Warwick, EMG, Piezo...will it work?

Warpeg · #1 07-08-2007, 01:52 PM

I've got a lined-fretless Warwick Corvette Standard passive. To give me a workhorse, I purchased a J/J active EMG pickup set, the EMG BTC system preamp, a set of Graphtech Ghost ABM Piezo saddles (Graphtech item# PN-8364-00), and the Fishman Powerchip Piezo preamp/buffer. I've got the wiring down to a science, but I'm having trouble with how to get the Piezo saddle's wires underneath the bridge. Though there is a hole to get the wires from there to the control cavity, there doesn't seem to be any easy way to get the wires to the bottom of the bridge. These saddles look identical to normal Warwick saddles, but there are wires that come off of the bottom, between the two height adjustment screws. If I just run the wires up the back side of the saddle, I'm afraid that the wires will be smashed when I tighten the saddles down with the side screws. Can I file a channel in the graphite saddle for the wire? If anyone is familiar with Warwick bridges/Graphtech saddles and can comment on a suggestion, let me hear it.

Other than that, can anyone see any problems with the electronics setup I have? Here's some links to said products:

www.emginc.com
www.fishman.com
www.graphtech.com

(Pic is not of my bass. However, this bridge is identical to mine)

luknfur · #2 07-08-2007, 04:17 PM

FWIW:

perhaps luthier forum may have been more fruitful.

Anyway, never messed with setting up a mag/piezo combo but Rick Turner is pretty emphatic about keeping them seperate so it sounds like you're on the right path there.

I'm guessing there's a reason you didn't just get the whole graphtech bridge and I'm guessing they have a hole punched through the bridge for those leads? And that's probably what I would look at doing. Aside from bourgeois, anything ran external is going to be subject to damage.

Warpeg · #3 07-08-2007, 04:35 PM

Graphtech makes a bridge for Warwicks?

luknfur · #4 07-08-2007, 08:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Warpeg

Graphtech makes a bridge for Warwicks?

FWIW:

Highly unlikely but all that really matters is if their bridge will work so that holes don't show before or after.

I wouldn't think it would be an issue to drill holes in the existing one once you know the saddles work fine. You'd probably also have to trough the body beneath the saddles to allow a channel for the piezo leads otherwise the bridge would probably crush them.

Seems like Rick Turner just uses a piezo strip with his units.

Warpeg · #5 07-09-2007, 09:03 AM

If I can figure out a safe way to drill, maybe I'll try that.

DavidRavenMoon · #6 07-09-2007, 11:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Warpeg

If I can figure out a safe way to drill, maybe I'll try that.

With a drill press. If you feel uncomfortable doing this, bring it to a competent luthier.

Keep in mind that the PowerChip was designed for passive pickups. I don't think that will be an issue, but you have to decide how you want to handle the output, which is two channel. Would you want the output of the piezo to also run into the EMG preamp?

Warpeg · #7 07-09-2007, 01:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DavidRavenMoon

With a drill press. If you feel uncomfortable doing this, bring it to a competent luthier.

Keep in mind that the PowerChip was designed for passive pickups. I don't think that will be an issue, but you have to decide how you want to handle the output, which is two channel. Would you want the output of the piezo to also run into the EMG preamp?

The Powerchip's manual does state that active magnetic pickups will work fine with the Powerchip. Being that the Powerchip buffers the piezo and magnetic pickup outputs, I will just send the buffered outs to the BTC control, and in from the master volume (if that makes sense). Think that will work?

DavidRavenMoon · #8 07-09-2007, 01:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Warpeg

The Powerchip's manual does state that active magnetic pickups will work fine with the Powerchip. Being that the Powerchip buffers the piezo and magnetic pickup outputs, I will just send the buffered outs to the BTC control, and in from the master volume (if that makes sense). Think that will work?

Yep. That's what I would do also.

Good luck, sounds like a versatile setup.

Sir Edward V · #9 07-09-2007, 09:08 PM

My first idea was to drill through the bottom of the bridge as well. Just get some holes in there, route out a cavity under the bridge (where the screw holes aren't), and drill a hole through the body from the newly routed hole to the EQ/Volume cavity. This would let you run the wires completely unseen.

luknfur · #10 07-10-2007, 01:29 AM

FWIW:

don't know what the lead for those piezo's is like but if it's a soft insulation flimsy lead I'd give some thought to something to take the edge off the hole - like a small dremmel hone or something. There shouldn't be any movement once in place but you could pull on them making the connection and cut into the jacket if it's not tough stuff and that's the last place you want a splice to occur. Depending on the hole size you probably even strip a larger wire and slip it over lead as an added jacket.

Warpeg · #11 07-10-2007, 07:12 AM

I'm still waiting for Graphtech to send me my piezo saddles. After I receive them and play around with installation, I'll post some pics--maybe step-by-step pics. Anyway, I love all the suggestions I've gotten so far. Keep 'em coming.

m.oreilly · #12 07-10-2007, 08:07 PM

are them things even gonna fit in the 'wick bridge? i was eying them a while ago, but they don't look like they would work...best of luck, as i would love to have a system in my thumb

Warpeg · #13 07-10-2007, 08:28 PM

According to Graphtech, they are direct replacements for the standard Warwick saddle. I also measured the original saddles against the Graphtechs--perfect match. I think that I am going to drill a small hole in each of the saddle's "holders." I don't know what to call them; it's the part that the saddle fits onto and attaches to the intonation screw. I will then drill a hole into the bridge, under each of these holders. Of course, this could create a problem if I ever need to re-intonate. So, I will also file a channel under each holder for the piezos' wires to fit through under movement. This way, the wires will not be sheared-off if the holder's and bridge's hole do not line up. I hope that all makes sense.

Kael · #14 07-10-2007, 08:39 PM

I posted a thread a while back asking if anyone had ever seen any lined fretless 'wicks. No one had that posted on that thread. Do you have any pics of that bass. A lined passive fretless warwick corvette would be something that I'd very much be interested in.

DavidRavenMoon · #15 07-10-2007, 09:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Warpeg

I'm still waiting for Graphtech to send me my piezo saddles. After I receive them and play around with installation, I'll post some pics--maybe step-by-step pics. Anyway, I love all the suggestions I've gotten so far. Keep 'em coming.

One thing I suggest.. and I'm sure this is what you had in mind.. but wait until you get the saddles! Then you will have a clearer view of what needs to be done.. plus they probably have instructions.

Warpeg · #16 07-10-2007, 09:34 PM

I will post some pics of it next week...after this entire install is done to it. I have a feeling that I'm going to love this baby when the new pups, pre, buffer, and piezos go in. The last thing to track down for this bass is the, now discontinued, Warwick ABS hardcase that I love so much. I believe that they were a modified TKL rectangular plastic hard case. If anyone has any leads on one, let me know please! They are very hard to find now.

I have to say that a lined fretless Warwick is pretty hard to come by. Warwick makes the majority of them only in custom shop projects. However, you can request lines on a fretless from the factory as a special order.

Warpeg · #17 07-10-2007, 09:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DavidRavenMoon

One thing I suggest.. and I'm sure this is what you had in mind.. but wait until you get the saddles! Then you will have a clearer view of what needs to be done.. plus they probably have instructions.

I agree completely--great advice! I'd hate to permanently alter the bridge, just to find that the alterations won't work! I won't begin work until the last piece is in my possession and I can dedicate a good 4-5 hours straight-time to it. I'm such a nerd--this is how I plan to spend my vacation next week....

pgurns · #18 07-10-2007, 10:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Warpeg

I agree completely--great advice! I'd hate to permanently alter the bridge, just to find that the alterations won't work! I won't begin work until the last piece is in my possession and I can dedicate a good 4-5 hours straight-time to it. I'm such a nerd--this is how I plan to spend my vacation next week....

Nerd? Hell I plan on spending mine waiting for you to update the thread

I wanna install a piezo in my MIA P Bass

m.oreilly · #19 07-11-2007, 11:38 AM

i just did a quick check of graph tech's site, this time with a little more interest, and noticed these

looks like the beast, alright...

luknfur · #20 07-11-2007, 11:51 AM

Well they look close. What matters is the dimensions. I would never bank on anything that's not the same thing being the same thing. All that really matters is if they'll work for the application at hand.

The insulation looks like hard tough stuff. You actually will get some movement and possible chaffing of the leads from raising and lowering the saddles - but that's typically minimal and pretty infrequent.

I'd ask graphtech about the bridge. It's their stuff so this situation is nothing new to them I'm sure. They may be able to save you some grief.