Sustain: what are the factors?

K2000 · #1 11-30-2007, 02:45 PM

I know that the bridge is a factor, and pickups too.

But could the pots make a difference? How about the (possibly sub-par) wiring?

I have a bass that isn't sustaining as much as I'd like, and I just want to cover all the bases.

Anything else...?

DavidRavenMoon · #2 11-30-2007, 03:32 PM

The real thing is a having a rigid neck. If the neck is too flexible you will loose sustain.

People talk about mass, and that;s why you find heavy bridges and such, but you can have a light weight bass with good sustain too.

Pots, wiring, and pickups won't affect sustain much.

What kind of bass do you have?

Basshole · #3 11-30-2007, 03:42 PM

Yes...rigidity is the only real factor in sustain. Anything that is not solid, or absorbs vibrations due to resonance, or lack of proper coupling, can inhibit sustain.

A dead spot is nothing more than a resonance in the instrument at the exact frequency that is "dead". The inertia, which should remain in the string, is transferred to the resonant component, thus "stealing" the energy from the string, and compromising sustain. If the whole thing is "dead", replace the strings with fresh. If everything remains dead, there is lack of proper coupling in the neck/nut/bridge...somewhere.

K2000 · #4 11-30-2007, 04:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DavidRavenMoon

What kind of bass do you have?

It's a Fender MIJ P Bass. I think the pickup is a Fender '62 (I haven't opened the bass up yet, that's next on my list). Would that pickup be a culprit? The bridge is an old fashioned one. Maybe a Baddass II bridge is called for....

I have a 57 AVRI PBass that seems to sustain better. For the music I'm doing now, sustain is really helpful. I'm reluctant to use the '57 though... I'd rather get the MIJ in better working condition.

DavidRavenMoon · #5 11-30-2007, 05:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by K2000

It's a Fender MIJ P Bass. I think the pickup is a Fender '62 (I haven't opened the bass up yet, that's next on my list). Would that pickup be a culprit? The bridge is an old fashioned one. Maybe a Baddass II bridge is called for....

I have a 57 AVRI PBass that seems to sustain better. For the music I'm doing now, sustain is really helpful. I'm reluctant to use the '57 though... I'd rather get the MIJ in better working condition.

Fender basses are notorious for having dead spots along the fingerboard. I think usually around the 7th fret?

How old are the strings?

You could try a new bridge... it should make some improvement over the vintage style bridge, as long as the neck is not the issue.

K2000 · #6 11-30-2007, 05:30 PM

It's not really a dead string issue... the sustain drops off a bit more quickly than it should. It's subtle but I notice it. It's not isolated as far as I can tell, it's all over the neck. Again, it's subtle.

The strings are flats, so that shouldn't be it... or is it? That's my first set of flats so I don't know. Do rounds have more sustain?

seanm · #7 11-30-2007, 06:20 PM

Flat have less sustain.

Also, I have a '62 resissue MIJ P bass with the original pickups and I find them "fuzzy".

Jim Carr · #8 11-30-2007, 06:41 PM

Poor fit at the nut can mar tone and sustain of open strings, but that's usually obvious. Otherwise, the string sits on the fret crown and the bridge and ideally nothing else. But what about that? Is there contact, even minimal, with other frets, the pickups, or even YOU. Are you getting that string DOWN, but not touching it in any way?

New strings would be a good idea, and also a pro-setup with fret leveling/crowning and a very careful action adjustment. You may find a higher action sustains more.

Also, string gauge is a factor. Think of it this way: more mass in motion at the same speed will "coast farther." Type of string will matter, but I never evaluated strings based on a single factor alone.

However, heavier strings may create action/truss issues, make setups more compromised, and can cause your bass's neck to act up---I admit I prefer lighter gauges, especially for older basses and Jazzes---yet, I think you might experiment.

I think the the BAII helped my 60's classic Jazz to have a denser, darker and more sustaining tone, though the changes were modest. All of my good electrics have fairly massive bridges, except my '55 P-bass and my '71 P.

Tightness of Pocket...this is a factor, IMHO. This comes from my experience with basses with pocket slop, and from double bass, where sustain is very very much an issue. As I had my very old double bass worked on by a series of exceptional luthiers (I was moving around from NYC to CA to KY, etc.), the instrument became more stable due to improvements in the internal structure around the neck (the block) and also good coupling between the top and the rest of the instrument. A couple of new bass bars later, the sustain had, bit by bit, increased a lot.

I guess if I would distill this ramble, it would be: frets, strings, set-up, bridge, neck pocket.

DavidRavenMoon · #9 11-30-2007, 07:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by K2000

The strings are flats, so that shouldn't be it... or is it? That's my first set of flats so I don't know. Do rounds have more sustain?

Yes, usually round wounds have more sustain. It depends on the flats though, but a lot of them are "thuddy" sounding.

c3scott · #10 11-30-2007, 08:02 PM

I put fender flats on my jazz bass to do some recording and it had less sustain. Rounds are back on for live playing and sustain is better. Had rehersal tonight with rounds after playing flats for awhile and it was pretty sweet. Notes rang much longer.

GreyBeard · #11 11-30-2007, 08:16 PM

Flats have a lot less sustain than rounds. Put on a set of Rotosound swing bass and see how you like it. I bet the sustain will be all you want.

Basshole · #12 11-30-2007, 08:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by K2000

Do rounds have more sustain?

Are bears Catholic? Does the Pope $#!+ in the woods?

YES. Flats go DUNT, rounds go DAAAAAAAAANG.

Put a set of Rotosound Swing Bass 66 on there, and call me in the morning...

DavidRavenMoon · #13 11-30-2007, 08:52 PM

I nice set of flats are the LaBella Deep Talkin' Bass Stanless Steel flats, 760FL.

They sound a lot like round wounds, are nice and flexible, and are bright, not thuddy. But they don't have that ringing piano sound you get from round wounds.

I had them on my Rick for like three years, and they never went dead. Then I broke one of them!

So if you want a flatwound tone, but round wound type sustain, try those.

I hear TI flats are also good.

K2000 · #14 12-01-2007, 10:03 AM

Thanks for the great replies. I'll bet it is a "flats" issue, as I was weened on Rotosound rounds. I do like the flats now, too.

I goofed:

Quote:

Originally Posted by K2000

It's not really a dead string issue... the sustain drops off a bit more quickly than it should.

I meant to say it's not "dead spots", it's all over the neck.

Thanks again!