any mudbucker fans out there?

ishouldbeking · #1 02-28-2008, 01:47 AM

Just scored a '73 Guild JS-2 (Jetstar II)... it's a mahogany-bodied short scale, similar to a Gibson EB-3... and man, it has the hugest sounding humbuckers ever. Like, massive, fat, pillowy, farty, MUDDDD. And yet... i'm liking them.

It's weird, I bought this bass on a whim mainly because I liked the body style and wanted something completely different from my other basses. And it definitely is different. My original intent was to buy this as a Dark Star candidate, but now I'm not sure if I wanna go through with it (plus I'd prefer to save the $400+). It's weird, because when I'm playing I do miss the articulation i can get from my P-bass, but the more I play this bass the less I mind the lack of top-end. That warm pillowy mud -- while it can be extreme when left un-checked (this thing has a mini-toggle which cuts the bass on the neck pup... surprisingly useful) -- actually fills out the overall mix in a surprisingly pleasant way. If I'm able to set my ego aside and just accept that my bass parts aren't going to cut through quite the way they usually do, the overall mix actually sounds pretty nice.

I don't have a specific question really... just wondering if there are any other fans of the mudbucker out there? How do you guys run them (amps, EQ, pick/fingers), and do you find yourself missing the top end?

ishouldbeking · #2 02-28-2008, 01:52 AM

btw, my bass doesn't have the traditional Gibson mudbuckers... it has it's own unique Guild humbuckers which look like this:

Supposedly they have a little more clarity, but they sound pretty similar to the 70's era EB3's i've played. These were the pickups that were introduced after Guild moved away from the Hagstrom Bi-sonics in '71 (which are what Dark Stars are designed to replicate.)

GlennW · #3 02-28-2008, 06:33 AM

How does the one by the bridge sound? I have one of those for a project bass and will try it by the bridge.

Here's a picture I saved from another thread.

Edit: That's not mine.

lug · #4 02-28-2008, 07:19 AM

Home made. Had a fender tele mudbucker but while swapping things around I lost it...I are be a dumbass fer that.

It has a Model 1 in it now, sounds like a frikkin pipe organ:
http://www.box.net/shared/static/j3ak6p1nnn.mp3

GeoffByrne · #5 02-28-2008, 07:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ishouldbeking

btw, my bass doesn't have the traditional Gibson mudbuckers... it has it's own unique Guild humbuckers which look like this:

Supposedly they have a little more clarity, but they sound pretty similar to the 70's era EB3's i've played. These were the pickups that were introduced after Guild moved away from the Hagstrom Bi-sonics in '71 (which are what Dark Stars are designed to replicate.)

I think those are the Guild Gold(en)tones - I had a Guild SG-type guitar with a Goldtone and it was a really nice pickup - a bit brighter than a standard PAF.

ishouldbeking · #6 02-28-2008, 12:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GlennW

How does the one by the bridge sound? I have one of those for a project bass and will try it by the bridge.

Here's a picture I saved from another thread.

Edit: That's not mine.

It sounds pretty good actually. Solo'd it sounds a little bit like a P-bass with a little less treble and upper-mid content. I'm not good at describing tones really, but it doesn't have as much "oomph" as my P-bass when it's just the bridge pickup.

Despite it's positioning the bridge solo'd doesn't offer too much more treble than the neck pup, but it's a more naturally usable tone than the neck pickup all the way on, which just farts up the input of my amp. What's most different is the lack of the monstrous low-end that the neck pup provides. The tone itself is similar, just thinner. So far i'm enjoying dialing in just enough of the mud/fart tone of the neck and combining it with the hint of edginess i get from running the bridge pup wide open.

Current settings I'm using: Neck at 80% volume (it rolls off quickly), Bridge at 100%, tone all the way open on both, bass-cut mini-toggle disengaged.

People claim these are more articulate and clearer sounding than Gibson mudbuckers, but I don't have enough experience with the EB0's or EB3's to offer my opinion.

ishouldbeking · #7 02-28-2008, 12:42 PM

Some more cool stuff, thanks to vintageguitars.org:

I would KILL for one of these carved top models:

GlennW · #8 02-28-2008, 04:48 PM

Here's the inside of the one from ebay. It'll be a while before it's installed...hopefully soon.

You know you're in the mud when you have to switch scales on the DMM...

Edit: That's one of my all time favorite headstocks.

ishouldbeking · #9 02-28-2008, 05:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lug

Home made. Had a fender tele mudbucker but while swapping things around I lost it...I are be a dumbass fer that.

It has a Model 1 in it now, sounds like a frikkin pipe organ:
http://www.box.net/shared/static/j3ak6p1nnn.mp3

Wow. That thing has some beef alright. It's funny that you can tell that there'd be some treble coming through any other pickup (that hint of string noise), but it's just completely overwhelmed by the huge low end. Pretty sweet. I haven't tried recording mine yet, but i'm anxious to see how it turns out.

lug · #10 02-29-2008, 12:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ishouldbeking

Wow. That thing has some beef alright. It's funny that you can tell that there'd be some treble coming through any other pickup (that hint of string noise), but it's just completely overwhelmed by the huge low end. Pretty sweet. I haven't tried recording mine yet, but i'm anxious to see how it turns out.

I need to actually measure the resistance of the thing one day. That sound is with new roundwounds and that is an all maple body.

I have acoil tap that definately brightens the whole thing up but don't have a recoding of it in that mode.

acook · #11 02-29-2008, 12:34 AM

Im pretty big fan, Nice and phat sounds (yea thats right with a "ph"), It feels to me like when playing through a mudbucker it fills the room with sweet low :P

ishouldbeking · #12 02-29-2008, 11:44 PM

I gave the Guild a shot on stage last night and it worked out amazingly. I had to fiddle with the controls a little bit... the neck pup full on was too boomy for this particular room, so I engaged the mini-toggle (which cuts some of the bass from the neck pup)... it sounded perfect on stage, and supposedly out in the audience as well. So far so good!

DavidRavenMoon · #13 03-01-2008, 03:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ishouldbeking

btw, my bass doesn't have the traditional Gibson mudbuckers... it has it's own unique Guild humbuckers which look like this

Why would a Guild have Gibson pickups?

I've always liked the Guild humbuckers. They are very thick and bassy.

Here's another set...

GeoffByrne · #14 03-01-2008, 03:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DavidRavenMoon

Why would a Guild have Gibson pickups?

I've always liked the Guild humbuckers. They are very thick and bassy.

Here's another set...

And what a nice set they are!!!!

ishouldbeking · #15 03-01-2008, 05:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DavidRavenMoon

Why would a Guild have Gibson pickups?

Ah, I was merely trying to clarify since the title of my thread referenced mudbuckers, and when people use that term they're typically referring to the Gibsons. And interestingly enough, these Guilds did use outsourced parts... from Hagstrom. Even though they had stopped using the Hagstrom Bi-sonic pickups (the original Dark Star) by '70 or '71, they kept the Hagstrom bridge for the duration of the JS-2's run.

Which model is Ms. Crow's bass... M-85?

swamp2 · #16 03-01-2008, 07:12 AM

The first bass I ever bought was a '73ish JS-1 w/ the Guild p/u. Still have it. Definitely not the most tonally versatile bass ever made - the tone switch thins out the tone so much I don't use it, and the normal tone is simply big, fat and muddy. But, the amp at church I play through has a enough EQ options that it's no problem to get usable tone out of it so I still use it occasionally. Jangly it isn't, but it sure does a good job letting folks know where the roots of the chords are at...

Steve

DavidRavenMoon · #17 03-01-2008, 01:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ishouldbeking

Ah, I was merely trying to clarify since the title of my thread referenced mudbuckers, and when people use that term they're typically referring to the Gibsons.

Oh I know, I was just being pedantic! The important part is you know.. some people just assume things.

I remember liking those Guild pickups a lot back when those basses were current (and all basses came with flats back then, so it was super thick!). I've never owned a Guild bass, but I did own a '70's EB-2, and besides being nice to look at, wasn't not one of my favorite basses. The neck was really nice though. I ended up trading it for a '74 P bass.

I think maybe I'll make some copies of those pickups.

Quote:

Originally Posted by ishouldbeking

And interestingly enough, these Guilds did use outsourced parts... from Hagstrom. Even though they had stopped using the Hagstrom Bi-sonic pickups (the original Dark Star) by '70 or '71, they kept the Hagstrom bridge for the duration of the JS-2's run.

Which model is Ms. Crow's bass... M-85?

They probably had a supply of the bridges in stock.

Yeah, looks like an M-85. You can hear that thick slab of tone on the tracks she actually plays bass on.

ishouldbeking · #18 03-01-2008, 04:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DavidRavenMoon

I think maybe I'll make some copies of those pickups.

That'd be awesome... see, you recreate those pickups, and then sell a ton of 'em so that they can become the next must-have vintage pickup design (bumping the dark star off of their current pedestal). End result: my JS-2 shoots up in value for having the originals installed. Win-win situation.

In regards to being versatile... these pups really aren't. But having one in the bridge position allows me to dial in just enough edge to cut through. Switching out the pressure-wounds that shipped on my bass to rounds helped some, and I was pretty impressed in the large tonal difference when I switched from my ported 410 to my new sealed 610... The sealed cab tamed a lot of the unwieldy low end. With the bass-cut switch engaged and the bridge pup solo'd I was pleasantly surprised by the amount of discernible treble. It's no Ric to be sure, but at least there's something there to temper the world of mud (the singer of my band actually calls it the "fart-wall") that the neck position pumps out.

KromaatiKlauun · #19 05-16-2008, 07:01 PM

mudbuckers are heaven! or pig heaven if you like, count me in.

I have an epi tbird, and now I'm thinking in buying one of those squier tele re-issues

DavidRavenMoon · #20 05-16-2008, 10:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ishouldbeking

That'd be awesome... see, you recreate those pickups, and then sell a ton of 'em so that they can become the next must-have vintage pickup design (bumping the dark star off of their current pedestal). End result: my JS-2 shoots up in value for having the originals installed. Win-win situation.

I never thought of the DarkStar as a mudbucker... But anyway, I'm working on a design that will sound similar to a Guild or Gibson pickup, but will at first be in EMG-35 and 40 cases, since that's a popular shape, and no one makes a direct replacement for those that sound like a mudbucker.

Quote:

Originally Posted by ishouldbeking

In regards to being versatile... these pups really aren't. But having one in the bridge position allows me to dial in just enough edge to cut through.

I have a '73 Ric with a Gibson Sidewinder at the neck, and an old bartolini Hi-A mini humbucker at the bridge. That gets a wide range of tones. Plus I wired up the Gibson to do series/parallel.

Quote:

Originally Posted by ishouldbeking

Switching out the pressure-wounds that shipped on my bass to rounds helped some, and I was pretty impressed in the large tonal difference when I switched from my ported 410 to my new sealed 610... The sealed cab tamed a lot of the unwieldy low end. With the bass-cut switch engaged and the bridge pup solo'd I was pleasantly surprised by the amount of discernible treble. It's no Ric to be sure, but at least there's something there to temper the world of mud (the singer of my band actually calls it the "fart-wall") that the neck position pumps out.

You need a big ol' 2X15" cab! That's what everyone used before the advent of the SVT's 10" speakers.