PJ pre-amp for my Guild.

deichman · #1 01-02-2007, 10:45 PM

I have a 1988 Guild advanced pilot I've been refurbishing. It still has the original Bart PJ pick up set up. The original 9 volt pre is weak comapred to the modern Spectors and Roscoe's I've used. I would like to know if there is an 18 volt pre-amp option for these original pick ups. I have been searching around and can only find 9 volt set ups. Any suggestions? I'm open to replacng the pick ups, I just want this bass to be HOT. Thanks in advance for any assistance you may offer.

Here is an image of the bass in question:

http://a302.ac-images.myspacecdn.com...8e370932a5.jpg

deichman

http://www.myspace.com/deichmanbassplayer4life

luknfur · #2 01-03-2007, 11:45 PM

FWIW:

yep they're putting more boost in pre's these days. Any of the aftermarket pre's would be a viable alternative with those pups. The bass will probably still be on the "weak side" comparatively cause most Bart pups tend to be on the low side of average in output and the older Barts even lower than the current models. What matters is the tone, the amp is the source to turn to for output.

Search will turn up the popular hot pups.

The Penguin · #3 01-04-2007, 12:35 AM

18 volts isn't louder. Also most of the old Barts have a boost control which can make them very hot. Often these aren't hooked up. What does the labeling on the black block say and how many blocks are there? Is there a grey wire coming out of the block and where does it go to?

deichman · #4 01-04-2007, 08:48 PM

Not being an expert in the electronics area, what are blocks? The pick ups, all of them are solid, sealed on the back and no markings. Black wires only coming out of them. Thoughts?

Thank you very much for your reply.

deichman

deichman · #5 01-04-2007, 08:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by luknfur

FWIW:

yep they're putting more boost in pre's these days. Any of the aftermarket pre's would be a viable alternative with those pups. The bass will probably still be on the "weak side" comparatively cause most Bart pups tend to be on the low side of average in output and the older Barts even lower than the current models. What matters is the tone, the amp is the source to turn to for output.

Search will turn up the popular hot pups.

I understand about the amp. I feel I'm in good shape in that area. Thank you for the info.

deichman

The Penguin · #6 01-05-2007, 12:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by deichman

Not being an expert in the electronics area, what are blocks? The pick ups, all of them are solid, sealed on the back and no markings. Black wires only coming out of them. Thoughts?

Thank you very much for your reply.

deichman

Sorry, I meant the black epoxy block that is the preamp not the pickups.

Like this one. This Bart pre was from a Tobias and the blue block could be a gain control. (not on this one though)

luknfur · #7 01-05-2007, 01:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by deichman

Not being an expert in the electronics area, what are blocks? The pick ups, all of them are solid, sealed on the back and no markings. Black wires only coming out of them. Thoughts?

Thank you very much for your reply.

deichman

If you go to the Bart site you can pull up info on the variable gain trim pot on the NTBT which probably the same for all of them. I've had a number of Bart pre's with the gain trim pot - although I never needed it. To me more useful to cut distortion with a hi output pup as apposed to boost one that's lacking (the amp does that). To my knowledge, you can buy the gain controls seperate, but I've never done it.

I've had some dozen Bart pre's (NTMB's, NTBT's, TCT's with and without the gain trim) as well as Aggie's, and EMG's and to me it's splitting hairs tonewise. What they primarily do is boost/cut the signal and offer band control. The biggest downside to me of Barts is the modules (blocks) take up a lot of space - the three band units have an midrange module and some have additional buffer modules.

deichman · #8 01-05-2007, 07:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Penguin

Sorry, I meant the black epoxy block that is the preamp not the pickups.

Like this one. This Bart pre was from a Tobias and the blue block could be a gain control. (not on this one though)

Hey, thanks again for your assistance. I just looked at the original pre-amp and there is no trim pot. It's just a plain sealed block, 4 pots. I guess to sum this up, and after doing some reading on line, active EMG-pj's or the bass lines might give me what I'm after. I could keep these old 1987 barts and add a pre-amp, but have no idea where to go with that scenario, as far as what pre would work.

Basically I just want the bass to be as hot as possible considering that it has the pj set up. BY "hot", let me explain what I mean. With no change on my rig, my USA Spector's (active EMG's Spector pre) produce more tone, more volume of that tone, than any bass I own. Prior to disassembly of the guild the comparison was, well let's just say there was no comparison in the gain or the punch. I know this is comparing apples and oranges, I just want to make this bass as "hot" as possible given the technology available.

Thanks again for your expertise.

deichman

deichman · #9 01-05-2007, 09:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by luknfur

If you go to the Bart site you can pull up info on the variable gain trim pot on the NTBT which probably the same for all of them. I've had a number of Bart pre's with the gain trim pot - although I never needed it. To me more useful to cut distortion with a hi output pup as apposed to boost one that's lacking (the amp does that). To my knowledge, you can buy the gain controls seperate, but I've never done it.

I've had some dozen Bart pre's (NTMB's, NTBT's, TCT's with and without the gain trim) as well as Aggie's, and EMG's and to me it's splitting hairs tonewise. What they primarily do is boost/cut the signal and offer band control. The biggest downside to me of Barts is the modules (blocks) take up a lot of space - the three band units have an midrange module and some have additional buffer modules.

Hey............ upon further inspection there is what may be a trim pot on the volume pot. Doesn't look like the one in your image. It's right under the bottom of the pot and can be rotated with your finger. Any ideas??

Thanks,

Dave

luknfur · #10 01-06-2007, 10:05 AM

FWIW:

not your finger, has a slot for a small screw-driver in the middle - preferably a plastic screwdrivers since the adjuster is made of soft plastic. You see 'em where guys have buttered them up all the time.

Make note of the current adjustment so you can get back to it if desired, may not be a gain control at all. Turn the knob and listen. That's it.

Any I messed with you could get to distort.

Raisng the pups closer to the strings would also give you more of what you want - if fact that could be the source of your complaint if they're far enough away. My guess is probably won't touch the Spec anyway. The Guild was not made in this era so not designed for the trends of the day.

There's nothing to figuring out the aftermarket preamps. In a Bart you have the 3 band unit and 2 band unit. You might even be able to buy a Spector tone pump and put in it. I have no idea what they sell but the Barts won't care what pre you stick in it. Put Spec pups in it for that matter. Seems most of the manufacturers make their equivalent of like an Alembic stratoblaster.

The Penguin · #11 01-08-2007, 05:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by deichman

Hey............ upon further inspection there is what may be a trim pot on the volume pot. Doesn't look like the one in your image. It's right under the bottom of the pot and can be rotated with your finger. Any ideas??

Thanks,

Dave

A picture would help.

The Bart pre in a Tobias Renegade has a trim pot adjusting how intense the "slap tone" preset is.