I want to add a tone knob to a Stingray 2 band

RockBoxBass · #1 08-05-2009, 01:03 PM

I want to add a tone knob to a Stingray 2 band. I feel it would give me more flexability. Id like to add a stacked volume pot with a tone on the bottom. has anyone done this? can it be done? how? thanks all....

walterw · #2 08-05-2009, 10:44 PM

tone as in a treble rolloff knob? don't you already have that?

**line6man** · #3 08-05-2009, 11:12 PM

If the volume control is a 25K or 50K, a concentric pot is out of the question. You need a 250K or 500K pot for a passive tone, and as far as I'm aware, there are no 25K/250K concentric pots...

To wire the passive tone:
Connect the third terminal of the pot to the pickup's hot, then connect the second terminal of the pot to a capacitor, and connect the other end of the capacitor to ground.

FWIW, I prefer using a push/pull switch to bypass the tone control when it isn't being used, so that it won't suck your tone when it isn't being used.
Something to consider...

**line6man** · #4 08-05-2009, 11:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by walterw

tone as in a treble rolloff knob? don't you already have that?

An active treble cut is a lot different sounding than a passive tone control, which uses a simple capacitor to roll off high frequencies.

RockBoxBass · #5 08-06-2009, 01:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by walterw

tone as in a treble rolloff knob? don't you already have that?

and on the MM 2 band its + only (like sadowsky)
and with the treble at "0" its still pretty bright.

Davecg2 · #6 08-06-2009, 01:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RockBoxBass

I want to add a tone knob to a Stingray 2 band. I feel it would give me more flexability. Id like to add a stacked volume pot with a tone on the bottom. has anyone done this? can it be done? how? thanks all....

thought of trading? there might be people that would trade their 3 band for a 2.

RockBoxBass · #7 08-06-2009, 08:10 AM

absolutely, positively, no way, in a million years, would I ever do that. But...not a bad idea. LOL. The 2 band is SOOOOOOOOO far superior IMO. But, a reversible mod like a stacked volume , tone knob is something Id like to maybe explore...

Rick Auricchio · #8 08-06-2009, 09:32 AM

If you feel the two-band EQ is so much better, why risk screwing it up? You probably won't make it sound any better than it already is.

Have you tried adjusting tone at the amplifier? Or use an outboard EQ pedal and call it a day.

Jefenator · #9 08-06-2009, 09:44 AM

How about wiring up an external unit? A stomp box if you will that's just a simple passive tone control with a 50K (or whatever EMG uses for their V/V/T layout) pot? (... because the signal coming out of the Ray will be low-impedence.)

RockBoxBass · #10 08-06-2009, 10:30 AM

well Ive thought of those options and having it onboard will be the most useful for me. I play music from 100 different bands everynight, and flexability in an instrument is what I look for. The bass sounds killer the way it is...I just wanted to see if anyone had gone a step further....

LowB-ing · #11 08-06-2009, 11:05 AM

I've done exactly this, and I'm happy with the mod.

I didn't want any more knobs on the bass, so I had a 3-way switch installed:

1) bypass.
2) internal trimpot sets tone. (I keep it at about halfway)
3) full roll off.

The tone circuit sits between the pickup and the pre. Works just fine.

andk5591 · #12 08-06-2009, 06:36 PM

Not sure if this will do it for you, but when I had my Stingray (original) The pickups had rivets that the coils connected to and the coil to coil wiring was real easy to modify if you so desired. I put in a mini toggle and either did series/parallel or single coil/humbucker. Was a long time ago, so I can't remember what I did, but it really gave me a but more tonal variation.....

walterw · #13 08-06-2009, 06:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by line6man

An active treble cut is a lot different sounding than a passive tone control, which uses a simple capacitor to roll off high frequencies.

true, but i'm not sure the difference would be worth another control.

Quote:

Originally Posted by RockBoxBass

and on the MM 2 band its + only (like sadowsky)
and with the treble at "0" its still pretty bright.

aha, boost only. that has always struck me as limiting, for just the reason you're saying. sure, you could crank up the bass and leave the treble flat, but that's not the same thing, either.

it would be nice if you could replace the treble pot with a center detent dual pot blend/balance type, using one pot to boost the treble band when the knob is turned up and the other to roll off highs with a cap when that same knob is turned down.

the issue becomes, can you make the impedances work? the boost circuit will want a low impedance (25k? 50k?), while a passive tone pot would need to be 250k or even 500k.

maybe a 500k blend/balance can be used, with a resistor across the outer lugs of one pot to bring it down to where it needs to be to run the boost circuit right.

or maybe a 25k blend/balance can be used, with the tone pot put in the circuit after the preamp output, like an EMG 25k tone pot would be.

suhr makes a jazz bass with a preamp that has a boost-only bass knob and a center-detent boost/cut treble knob, the perfect combo if you ask me (who the hell ever cuts the bass knob below flat?)

walterw · #14 08-06-2009, 07:09 PM

or, if it's the same size, you could just get a 3-band control plate, using the 3rd hole for a passive tone.

the thing is, in the heat of battle, having a treble boost knob and another treble cut knob at the same time might get you into trouble if you inadvertently turn them both at the same time or forget which one is which. having two knobs on your instrument that "fight" each other strikes me as poor design.

RockBoxBass · #15 08-07-2009, 01:00 AM

The perfect scenario would be to keep the eq intact as is and just use a stacked vol/tone pot.

RockBoxBass · #16 08-07-2009, 01:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by walterw

true, but i'm not sure the difference would be worth another control.

aha, boost only. that has always struck me as limiting, for just the reason you're saying. sure, you could crank up the bass and leave the treble flat, but that's not the same thing, either.

it would be nice if you could replace the treble pot with a center detent dual pot blend/balance type, using one pot to boost the treble band when the knob is turned up and the other to roll off highs with a cap when that same knob is turned down.

the issue becomes, can you make the impedances work? the boost circuit will want a low impedance (25k? 50k?), while a passive tone pot would need to be 250k or even 500k.

maybe a 500k blend/balance can be used, with a resistor across the outer lugs of one pot to bring it down to where it needs to be to run the boost circuit right.

or maybe a 25k blend/balance can be used, with the tone pot put in the circuit after the preamp output, like an EMG 25k tone pot would be.

suhr makes a jazz bass with a preamp that has a boost-only bass knob and a center-detent boost/cut treble knob, the perfect combo if you ask me (who the hell ever cuts the bass knob below flat?)

a treble boost with a tone cut on one knob would be awesome...

LowB-ing · #17 08-07-2009, 03:58 AM

Let me repeat myself. There are no problems with this mod as far as sound is concerned. I have done it. It works. Boosting treble while cutting treble is no problem at all. In fact, it makes my limited 3-way switch arangement more useful as I can fine tune the treble response to some extent with the active treble control when using the tone circuit.

The problem (as metioned above in this thread) would be getting a stacked pot where one pot has the right impedence for the treble control and the other has the right impedance for the tone circuit. It would also be difficult to fit any stacked pot on top of the pre I believe.

Your best chioce is probably to install an extra knob, or do like me and go with a switch.

IF you're able to find a stacked pot with those odd impedances, please let me know

Silent Fly · #18 08-07-2009, 04:56 AM

You could substitute a pot with a pot of the same value but with a push-pull switch.

When pulled, the switch activates a capacitor with a trim-pot in series.

It is not a proper passive tone knob but you can have a tone preset that you can activate when you need a tone cut.

I think you can only do it on the bass knob (100k log). AFAIK, the treble knob is a 1M-rev-log and you may find difficult find it with a push-pull switch.

Below you can see the schematics. I would suggest you try different values of C1/R1 until you find the combination that works for you.

You can also remove P1 if you don’t need to fine-tune the depth of the cut. R2 is there to discharge C1 and avoid noises when you pull the knob.

I hope it helps

RockBoxBass · #19 08-07-2009, 10:00 AM

see....I knew it wasn't gonna be easy....

Silent Fly · #20 08-07-2009, 11:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RockBoxBass

see....I knew it wasn't gonna be easy....

It isn’t much more difficult than replacing a single potentiometer with a double potentiometer with concentric knobs.

The only tricky part can be P1 but you can get the same effect with a good choice of R1/C1 so you don’t really need it. If you attach R2 to C1 before wiring everything else, R2/C1 becomes like a single component. You end up with a potentiometer and two components versus 1 pot and one component of a standard tone control.