An Ehrlund blog, sort of

[bruegger]

I just purchased the Ehrlund PU with Pre this week and on the two gigs so far it has been a game changer. I'm literally playing differently than I did before using my Full Circle (which I've been very happy with). I could go on...

Drurb - I see on your profile that you use both the Ehrlund Pre and the Fdeck. Do you use them together? On the two gigs so far, I had the best sound running from the Ehrlund Pre to the amp effects return (first gig was Markbass LMII + Bergantino 12"; second was Markbass 12" combo), bypassing the Markbass preamp. I love the fact that I'm getting a great sound with no EQ, but on the second gig especially I was thinking the amp might be struggling a bit, especially when digging in harder on some cumbias. That's where, from what I've read about it, I'm thinking the Fdeck HPF might help.

So, do you use the two together? If so, what order (I would assume Ehrlund pre into Fdeck). Also, any issues with level controls on both? I'm thinking Ehrlund 80-100% and Fdeck leave at 100%. And (finally) do you run into your amp input or into the effects return? Looks like you're using an iamp200 so maybe more neutral than the Markbass.

[drurb]

I use only the Ehrlund pre with the Ehrlund pickup. No fdeck pre in the circuit. I plug the Ehrlund pre straight into the iamp200 pre-amp so that I can make use of its very effective parametric tone-shaping circuit. I don't suppose I'd ever want to be without tone-shaping no matter what equipment I had. No matter how flat is the response of the amp and cab (and virtually none of the cabs we use are flat) room/cabinet interactions and room resonances dictate, for me anyway, that some adjustment will be required.

Happy to hear that the Ehrlund is working out so well for you!

[Roger Davis]

Originally Posted by drurb

I use only the Ehrlund pre with the Ehrlund pickup. No fdeck pre in the circuit. I plug the Ehrlund pre straight into the iamp200 pre-amp so that I can make use of its very effective parametric tone-shaping circuit. I don't suppose I'd ever want to be without tone-shaping no matter what equipment I had. No matter how flat is the response of the amp and cab (and virtually none of the cabs we use are flat) room/cabinet interactions and room resonances dictate, for me anyway, that some adjustment will be required.

I can relate to that 100% I've never understood the wisdom of taking a signal into an amp with no toneshaping in between. Like several guys on the Forum I just love my Ehrlund. I gigged mine for the first time last Sunday, fixed to my Bryant. I went into a Clarus and then a 10" Wizzy and the sound was great, particularly the emphasis on the front of the note. Like a previous poster, I had to turn one of my basses up to 'too loud' to get any sort of attack, that's with a different pickup of course.

I've 'bedroom tested' the Ehrlund through a PJ Super FlightCase with very good results and a GB 3-10T Shuttle with not so good results - a bit coloured and muddy.

[bruegger]

Originally Posted by drurb

I don't suppose I'd ever want to be without tone-shaping no matter what equipment I had. No matter how flat is the response of the amp and cab (and virtually none of the cabs we use are flat) room/cabinet interactions and room resonances dictate, for me anyway, that some adjustment will be required.

I agree. I've been ok so far, but that's only 2 gigs. Now that I've got a sound that I like at the beginning of the chain, I've got to evaluate the rest of the chain. The Markbass has always been an affordable option paired with my previous PU. I'll need to play with it a little in the near term. I'll also see if my Fishman platinum bass DI can help. Long term I might start looking again at compact URB oriented heads (like Clarus, EA, etc...). Thanks.

[bruegger]

Originally Posted by Roger Davis

I've never understood the wisdom of taking a signal into an amp with no toneshaping in between.

I'll assume this wasn't meant as a neg (though it does read that way a bit). And I'm not professing the "wisdom" of going direct with no control over tone. The purpose of my post was to see what has worked for others as I try different things with this new (to me) PU, including tone shaping like using an Fdeck or amp pre ( as mentioned in my post). However, if someone runs their signal path a certain way, and it works for their style of playing, choice of equipment and venue - great! It apparently works for them but doesn't affect my choices.

And glad to hear of another satisfied Ehrlund user.

[Roger Davis]

Sorry bruegger, I was really concurring with drurb and not wishing to confront your post directly. As for the use of the word 'wisdom', well, it's just a figure of speech. Much of the time I'm able to run my eq 'flat' but occasions arise when the room acoustics need a bit of taming. Interesting too that when I use an Underwood (still like them by the way) with a 10" Wizzy I have to eq the middle down quite a bit to take out the well known mid range hump, but I can run the Ehrlund flat. It seems to like a 'bright' cab.

[bruegger]

Thanks Roger - No offense taken. I haven't posted in Talkbass for a while and internet boards are sometimes a magnet for folks that are in it to judge or confront.

Looking around at different head options that work nicely for the Ehrlund, again providing the EQ tweaks when needed, and also compatible for doubling (needed on occasion). Looks like lots of choices from EA, AI, Genz Benz, also uber-footswitches like those from Radial and Fishman - need to weigh sound, capabilities and the ever important PRICE! . Any opinions, especially with real world experience appreciated!

Thanks.

[engedi1]

I actually found that running through the effects channel of my TH500 made sense, until I got my Audiokenesis cab that is. That cab is so close to studio monitor flat, that I found I need to back into the preamp and use the tone sculpting.

[GrowlerBox]

It's worth noting here that the Markbass amps are wired a little differently than most -- the effects loop is parallel rather than series, and it inserts before the EQ section (but after the preamp gain). From this perspective, it makes it a good amp to use with an outboard preamp: into the effects return if the pre provides sufficient gain on its own, and into the instrument input otherwise. So bruegger should be able to apply his tone shaping either way.

The parallel wiring also allows blending of two signals -- I occasionally run a mic into a Joe Meek channel strip and into the effects return of my F1 to blend with my Soundclip pup into the instrument point via the fdeck-HPF. This also reveals a disadvantage of the pre-EQ insert point, of course, as the mic output passes through 2 EQ stages ...

[bruegger]

Huh - never knew that about that Markbass effect return. Guess i'll need to try that again and see if I can tweak the EQ.

Nice tip - thanks!

[Clarkybass]

Well I used my recently (re!)acquired Ehrlund on my Kolstein travel bass at last night's gig. This was at a rock/reggae venue (Hootananny, Brixton, London) and the volume was absolutely at loud 'rock band' level. I had some initial horrible feedback problems in the soundcheck, not helped by the stage being a very large wooden box (about five feet high and as boomy as its possible to get). However, the soundman played around with EQ on the PA system and I stood a bit further back on stage (away from the monitors) and apparently the sound out front was excellent (one of our friends in the audience was a sound engineer). I reckon thats the toughest possible test passed then Most of our gigs are at nothing like that volume level.

PS, my rig was Ehrlund-->effects return of AI Clarus-->Crazy8 cab but I had to keep the volume level very low on stage to help minimise feedback so it was really there to supply FoH

[Vunz]

An update after having used the Ehrlund system for a while: it just works! In live settings, the sonic quality is virtually undistinguishable from my DPA mic, with the only difference being that I can get stupid loud without getting feedback, and that the amplified sound is much more defined. The musicians that I play with clearly notice, and appreciate, the difference in sound as well. It is such a joy playing amplified this way, that I can only subscribe to all the positive comments regarding this pickup!

BTW: my rig is Ehrlund --> Ehrlund preamp --> Glockenklang Bass Art Classic Top (regular instrument input, and with a - 5db cut at 90 Hz using the parametric eq of the amp) --> Glockenklang Acoustic Art Mk I cab (all connected with Vovox cables)

Cheers,
Vincent

[engedi1]

I find I need to cut the bass and mids quite a bit with this pickup. We are used to piezo pickups which are more trebly and middy by design. Th EAP amplifies everything and I find the deep bass needs to be tamed to sound good and avoid feedback.

[al808]

Originally Posted by engedi1

I find I need to cut the bass and mids quite a bit with this pickup. We are used to piezo pickups which are more trebly and middy by design. Th EAP amplifies everything and I find the deep bass needs to be tamed to sound good and avoid feedback.

Hi engedi1,

My situation was similar to yours a while back, and I managed to solve the problem by moving the pickup around. You can get vastly different tones out of it depending on where it is placed, maybe a little time spent experimenting with this might help you find the optimum positioning that some of us enjoy where we hardly need any eq at all.

Cheers, Al.

[JeffKissell]

2 gigs straight from the Ehrlund Pre into the board, no amp. Sound is very good and controllable...
However, I just (today) got a D-Tar Equinox 3 band parametric to run as a DI after the Ehrlund Pre. My feeling is that with a slight bit of EQ I will have a bomb proof solution with better overall sound and feedback resistance to the Realist/LR Baggs I was using before and I can run it into anything with little or no tweaking.
-J

[PB+J]

I've used the ehrlund on a bunch of gigs now, in various configurations. Straight into a mackie sb150" straight into the pa board, into a ebd1 and then intoa power amp, and straight into an AI Clarus. It worked well in every situation, I'm very happy with it.

The one thing I notice about it is that it takes TON of gain. On the edb-1 and on the Clarus I needed the gain close to full to get a good signal. The same going into the little mackie monitor--needed the gain at nearly 100%. I'm tempted to get the ehrlund preamp just to bump up the gain into the other tone shaping preamps I sometimes use.

[drurb]

Originally Posted by PB+J

The one thing I notice about it is that it takes TON of gain. On the edb-1 and on the Clarus I needed the gain close to full to get a good signal. The same going into the little mackie monitor--needed the gain at nearly 100%. I'm tempted to get the ehrlund preamp just to bump up the gain into the other tone shaping preamps I sometimes use.

You mean, we still haven't convinced you to get the Ehrlund pre? Go on, just order it-- you'll be glad you did!

[Ric Vice]

[quote=PB+J;13821660.........The same going into the little mackie monitor--needed the gain at nearly 100%. I'm tempted to get the ehrlund preamp just to bump up the gain into the other tone shaping preamps I sometimes use.[/QUOTE]

I think you should really consider getting the Ehrlund Pre Amp. It makes a big difference, either by itself into an amplifier, or as the first device in a signal chain. You'll hear a distinct increase in volume and timbre.

Ric

[PB+J]

Yah yah--I have a bunch of versatile expensive gear. I slightly resent having the shell out for the preamp when I've already shelled out for preamps. I'm sure this is a familiar feeling!

[MrSidecar]

Well, not to play smart, but chances are you're going to discover you actually can sell some of your gear when you first have the ehrlund pre, as it IMHO eliminates the need for further pre-amping.... Only half-joking.

Seriously, the ehrlund pickup is lightyears better with the pre than without.
Best
Sidecar