Trem Choice

TaySte_2000 · #1 06-02-2008, 04:09 AM

OK so I've decided I want/need a trem

and I've narrowed my choises down to the Mojohand Sugar Baby and the Catalinbread Valcoder. I'm not really interested in other brands or extra features of say the Empress, I've pretty much ruled everything out for various reasons.

The main purpose is to give the weird standalone analog synth on the noise side of my board some movement and a beat to the oscilation, which I've simulated with a chorus pedal and really like just didn't like the swirl of the chorus at the same time. But obviously I'd also like to be able to play through it ala Yes etc

I've listened to both and to my ears the Mojohand sounds better a bit warmer if you will and I'm assured it can do that hard chop like the square wave of the Valcoder which is perfect for the synth and the warmer sound also makes it better for playing through.

The Valcoder sounds really good as well and can do the light shimmer to massive volume drops like the sugar baby can but the sound while not bad is really transparent what you get in is what you get out only choppier

which isn't a bad thing and I'm wondering if just running a light overdrive before it will give it a more sugar baby tone. The thing that is really drawing me in is it can go really slow, much slower than what I've heard the sugar baby do but the clips of the SB are quite limited it can also go really fast and get those ring mod type sounds and of course it's tiny and will look great next to the other 3 mini catalinbread pedals I will have.

So I'm unsure of either at this point and my only concern on the sugarbaby is it might cost me a pedal later on such as the mojohand flanger which I will be buying.

There is always the option to buy both and sell the one I like the least

but for all I know I'll love trem and want to get rid of some other modulation

So yeah advice please

dannybuoy · #2 06-02-2008, 04:27 AM

I've been considering getting a BYOC tremolo. The advantage with this is that you could adjust the min/max speed by changing resistor values if you wanted!

Max Roberts · #3 06-02-2008, 04:37 AM

It seems you have your mind set on the sugar baby to me...

The Valcoder is based on the Vox Repeat Percusions right? Like the Earthquaker devices repeat percussions? if it is then i think the Valcoder will only do choppy tremolo. This is the kind of trem I want so I'd probably get that. But for more versitility and more trem options just go for the sugarbaby.

TaySte_2000 · #4 06-02-2008, 04:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Max Roberts

It seems you have your mind set on the sugar baby to me...

The Valcoder is based on the Vox Repeat Percusions right? Like the Earthquaker devices repeat percussions? if it is then i think the Valcoder will only do choppy tremolo. This is the kind of trem I want so I'd probably get that. But for more versitility and more trem options just go for the sugarbaby.

I've heard the Valcoder do nice smooth trem as well as hard chop due to the depth knob so it falls down to tone and size really I believe both would do the job I want

judas jedermann · #5 06-02-2008, 04:58 AM

Valcoder sounds very nice. I`ve been using Boss TR-2 for years now but it is quite boring. I use tremolo only for machine-gun-sound so I guess Valcoder would do it much better than TR-2. Is there any place in EU that sells Catalinbreads?

bongomania · #6 06-02-2008, 05:18 AM

Srsly though Ste, have enough people on Earth used both of these pedals to offer you any sort of realistic advice? Has anyone on Earth used both of these?

TaySte_2000 · #7 06-02-2008, 05:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bongomania

Srsly though Ste, have enough people on Earth used both of these pedals to offer you any sort of realistic advice? Has anyone on Earth used both of these?

I could start a Timmy C thread instead

bongomania · #8 06-02-2008, 05:23 AM

OK, OK, you win! I'd rather have a thread about two esoteric trems, thanks.

Max Roberts · #9 06-02-2008, 05:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TaySte_2000

I've heard the Valcoder do nice smooth trem as well as hard chop due to the depth knob so it falls down to tone and size really I believe both would do the job I want

Well you have to choose whether you want the tone of the sugarbaby or want a collection of catalinbread minis

.

Higgie · #10 06-02-2008, 05:41 AM

Just get them both. You know you will eventually anyway

TaySte_2000 · #11 06-02-2008, 06:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Higgie

Just get them both. You know you will eventually anyway

Go away you're being mean

TaySte_2000 · #12 06-02-2008, 06:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Max Roberts

Well you have to choose whether you want the tone of the sugarbaby or want a collection of catalinbread minis

.

I like how you've summed my whole post into one sentance and been no help at all

dannybuoy · #13 06-02-2008, 06:18 AM

There's a Red Witch Pentavocal trem on ebay UK at the moment, looks awesome, although bigger than the Mojo Hand / Catalinbread pedals...

TaySte_2000 · #14 06-02-2008, 06:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dannybuoy

There's a Red Witch Pentavocal trem on ebay UK at the moment, looks awesome, although bigger than the Mojo Hand / Catalinbread pedals...

Mojohand is about as big as I want to go and TBH I've never been thrilled by Red Witch and I hear a lot of issues with reliability but regardless as you said it's to big.

Jared Lash · #15 06-02-2008, 07:59 AM

Um, the obvious question is, do you want a smooth triangle wave trem or a choppy square wave trem?

For your purposes, I would assume the latter, but really this is the crux of your decision. Personally I like having the versatility, but if I had to choose I'd say a square wave trem is more useful to me.

For what it's worth, when I went through my truckload of trems about a year ago I never really considered the Sugar Baby. And that was because while all the samples sounded great, it wasn't extreme enough (either in rate or depth) for me. IMO it's a great guitar trem but not a great bass trem. But again, that's based on research and samples and not actually having one at my feet.

**grygrx** · #16 06-02-2008, 08:02 AM

I have a hard time seeing trem as really useful without a tap tempo. That said, I couldn't even find use for a trem (Tap a Whirl) that had one.

TaySte_2000 · #17 06-02-2008, 08:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheBigO

Um, the obvious question is, do you want a smooth triangle wave trem or a choppy square wave trem?

For your purposes, I would assume the latter, but really this is the crux of your decision. Personally I like having the versatility, but if I had to choose I'd say a square wave trem is more useful to me.

For what it's worth, when I went through my truckload of trems about a year ago I never really considered the Sugar Baby. And that was because while all the samples sounded great, it wasn't extreme enough (either in rate or depth) for me. IMO it's a great guitar trem but not a great bass trem. But again, that's based on research and samples and not actually having one at my feet.

Yeah I think the Valcoder is winning at the moment due to this, seems the Sugar Baby would be better for my normal playing and the Valcoder for the synth stuff but since the Valcoder can do more subtle stuff as well it will probably "do" for the rare occasions when I will use it for normal stuff.

Thanks for the advice guys.

I'll do a clip later if I can of my synth side and use the chorus for the throb sound to explain how much it affects the sound and makes it more listenable.

Thanks

Jared Lash · #18 06-02-2008, 08:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TaySte_2000

I'll do a clip later if I can of my synth side and use the chorus for the throb sound to explain how much it affects the sound and makes it more listenable.

It's funny you mention this. I was playing around with the BMS and later with my Octabass/MessDrive/Robotalk/PS-3/Liquaflange and I ran both through a chorus (actually the George Dennis with a touch of feedback/flange) and then tried both through the Empress.

I like the "pulsing" from a trem a lot better than from a chorus, even on more subtle settings. It's a cleaner sound for sure. Not that it's germane to the topic at hand, but even though it took much more tweaking, I also liked the "synth" from a combination of pedals more than the BMS.

TaySte_2000 · #19 06-02-2008, 08:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheBigO

It's funny you mention this. I was playing around with the BMS and later with my Octabass/MessDrive/Robotalk/PS-3/Liquaflange and I ran both through a chorus (actually the George Dennis with a touch of feedback/flange) and then tried both through the Empress.

I like the "pulsing" from a trem a lot better than from a chorus, even on more subtle settings. It's a cleaner sound for sure. Not that it's germane to the topic at hand, but even though it took much more tweaking, I also liked the "synth" from a combination of pedals more than the BMS.

Well these synth sounds are more akin to Tecx's synth even though he'll probably shoot me in the face for saying that.

Lots of wierd blips and squeals the point is to have that going and with the trem it would throb and give the drone movement making it easier on the ears it would also set a temp for my solo compositions as over this noise I plan to do lots of melodic playing, I've been expermenting so far and have some pretty good stuff going but with out my volume pedals I can't currently control the volume of the noise and mix it up if you get me, but I'll post a rough soundclip of what I'm trying to achieve tonight if I get all my recording gear to work.

Jared Lash · #20 06-02-2008, 08:57 AM

In that case, I'm not sure what the smallest trem with tap tempo is, but if I were you I'd find out. Unless being able to reproduce something you played earlier isn't important. I'm all for randomness (sample & hold on the Robotalk, the unpredictability of the MuRF) but with a tremolo it's really just about being able to dial in the same tempo.

I'm with grygrx in that I don't find trems useful on bass without tap tempo. I'm not with him in the sense that I use trem all the time.

I would love to hear some clips of your setup, both now and when you get everything sussed out.