Who was the first bassist to use a chorus or flanger?

bongomania · #1 08-27-2008, 11:51 PM

This thread over in the Bassists forum:
Who was the first bassist to use chorus/flanger?
...was started back in ought deuce, and disinterred a couple of days ago. It never quite got resolved there, so I figured we could import the discussion over here.

As noted in the other thread JPJ used a Leslie cab in '69, but as I argue over there a Leslie isn't exactly a chorus or flange. Phil Lynott is an example from the early-mid '70s... who was before him?

JimmyM · #2 08-28-2008, 12:00 AM

A Leslie is nothing like chorus or flange. A Leslie is a rotating speaker. Chorus and flange are time and pitch based effects. So I agree with you that Leslies don't count.

The first flanged bass I remember is Anthony Jackson on "For the Love of Money." Flangers weren't around much before that, so it couldn't have been much earlier than that. As for chorus, I'm sure someone did it before Phil. Kasim Sulton used one extensively with Todd Rundgren's Utopia (to the point of irritation).

MR PC · #3 08-28-2008, 12:19 AM

Two tape delays, both with the same signal source playing the same program. Malfunctioning motor or sticky head on one of them......you've got a flanger effect when that happens.

MR PC · #4 08-28-2008, 12:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JimmyM

The first flanged bass I remember is Anthony Jackson on "For the Love of Money."

I remember reading an interview with Anthony in which he stated that he used a Maestro Phase Shifter on that track. The one with 3 big switches. He talked about opening it up and fiddling with the trim pots and such.

bongomania · #5 08-28-2008, 12:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MR PC

Two tape delays, both with the same signal source playing the same program. Malfunctioning motor or sticky head on one of them......you've got a flanger effect when that happens.

Oh, that's the first bassist to use that effect.

JimmyM · #6 08-28-2008, 12:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MR PC

I remember reading an interview with Anthony in which he stated that he used a Maestro Phase Shifter on that track. The one with 3 big switches. He talked about opening it up and fiddling with the trim pots and such.

Wow, standing corrected twice in one week! Yep, there's an article about him in the new BP and he says that's what he used. A buddy of mine when we were kids had one of those. They were noisy but great. I favored the Small Stone, though. More control, plus the color switch made a neat wah and talkbox imitation...very important when we did "Do You Feel Like We Do."

sbassface · #7 08-28-2008, 01:07 AM

from teachers who used to know him, about being the first to use that effect.

fuNKmaster83 · #8 08-28-2008, 06:12 AM

as i remember AJ used phaser!!! not a flanger!!!

Geddyfleaharris · #9 08-28-2008, 06:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JimmyM

Kasim Sulton used one extensively with Todd Rundgren's Utopia (to the point of irritation).

Agreed. But I sure did like the line up of Utopia that recorded RA. I saw them open for Blue Oyster Cult about 30 years ago. Todd and the band put on a smokin' show.

aaaa The Legend of Singring and the Glass Guitar....Hiroshima.....

borderline cheese but great music

Toasted · #10 08-28-2008, 06:26 AM

What about someone that did tape-flanging? That could have been before "flangers" existed as FX?

rratajski · #11 08-28-2008, 06:30 AM

Dudes, it was MysticBoo. Seriously.

RickenBoogie · #12 08-28-2008, 07:55 AM

Big props for mentioning Todd Rundgren in a TalkBass thread. Saw him last month, still rockin' hard at 60. Btw, that imitation flange, with a reel to reel deck, (how the effect was 1st created), was used by the Beatles as early as '66. Don't know if that counts, but it's a starting point.

JimmyM · #13 08-28-2008, 08:31 AM

Not only used by the Beatles, but George Martin discovered it. They were doing one of their wild experiments, and George Martin discovered that if he had two tape decks sync'ed up and put his finger on the flange of one of the reels and slowed it down, it made a really cool woosh sound. After that, Lennon requested Martin to do "that flange thing" to his voice on a song. Hence, the name "flanger."

bongomania · #14 08-28-2008, 09:43 AM

So are there any Beatles tunes where the effect is prominent on Paul? Because if there aren't, I'm ruling the Beatles don't count. Sure, some random bassist "may have" accidentally discovered flange on their own, or there may be some track out there where the entire band mix got flanged for a second or two, but that's not the same as a bassist choosing to use a specific effect on themselves. The majority seems to be ruling that AJ may have been the first bassist to use a phaser (which is cool info for sure!), but that still leaves us with chorus and flange.

JimmyM · #15 08-28-2008, 10:56 AM

Quite honestly, I'm finding it hard to care

I hate chorus, and flange on bass is cool in very small doses.

JimmyM · #16 08-28-2008, 12:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Geddyfleaharris

Agreed. But I sure did like the line up of Utopia that recorded RA. I saw them open for Blue Oyster Cult about 30 years ago. Todd and the band put on a smokin' show.

aaaa The Legend of Singring and the Glass Guitar....Hiroshima.....

borderline cheese but great music

Ya, that would have been Todd, Kasim, Roger Powell on keys and Willie Wilcox on drums. Kasim works all the time but I haven't heard a thing from Roger or Willie since then.

MR PC · #17 08-28-2008, 12:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bongomania

Oh, that's the first bassist to use that effect.

Are we talking about famous people, or are we looking for a studio musician who never got credit for scooping a recording engineers invention?

I heard alot of flanging going on with George Martin's work early on for example. Or did one of the engineers involved in the studio come up with the idea?

Unless you were there, the truth cannot be told!

JanusZarate · #18 08-28-2008, 12:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rratajski

Dudes, it was MysticBoo. Seriously.

No, I was the first to use both in one pedal. In parallel.

**Thor** · #19 08-28-2008, 12:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JimmyM

Not only used by the Beatles, but George Martin discovered it. They were doing one of their wild experiments, and George Martin discovered that if he had two tape decks sync'ed up and put his finger on the flange of one of the reels and slowed it down, it made a really cool woosh sound. After that, Lennon requested Martin to do "that flange thing" to his voice on a song. Hence, the name "flanger."

Out of curiosity, how was this different from some of the stuff
Les Paul used to do?

bongomania · #20 08-28-2008, 01:27 PM

I don't see what the confusion is. If there is some George Martin track where an entire band mix got run through a flanger for a moment, then obviously that is not specific to the bass. I am curious to find out the earliest use of flanger or chorus that was specific to the bass and/or the bassist. When I brought this thread over from the bassists forum I was just thinking it would be a fun and whimsical discussion with interesting old tracks being brought to our attention, tracks we might not have personally known of otherwise, with historical use of effects on bass.

Instead we get "here's how flanging was invented", and "here's a producer who used flanger", and "I dunno, it could have been some guy who did it by accident and we'll never know..."

LAME!

Oh well, it was worth a try.

Quote:

Originally Posted by MR PC

Are we talking about famous people, or are we looking for a studio musician who never got credit for scooping a recording engineers invention?

I heard alot of flanging going on with George Martin's work early on for example. Or did one of the engineers involved in the studio come up with the idea?

Unless you were there, the truth cannot be told!