing. Not sure though.

mikeboth · #3 10-09-2008, 11:04 PM

It'd be possible somehow to generate a sawtooth from the BMS internals, but I doubt it would be the worth the time and effort. Checkout some synth diy oscillator and waveshaping circuits.

bongomania · #4 10-10-2008, 12:01 AM

+1, a sawtooth is easy if you have the right tools, but extracting the right tools from within the existing circuit would be a huge headache IMO.

newbold · #5 10-10-2008, 12:46 AM

which oscillator effects have sawtooth waveform for less than $150?

bongomania · #6 10-10-2008, 12:51 AM

I don't know of any off the top of my head in that price range... but for clarity, are you looking for a rising or falling slope? Do you have a wavelength range in mind? Does it matter whether the effect is any particular type, e.g. tremolo, filter, etc.?

Seems like there must be a Line 6 item with this feature which could fit your budget, at least used.

newbold · #7 10-10-2008, 12:52 AM

i haven't found many mods...as most of them have a triangle wave instead of sawtooth.

that guyatone pedal seems to have a saw fuzz...as does the ampeg scrambler.

newbold · #8 10-10-2008, 12:54 AM

for $400...the guyatone optical line has it. grr.

Guess that takes the cost effectiveness out of my modular synth line.

bongomania · #9 10-10-2008, 08:58 AM

Hmmm... when you set the TZ-2 next to the Ultron it makes me question what you think a sawtooth wave sounds like. The first will be at a very high frequency, where the individual waves will be heard as a continuous raspy tone; the second will be at a very low frequency, which will be heard as a repetitive swooping up or swooping down of the effect.

bigchiefbc · #10 10-10-2008, 09:48 AM

The Moog Freqbox can do a sawtooth wave. You can get one used on the Bay for somewhere around 250. That's the best I got.

MatticusMania · #11 10-10-2008, 01:11 PM

Take apart an ehx stereo pulsar. It has a toggle switch for sine or saw tooth waves, and is only about $80 new.

mrbungle · #12 10-10-2008, 02:14 PM

None of the previously mentioned pedals work in this context. Mostly people have been suggesting pedals which have saw LFO modulating the original signal. What you want is either a saw wave oscillator following the pitch of the bass, or a waveshaper which distorts the bass signal to have the even harmonic spectrum of a saw wave.

It seems that there's no good waveshaper solutions (Korg G5 has a decent one, but the pedal is quite hard to find), but there's several pedals which synthesize the saw wave using the pitch of the original signal. Boss SYB-3, SYB-5, Behringer BSY-600, Akai Deep Impact and Chunk Systems Octavius Squeezer comes to mind.

newbold · #13 10-10-2008, 02:48 PM

I've heard some great tones come out the Line6 FM4 but for what I'll be using the pulsar's probably the best first step.

I just want some flavour on my synth when the time comes. I've had trem suggested to me a lot so I think I'll probably check out the pulsar.

I have a polyphase that needs to be fixed and I really loved my worm so 3 mod boxes is gonna be more than I'll need...ugh.

All these tools cost so much dough. Glad to know I don't need them anytime soon.

Also, line loss...a huge chain's gonna suck a lot of tone. I'm almost tempted to get a multi effects box and be done with it.

Hope I don't ever have to go that route.

kevteop · #14 10-10-2008, 07:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mrbungle

It seems that there's no good waveshaper solutions (Korg G5 has a decent one, but the pedal is quite hard to find),

The sawtooth on the G5 is pretty good but I've been putting it into the BMS with poor results - it seems you need a huge level from the G5 to trigger the BMS' filter, I think because the G5 tends to give quite a soft attack even with the fast sawtooth. And the octave voices on the BMS don't carry much of the sawtooth character.

I've only spent a short time attempting it, I might get better results. The G5 only turned up today.

Taylor Livingston · #15 10-10-2008, 11:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by newbold

I've heard some great tones come out the Line6 FM4 but for what I'll be using the pulsar's probably the best first step.

I just want some flavour on my synth when the time comes. I've had trem suggested to me a lot so I think I'll probably check out the pulsar.

I have a polyphase that needs to be fixed and I really loved my worm so 3 mod boxes is gonna be more than I'll need...ugh.

All these tools cost so much dough. Glad to know I don't need them anytime soon.

Also, line loss...a huge chain's gonna suck a lot of tone. I'm almost tempted to get a multi effects box and be done with it.

Hope I don't ever have to go that route.

Hmm, I am pretty perplexed here. As per Bongo's post, you are talking about a bunch of different things that, while they do all involve sawtooth waves, will sound completely different and really have nothing to do with each other.

What are you looking for exactly? A synth playing a sawtooth wave? A tremolo? A filter? All these pedals use sawtooth waves to do different things. A Pulsar cannot make a synth sound, it is a tremolo.

newbold · #16 10-10-2008, 11:43 PM

With my BMS I need oscillation to really make it sound and feel like a synth rig. Without waveform oscillation it's just filter distortion/colour and envelope.

Have been thinking about drive/fuzz/octave to help with voicing but really will need oscillators to make the experience complete and diverse.

I like the bite of a sawtooth auditory wave but an oscillator (mod pedal) will give me the effect of different waveform LFOs that control various parts of synth sections in old synthesizers. If the guyatone fuzz were put before an octave pedal then the -1 and -2 octaves would bring it out a bit more. Perhaps a POG would be better than an OC-2 for mimicking the sawtooth waveform...may have to get 2 octave voicing boxes to get what I want (hog/pog, oc-2, shifter...ugh...)

Save getting into loads of filter modulation (a couple of synths or pedals, different fuzz, distortion, vocoding etc.) I know variable waveform modulation and an oc-2 will do pretty much everything I'm looking for right now that doesn't include looping and delay.

Have really liked the little bit of what I've heard of the freq box...but I don't have a drum machine or hardware synthesizer...so I'm gonna have to do this in baby steps.

And more and more that I hear from the slicer makes me think that's a good step between a drum machine and keyboard.

All this thinking about synth and signal path makes me just want to find a great organ player and drummer so I can justify getting a tone hammer and sticking dry. So much less $, setup, and tapdancing.

bongomania · #17 10-10-2008, 11:53 PM

So you're looking for both high-frequency and low-frequency waveforms, hoping for both tone generation and LFO modulation of processing of externally-generated signals? Understand: they are the same waveform but implemented very, very differently, with utterly different audible results.

newbold · #18 10-11-2008, 01:53 AM

I understand that. the guyatone fuzz and the ampeg scrambler both have a sawtooth characteristic of the signal...where a mod would act as the LFO...

I've played a scrambler but it's not a very tweakable effect. it's my main pick for a distortion box...curious how the guyatone stacks up. Really though that's not so important to me as the oscillator.

It would be great to have control over the waveform shape (depth and octave/harmonic) and blend with the colour of the filter/voicing...but there i go again being so damn demanding.

I'm looking for tools and control - not just to have a bunch of cool pedals.

Anyhoo...I love phaser with my BMS, but also want to have waveform options as that's the most attainable flavour...it's about a third the cost of getting into filter/voice modelling that I've seen.

I Saw freqBox demos online and while it looks like an awesome unit, I haven't heard it used in a way that seems really versatile...Although some of the drum machine/access virus stuff reminded me a lot of what the Slicer did...so it at least made me think.

But maybe it's just for a guy like me to get it and put a video on youtube.

I don't want to have to go boutique, moog, or those guyatone optical effects to get what I want.

That's gotta come when I'm making the money to spend on it...and can really justify it and in these tight times I can't just yet.

mrbungle · #19 10-11-2008, 03:21 AM

If anyone is interested in true, perfect sawtooth waveform oscillator controlled by bass, I've been thinking about buying Line6 Tonecore DSP unit when it comes out, and doing two different programs for that. The other idea is:

-Saw / square wave on the other output. Pitch is controlled by bass signal
-Original signal on the other output

Then you could plug the saw wave to Moogerfooger or some other filter. The original signal can be used as envelope source.

The other idea is to use the Tonecore pedal as CV / envelope converter. So, you plug the bass in, and use the two outputs to control a real modular synthesizer with CV / gate / env inputs. This would beat even the Chunk Systems pedal.

newbold · #20 10-12-2008, 01:43 AM

hold on...tonecore?

so we can just make up our own pedals on our computer now?

sounds like a world of trouble!