What do they mean "Attack" on the tone?

[badboy1984]

I'm kinda stagger at the moment trying to find the right tone to fit in the band. Was doing some recording yesterday and it seems the band don't like my tone too much and say my bass lack of attack.

We don't mic amp etc during the recording so everything is going direct to the mixer. The 2 guitar players uses a Line 6 pod to use the effects and amp modular. Where as me I run my bass pedal board direct to the mixer.

Here is my setup: Bass --> Boss tuner --> Boss CS-3 --> Boss SYN3 --> EBS Chorus --> Jim Dunlop Bass Crybaby --> Bassball Nano --> EBS Dyna Reverb --> MXR M80

Every single effect is off and i get a pretty good transparent tone. The only one i use to shape the tone is the MXR M80 and the Boss CS-3. My band like the CS-3 compression because i get that punch out of the bass but they say my bass sound is lack of attack. I try shape the tone on the MXR like mess around with different EQ and color on and off but still no join.

To let you all know, i just a Fender Classic 60 jazz bass with Dimarzio DP123 and J-Retro so i guess i can get a very good tone out of the bass. At the end i have to crack the mid and Treble up on the J-Retro and the mid on the MXR. But they still i lack of attack.

I guess they want that pick tone instead of finger style i using. Thats the only thing i can think off, any suggestions guys?

[rcubed]

I "lack of attack" is guitard for "needs more treble".

[wetzelman1]

that's the whole reason I play with a pick in my band. I can play with my fingers and will for some parts but a pick just gets the right sound for us. I'm in a techy metal band with 1 guitar so I actually have more prominence in the mix and have a need for strong attack, clarity and bite. I also use a fuzz and a pick with fuzz is where it's at.

[guroove]

Compression can be funny. What sounds like "punch" to one person can sound like a lack of attack to someone else. Does your compressor have an attack control? Do you use light compression or is it totally squashed?

[badboy1984]

i really don't know to behonest. After listen to the recording i think my tone is not too bad overall, i like that very mid growl on jazz bass but it seems lack of attack for them.

I bet is some kind of EQ settings overall instead of my bass i guess ....... Maybe they need that Fender P bass sound instead.

I guess i should bring my Warwick Corvette with EMG pickup and Retro preamp next time and that shud give more balls, if not i really got no idea ..........

Reason i use the Fender Jazz is i feel the sound would be better when recording and the setup on the fender is more then half decent as well .....

[badboy1984]

Originally Posted by guroove

Compression can be funny. What sounds like "punch" to one person can sound like a lack of attack to someone else. Does your compressor have an attack control? Do you use light compression or is it totally squashed?

The compressor do have the attack knob. Sound get more edgy and sharper when attack knob is turn clockwise and sound get abit rounder when turn anti clockwise.

[megadan]

Try the P-bass and see if that's what they need.
Also try the J with a pick - if that doesn't give attack I don't know would.

If they really, really mean attack, maybe you do need an amp - some gain systems are 'spongier' than others- for example, the GK series of bass amps is know for it's quick attack properties.
Other Things they could mean by "attack:"

-sustain (you are holding your notes and then want them to be muted tighter - this is a left hand technique)
-more treble
-more upper mids (pick attack)
-less 'bloom' or rumble from the low end.

Also get them to listen to your tone alone and then in the mix and see if they can offer more specific critisism.

[RayO5421]

The best bass tone I ever got while recording was using 2 mics on my cab while using an MXR M80 bass driver. If I recall, one mic was a condenser- the kind used to record acoustic guitars. The other mic was a regular vocal. I'm not too sure on the brands of either.

Using this setup technically gave me 2 tracks of bass in the mix but it was the most present tone that I've ever had on a recording. Not exactly sure what your players mean by "attack" but maybe you'll want to try atleast one mic track in addition to your bass going straight into the mixer?

EDIT: To megadan's post, I was using a GK head, Avatar 210 cab, and an active Fender P bass- sounds like a recipe for a pretty sweet recording tone.

[badboy1984]

mic the amp or cab is not really a possible solution for the band since they want everything to go direct to the mix.

I don't have a proper precision bass top record, i got a squier classic vibe 50 precision bass but i'm not too sure about that bass will sound good when record but i will give it a shot next time.

I guess i need more treble and upper mid on the sound instead of the low mid and some rumble i usual get when playing live.

I guess I just need to mess around with the settings until I find a good one to record.

[Ric5]

to me attack means aggressively attacking the strings.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=djVGhqvl_8A

[badboy1984]

to me i feel my tone sound aggressive and alot of mid growl when listen to the track after recording. I don't mind using a tone that fits the band as long as i know what I lack. I think I need to work out with them to see what exactly is lacking.

[alirazz]

Check out the EHX knockout "attack equalizer"

[lowendfriend]

"Attack" refers to the first tenth of a second of so of the plucked note.

Next time they are puzzling that with you:
1. Change to a pick
2. Shift balance of pickup to the bridge pickup
3. Tweak your tone for a bit more high mids.

You got more effects than you may know what to do with. Compression amplifies low signals to be more equal with louder signals. Attack is a brief period where the initial loud pluck/pick stands out from the rest of the note. Compression will suppress that. Turn off compression on songs where your mates want to hear attack.

Good luck.

[Mingus Addict]

It seems like the main problem that you're having is that you don't really understand exactly what your band-mates are looking for in your tone. If I were you, I would ask them to give examples of recordings that have bass tones they like. I bet once you've really heard what they're talking about, you'll know what to do.

[badboy1984]

yeah i guess thats probably the best bet. i will ask them next time, but i know the bass player they play around with all the time uses a pick and p bass so i can see where the attack they coming from.

I guess i need to start practicing using the pick, should should start learning how to use a pick ....

[L-A]

If they are trained musicians, chances are they really mean "attack". It mainly comes from the synth world, but it's vital knowledge to any musician nonetheless.

The attack of an instrument is the time it takes for a note to reach its full volume/tone after you played it. Does your compressor "round out" the sound by holding the notes for a short time? Compressors affect the envelope of the sound.

Have a good listen at this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oaP9hCtVXvE

[bassman1185]

The best way to think of attack is with words and letters, I think. For example:

"Sea" - soft attack

"Crazy" - hard attack

"Germany" - medium attack

Having a nice strong attack can be really useful in cutting through a band situation. Compressors can be either really useful or really counter-productive in acheiving a strong attack. It sounds like your compressor can do what you need it to, although if you are recording to an audio program on a computer, you will probably be better off leaving the compressor off and doing any compression in the computer. That will be more versitile.

[sonic assassin]

push 700-3k. turn the gain up a tad.

back off one side of a j pickup to fix the phase problem

turn up attack time on compressor

play harder. fingers or pick. if it hurts, you're doing it right.

fresh roundwound or stainless steel strings help. no snap on dead strings.

my tone is this exact formula, and i was always told to tone it down a bit because i WAS the mix.

[shaolinwhat]

I would imagine that using the M-80 with the color switch engaged, and your jazz bass with a pick would give them the tone they're looking for...

[oyobass]

The cheap compressor I use, is a Behringer Dynamics Compressor DC 9. I think of it as my aggression machine, because of the immediate attack and definition it gives to each note. Cheap and cheerful, well worth a try for $30 or so.