is there a difference between...

shwashwa · #1 07-30-2006, 02:04 PM

is there a difference between a p style pickup and an in line split pickup under a jazz style pickup cover as in the demarzio model j? i know all pickups sound different for different reasons (magnet size, type, number of windings, etc) , but lets say all other things being equal, would there be a reason for them to sound different based on the split vs. in-line positions?

SnakeAnthony · #2 07-30-2006, 04:10 PM

Yes. Because the split Pup on the P is not inline, rather split between top and bottom, that creates a specific sound. The split coil Jazz Pups still sounds like Jazz pups, just Humcanceling.

jwymore · #3 07-30-2006, 09:23 PM

and... the bobbins and thus the coils are different shapes which creates a different shaped magnetic field.

PilbaraBass · #4 07-30-2006, 11:12 PM

all of the above...plus...the split jazzes are generally wound so that they sound like a single coil, only hum-cancelling...
where P's are wound to sound like P's...

other than all of that...they sound exactly the same...

shwashwa · #5 07-31-2006, 06:50 AM

so you're saying now i have to go get a p bass too? (or a p/j at least)

boonerstreet · #6 07-31-2006, 08:20 AM

No, I believe I saw some J pickups that were made to sound as close to p pickups as they possibly could. I'll see if I can find those again.

*Edit*
I think the DiMarzio Model J or the Nordstrand NJ4SE might be what you're looking for. Wait for someone else to confirm that though, I could be wrong. You also might want to just wire your pickups in series to get a deeper sound.

shwashwa · #7 07-31-2006, 09:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by boonerstreet

No, I believe I saw some J pickups that were made to sound as close to p pickups as they possibly could. I'll see if I can find those again.

*Edit*
I think the DiMarzio Model J or the Nordstrand NJ4SE might be what you're looking for. Wait for someone else to confirm that though, I could be wrong. You also might want to just wire your pickups in series to get a deeper sound.

ok, cool. i was thinking of getting some demarzio model j's anyway. the reason i'm asking is because i saw a funk/ disco band this weekend and the guy was playing a P bass. i was never a fan of the p bass, but this guy's bass sounded so funky. i didnt know they could do that.

boonerstreet · #8 07-31-2006, 09:41 AM

Before you buy new pickups you might want to look into wiring you pickups in series. It's fairly simple and it could save some cash. Also make sure you get a second opinion on the Model Js.

SnakeAnthony · #9 07-31-2006, 12:53 PM

I second the above. In fact, go to Has-Sound and look into one of his Jazz Bass Harnesses. He can wire you a harness with a Push/Pull to switch between Series and Parallel. He also makes harnesses with Volume/Blend/Tone instead of Volume/Volume/Tone if you prefer that setup.

boonerstreet · #10 07-31-2006, 01:13 PM

I actually just finished a parallel/series mod with a push/pull pot about 15 minutes ago. There was a nice sound change when I went from parallel to series. If you research this mod you should be able to do it by yourself. If you have any questions about it feel free to ask me. I basically had no idea what I was doing going into the modification, but with alot of help from bigbeefdog I was able to do it with no prior knowledge about rewiring anything. If I can do it I think almost anyone can.

shwashwa · #11 07-31-2006, 04:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SnakeAnthony

I second the above. In fact, go to Has-Sound and look into one of his Jazz Bass Harnesses. He can wire you a harness with a Push/Pull to switch between Series and Parallel. He also makes harnesses with Volume/Blend/Tone instead of Volume/Volume/Tone if you prefer that setup.

would this mod be difficult with my bass which currently has 2 humbucking jazz pickups, active electronics with vol, blend, treble, mid, bass controls? i've checked out the model j before and thought about getting them, anyway...

PilbaraBass · #12 07-31-2006, 04:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shwashwa

ok, cool. i was thinking of getting some demarzio model j's anyway. the reason i'm asking is because i saw a funk/ disco band this weekend and the guy was playing a P bass. i was never a fan of the p bass, but this guy's bass sounded so funky. i didnt know they could do that.

I know that funky old-school sound that you're talking about...I have a p-bass copy that I paid a lot < $100 for and it makes "that" sound...

when I pick it up it screams "slap some EW&F on me"...

boonerstreet · #13 07-31-2006, 05:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shwashwa

would this mod be difficult with my bass which currently has 2 humbucking jazz pickups, active electronics with vol, blend, treble, mid, bass controls? i've checked out the model j before and thought about getting them, anyway...

If your pickups are humbucking I don't think there would be a big sound difference if you wired the pair in series vs. parallel (depending on what kind of humbucking pickup they are). I think the big sound change is only if single coils are wired in series. If your pickups are made to sound like true single coils just without the hum then there would be the sound difference I'm talking about. But if they are designed to sound warmer than single coils I don't think there would be a large sound difference. I think I read about this here on talkbass, but once again make sure you get a second opinion before you do anything. You may just want to look into buying a cheap p bass like a squire and adding an after market pickup in it.

SnakeAnthony · #14 07-31-2006, 05:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shwashwa

would this mod be difficult with my bass which currently has 2 humbucking jazz pickups, active electronics with vol, blend, treble, mid, bass controls? i've checked out the model j before and thought about getting them, anyway...

Well, if its an active bass then it kind of turns away the idea. Those harnesses are passive, made to be drop in replacements on Fender Jazz Basses. You may be able to take your bass to a local luthier or shop that has an electronics specialist and have him make a mod for you. Simply out of curiosity, what kind of bass are you using?

I think buying a Cheap P or P/J bass and modding it a little probably would be your best route. Simple fact of the matter. You cant get the P Bass sound out of a Jazz. You cant get Jazz Tone out of a P either. Just how it works.

Now I'm gonna say something thats kind on contriveral on here and I'm not sure why. If you do feel that you want to stick with just the J/J setup, don't buy the Dimarzios. Take the effort, and spend 40 extra bucks and get Sadowsky Humcancelling Jazz Pickups. The reason why this is controversal is because most people will tell you they are the same thing. Untrue. While they are based on a similar design, I find there to be a major difference in sound, leaning in Sadowsky's favor. You wont regret that descision.

seanm · #15 07-31-2006, 05:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shwashwa

so you're saying now i have to go get a p bass too? (or a p/j at least)

Yes, you have to get a P bass too. The *position* of the pickup in the P bass is as important as the pickup itself, IMHO. If you put a split pickup in either of the J bass pickup positions it still will not sound like a P.

shwashwa · #16 07-31-2006, 07:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SnakeAnthony

Well, if its an active bass then it kind of turns away the idea. Those harnesses are passive, made to be drop in replacements on Fender Jazz Basses. You may be able to take your bass to a local luthier or shop that has an electronics specialist and have him make a mod for you. Simply out of curiosity, what kind of bass are you using?

I think buying a Cheap P or P/J bass and modding it a little probably would be your best route. Simple fact of the matter. You cant get the P Bass sound out of a Jazz. You cant get Jazz Tone out of a P either. Just how it works.

Now I'm gonna say something thats kind on contriveral on here and I'm not sure why. If you do feel that you want to stick with just the J/J setup, don't buy the Dimarzios. Take the effort, and spend 40 extra bucks and get Sadowsky Humcancelling Jazz Pickups. The reason why this is controversal is because most people will tell you they are the same thing. Untrue. While they are based on a similar design, I find there to be a major difference in sound, leaning in Sadowsky's favor. You wont regret that descision.

while i've never tried those two pickups side by side, i've seen the frequency response curves for them somewhere... the sadowskys had a strong low, and a strong high, and a scooped mid. a very popular tone, especially for slappers, but not a tone that i like... the dimarzio model j (not the ultra j which were designed to emulate the sadowsky frequency curve) showed more low mid and less high. that's the sound i think i'm looking for since i'm always boosting the 200 range and slightly the 40-50 range and cutting all the treble...

SnakeAnthony · #17 07-31-2006, 07:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shwashwa

while i've never tried those two pickups side by side, i've seen the frequency response curves for them somewhere... the sadowskys had a strong low, and a strong high, and a scooped mid. a very popular tone, especially for slappers, but not a tone that i like... the dimarzio model j (not the ultra j which were designed to emulate the sadowsky frequency curve) showed more low mid and less high. that's the sound i think i'm looking for since i'm always boosting the 200 range and slightly the 40-50 range and cutting all the treble...

Point. And I did think you were refering Ultra Js, not Model Js (I get them mixed up). Never tried the model Js, but to my ears, the Ultra Js dont sound very good. Picked, Fingerstyle, Slap, nothing. I just flatout hate the sound, but one of the most appealing sounds I've ever heard was the Sadowsky. So I guess you can ignore that part of my post