P bass tonal solutions

[sitonafender]

Originally Posted by Gasman

Ok, now we are getting somewhere. By "Toby" I assume you are referring to Tobias or MTS basses, which are dual pickup (humbucker or jazz) and have active preamps. The active preamp is probably what you're looking for- it will add more of a trebly "bite" to your signal and give a "modern" sound. Unfortunately, the Fender P could not be further removed from this sound. A passive jazz might be better. The Precision has some highs and upper mids, but it's centered on the low mids and there's just not much you can do about that. I second putting some new strings on it (I'd use stainless steel myself for the brightest sound) and then adjust your amp. Take everything to 5 and cut/boost to taste

Cool Stainless it is then. Thanks

[BFunk]

Are you sure they are 50K pots? That is far from a typical value for a passive instrument. Fenders are normally 250k.

[sitonafender]

Well that's what the pots read. Maybe they were replaced? Do origional parts have white plastic posts? That's what these have.

[monti2889]

a p bass is a p bass...and will pretty much sound like a p bass, with everything "stock".
If you're wanting to fundamentally change the tone of a p bass, the first place to look is EQ, as this will have an, obviously, huge impact on how it will sound.
Some other more intrusive "fixes" are, change the pickup...there are a lot of pickups made and each have their positives and negatives, you would have to do your research and find out the ones that describe the tone you're looking for, then compare them to others that seem to match.
Another thing to look at would be to change the tone Cap and pots...as the value of each will have an impact on the tonal output of the bass.
Last, strings and bridge. I've put this last in line, as strings will wear down and is not so much a permanent fix, as the above mentioned modifications. However, string type (round, flat, nylon...etc), newness and material (stainless, nickel...etc) will have a noticeable impact, the newness factor will go away and you'll end up replacing strings every month or so, which for me, is discouraging and costly.
So, I mentioned the bridge...this is generally mentioned when someone is wanting more sustain...but it does impact the over tonality as well, by allowing more of the string energy to stay on the string (with a higher mass bridge) the pickups are able to react to the more subtle overtones created by plucking/strumming/attacking, the string, thus maybe giving you the "highs" you're wanting or you feel are missing from your tone.

[sitonafender]

There was a lot of jimmy rigging on this bass when I got it. Everything from twisted together wirring to a nut that was elmer's glued in place with a spread of glue that reach to the 3rd fret. Good thing is I paid $25 for the bass. So some repair was expected for the price, but as far as pots. I did not know that about Fender, and looks like I'll definetley be upgrading. Is Stellertone ToneStyler a good option, or are there any other products I should look into?

[sitonafender]

So after cleaning the pots, running the eq flat on the amp, and maxing the bass volume. I am far closer to my end goal.
Looks as if a set of DR stainless, and maybe some pots that don't suck. I should be able to get what I'm looking for.
Next question. Any recomendations for pot replacements. This is a new topic for me. I have no experience choosing pots.
I have had a fella recommend ToneStylers, but other than those, and OEM Fender I'm clueless.

[megafiddle]

If those are 50K pots, they are seriously loading down the pickups.

Just as higher pot values will increase the high frequency end, smaller pot values
will reduce the high end.

What kind of knobs are you going to use?
Standard type P bass knobs with setscrews need a solid shaft (1/4") pot.
Press on knobs will need a split shaft with coarse or fine knurl (or splines) to match
the knob.
If it's a standard thin pickguard, you need a short bushing. The bushing is the threaded
part of the pot that is used for mounting it. Long bushings are used in thick panels like
wood without a pickguard.
Finally you need a bushing the same size as the hole, usually 5/16" or 3/8".

I would use 250K pots and then go from there, if necessary.

[seanm]

If you are looking for a bright tone, a cheap test would be to solder the pickups straight to the output jack. With nothing in the way you will get the brightest tone you can.

Once you are happy with that, then you can start messing with pots and caps.

[sitonafender]

I'm using stock knobs with a pick guard. As far as diameter. I'm not quite sure. It looks like 3/8, but I'll figure that out before Monday when I go grab new pots.
Lucky me my buddy just opened a music store here in Abilene Tx, and he's giving me the opportunity to expirement with a few different options. Which means in response to seanm. I will have a chance to try going straight to the input. One question about that. Do I bypass the volume as well?

[seanm]

Originally Posted by sitonafender

Which means in response to seanm. I will have a chance to try going straight to the input. One question about that. Do I bypass the volume as well?

Yup. You want just the pickup wires and the bridge ground to be connected. Don't forget the bridge ground or you may get hum.

[sitonafender]

Cool tanks man, and thanks to all of you that showed a little patience to a fella that knows waaay less than he previously thought lol.

[Tense Zombie]

Originally Posted by megafiddle

If those are 50K pots, they are seriously loading down the pickups.

Just as higher pot values will increase the high frequency end, smaller pot values
will reduce the high end.

What kind of knobs are you going to use?
Standard type P bass knobs with setscrews need a solid shaft (1/4") pot.
Press on knobs will need a split shaft with coarse or fine knurl (or splines) to match
the knob.
If it's a standard thin pickguard, you need a short bushing. The bushing is the threaded
part of the pot that is used for mounting it. Long bushings are used in thick panels like
wood without a pickguard.
Finally you need a bushing the same size as the hole, usually 5/16" or 3/8".

I would use 250K pots and then go from there, if necessary.

I've had great luck with a the standard 250K volume pot and a 500K tone; would definitely try that out, as CTS pots are like 5 bucks.

[sitonafender]

Yup that worked just fine. Bass sounds great...thanks

[Steve Dallman]

50k pots are used with active pickups. If used with passive pickups, they will dull the tone tremendously and cut the volume. If you truly do have 50k pots, change them immediately. If you want classic P bass tone, use 250k for both volume and tone. If you want bright, use 500k or even 1meg, and a no-load tone pot may be a good option. Choice of a cord is important. A high capacitance cord will mute highs. If you wish to keep the 50k pots, install a buffer between the pickups and the controls (which will require a battery.)

[Ric5]

Originally Posted by sitonafender

Hey Seniors, and Senoritas.

I have recently purchased an 81 Fender P bass, or that's what the date on the neck stamp tells me. It's a 4 string, and all origional minus the pickups. Which is bass lines P style.
So this bass has superb mids, and great lows, but its lacking in the highs.
Is there any known solutions for this? Thanks much for your advice.

Add a jazz pickup in the bridge position.

Or add a 500k ohm tone pot.

Or both.

[Koog]

Sounds like you've got enough modification on the bass....replacement pups and 50k pots....that it may be difficult to get a true, traditional P sound without restoration to original specification electronic parts.

This said, however, the string I've used most successfully to get that vintage, big, punchy, thumpy P bass sound is the RotoSound RS 77 LD. These strings are flats and gauged 45 - 65 - 85 - 105. In 50 years of playing and trying strings, I've found nothing beats these. I've used them almost exclusively for the last 12 years on stage and in the studio. Although my vintage P has not been my go to bass for a number of years, I still use these strings on every bass I have except for a vintage jazz with tapes and a custom made bass with D'Addario Chromes.

The Chromes are a close second to the Rotos, but the Rotos get my vote as #1.

Even with the custom made basses I play most often, the vintage P sound is the sound I try to replicate. And, yes, I'm still playing shows regularly.

Hope this helps.

Koog

[sitonafender]

Originally Posted by Koog

Sounds like you've got enough modification on the bass....replacement pups and 50k pots....that it may be difficult to get a true, traditional P sound without restoration to original specification electronic parts.

This said, however, the string I've used most successfully to get that vintage, big, punchy, thumpy P bass sound is the RotoSound RS 77 LD. These strings are flats and gauged 45 - 65 - 85 - 105. In 50 years of playing and trying strings, I've found nothing beats these. I've used them almost exclusively for the last 12 years on stage and in the studio. Although my vintage P has not been my go to bass for a number of years, I still use these strings on every bass I have except for a vintage jazz with tapes and a custom made bass with D'Addario Chromes.

The Chromes are a close second to the Rotos, but the Rotos get my vote as #1.

Even with the custom made basses I play most often, the vintage P sound is the sound I try to replicate. And, yes, I'm still playing shows regularly.

Hope this helps.

Koog

Yeah after hearing all you guys have to say. It seems like my problem isn't with a P bass tone, but with all the replacement parts on this thing. Would you know of a good place to find origional replacement parts, or maybe some part numbers for pick ups, pots ext. So I could look them up myself.

[Koog]

Check Warmoth, All Parts, Fender direct. EMG makes good P bass replacement pups.

[walterw]

like everybody is saying, if they really are 50k pots, that's your first step.

you need 250k minimum for normal P-bass tone, and 500k if you want bright and aggressive.

you say the pickup says "SPB-3" on it? does it have big fat 1/4" magnets (maybe hidden under the plastic pickup cover)?

if so, that's a duncan "quarter pounder", a loud, grindy pickup. it will definitely need higher-value pots to sound like it should.

allparts has the pots; you'll want a linear taper for volume and an audio taper for tone.

once the bass is working right, dime the knobs! set your amp to where that sounds right, maybe a little on the bright side; then you can work your tone knob to get a range of appropriate sounds.

[LowBSix]

Originally Posted by sitonafender

I typically do not prefer a pick. I do occasionally, but I prefer fingertips. I will try though. Any good results are worth further exploration.

+1 I put one in my P and it does what they say. They're releasing some new ones shortly and have their own store down by thE BAY.... I like it!