Tube OD / DIST Idea...

chicago_mike · #1 12-18-2008, 12:27 PM

Im still in design phase of this thing as I keep getting brainstorms of what to do.

What it seems like is most of the bass distortions or dist pedals used on bass could use a low mid knob. Mostly for punch. Like 200hz or so. What say you guys and gals?

What else are the other pedals missing in od / dist tones or options? Does a blend foot controller entice or is that just a useless add-on?

so far it has 3 x 12AX7's so options I can do.

And no, Im not going to starve the plates. I plan on running them around 240 B+. So dont open up this beast!

roflol · #2 12-18-2008, 12:37 PM

200hertz is a bad frequency in a mix it tends to make everything sound muddy once you add distorted guitars, i recomend using an active baxandall tone control with a mid boost switch, since you've got 3 ax7s. What transformers did you use for this pedal btw?

chicago_mike · #3 12-18-2008, 12:50 PM

I have ideas with a baxandall and other eq ideas too. Just thinking out loud.

The proto, right now is in an old hammond amp chassis, but Ill be using one or 2 toroidals, not hammonds as Im trying to conserve space as well. But thats also debateable.

Offto work, but if you have ideas of what you want / dont want, please post and hopefully soon Ill have clips of the working prototype.

peace

bongomania · #4 12-18-2008, 01:06 PM

Yeah I would tend to boost nearer 300-500 Hz. Blending we've got a ton of options for already, and it is only useful about half the time IMO, and then usually only if you add the option of phase adjustment.

I think the only thing missing from the tube distortion pedals on the market is BALLS. I don't mean "amount of distortion", there is an infinite range of subtle to extreme/bizarre distortion available in current products. And I don't necessarily mean low-mid boost, although that can help a lot. It just seems to me that the majority of 12A*7 based distortions are just a mix of mushy and buzzy. The buzz can be ameliorated by turning down the highs/tweeter, but then what if you want a brighter more articulate sound? The mush can be helped by running at lower gain, but then where's the heavy distortion? And the distortion response in the highs/high mids is never the same as the response in the lows.

I feel that the best possible thing any builder could do in the world of 12A*7 based distortions is tweak the circuit and components to deliver the most articulate, resonant, full tone possible while running at higher distortion levels. So far I have not heard that, out of well over a dozen tube distortions I've owned. Best I've heard were either solid state, or not 12A*7's.

staindbass · #5 12-18-2008, 01:11 PM

how bout variable center frequency,and level. like 100hz to 1k ? that way everyone can get thier own individual sound. i think it would make it more flexable. johnny a. staind

markjazzbassist · #6 12-18-2008, 01:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bongomania

Yeah I would tend to boost nearer 300-500 Hz. Blending we've got a ton of options for already, and it is only useful about half the time IMO, and then usually only if you add the option of phase adjustment.

I think the only thing missing from the tube distortion pedals on the market is BALLS. I don't mean "amount of distortion", there is an infinite range of subtle to extreme/bizarre distortion available in current products. And I don't necessarily mean low-mid boost, although that can help a lot. It just seems to me that the majority of 12A*7 based distortions are just a mix of mushy and buzzy. The buzz can be ameliorated by turning down the highs/tweeter, but then what if you want a brighter more articulate sound? The mush can be helped by running at lower gain, but then where's the heavy distortion? And the distortion response in the highs/high mids is never the same as the response in the lows.

I feel that the best possible thing any builder could do in the world of 12A*7 based distortions is tweak the circuit and components to deliver the most articulate, resonant, full tone possible while running at higher distortion levels. So far I have not heard that, out of well over a dozen tube distortions I've owned. Best I've heard were either solid state, or not 12A*7's.

well put and i agree wholeheartedly. i used to think "tubes man, that must mean it sounds awesome and really warm", then i played some. i really don't like the tube overdrives (not to mention the noise that accompanies most) and have just dealt with the fact that the "fat tube tone" will just have to come out of my amp, and it does.

to the OP - my favorite bass overdrives have been the ones with a simple tone knob. you know what i do with that tone knob? all the way left (bass). I want BASS overdrive, not "cutting mids" or "grind" or "slight dirt". I don't need a blend (i'm using overdrive, i want drive, full ON drive). So hence why i like simple gain (cranked), tone (full left for bass) and volume (unity) overdrives. simple and exactly what the doc ordered. Bass overdrive....yum

paganjack · #7 12-18-2008, 01:27 PM

the VT bass' bass knob is centered at 125Hz. It seems to be quite punchy to me- I would almost consider that frequency low mids...

I agree with the other posters about the tube OD sound- it sounds a little mushy. I have my English Muff'n Loaded with a 12ay7->12ax7 and although it makes for a nice bristly fuzz, I would not describe it as punchy. Running the VT into the Muff'n turns out pretty nice tho! it sort of focuses the tone to my ears.

If there was a way you could get some crazy gain but retain note definition and punch out of that design, I think there would be a serious market for it.

DanRJBrasil · #8 12-18-2008, 01:36 PM

sweepable mid cut and boost

would be better

ibnzneksrul · #9 12-18-2008, 03:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by staindbass

how bout variable center frequency,and level. like 100hz to 1k ? that way everyone can get thier own individual sound. i think it would make it more flexable. johnny a. staind

Quote:

Originally Posted by DanRJBrasil

sweepable mid cut and boost

would be better

+1 & +1, a semi-para mid control would add lots of versatility.

roflol · #10 12-18-2008, 03:39 PM

have you considered subminis? i've been experimenting with some that only need a plate voltage of 50v. Made for some warm epic loud clean boosts they don't like being pushed into overdrive to much though, my quest for power amp distortion in a box continues

chicago_mike · #11 12-18-2008, 04:51 PM

I havent messed with minis yet. I am interested however. And I do agree many tube pedals dont sound too good.

The only tube based pedals I liked were the Budda fatman and the H&K Tube factor. I also had the sbe tubedrive and an overdrive electronics valvegrinder...that one was really versatile, just needed a little more punch for bass.

Sweepable mids along with something like a tonal balance or big muff tone control? Basically both are the same.