Small rigs for small groups

[bopeuph]

Originally Posted by calivox

You definitely need a preamp; it has a 1 Mohm input. I still keep it around as a backup.

I'm still a little confused with the impedance thing, but I was under the impression that a piezo is about a 1Mohm output, so it would match, right? By the way, this amp with the acoustic was loud enough to probably play with a big band, too.

Nick

[Mark Perna]

Originally Posted by bopeuph

I'm still a little confused with the impedance thing, but I was under the impression that a piezo is about a 1Mohm output, so it would match, right? By the way, this amp with the acoustic was loud enough to probably play with a big band, too.

Nick

No. You want a 10 Mohm input impediance for most piezos. Most preamps will give you a 10 Mohm input. The only amp I'm aware of that has a 10 Mohm input is the AI series II (can't remember if series I did or not). They "engineered" it out of the series III which is why I don't have a series III yet. Eventually, I'll special order one with a 10 Mohm input (I've spoken to AI directly and they said they'd make the mod for me).
Anyway Polytones have a 1 Mohm input like every other bass amp made.

mark

[Freddels]

Originally Posted by Pudgychef

The XM50 yorkie is a great little amp (with line out if needed)

Originally Posted by bopeuph

Someone else said this, too. I should try it out. The store has one of those too. It's about $400, while I can get the Poly for 250.

Nick

The Yorkville XM50 is $289

http://www.musiciansbuy.com/YORKVILL..._BASS_AMP.html

[bopeuph]

Originally Posted by Freddels

The Yorkville XM50 is $289

http://www.musiciansbuy.com/YORKVILL..._BASS_AMP.html

I forgot to mention: when I worked there, I remember this too; the store marks new prices UP from retail. Once I was trying to sell a Behringer guitar combo. I asked one of the managers how much it was, and he looked it up. "Well, it says retail is 349, so how about 425?" Couldn't believe that's what I had to tell the customer.

My godfather's brother came in once, and he still makes fun of me for being a bad sales man. I told him all this stuff is overpriced, and you won't want it.

Nick

[bolo]

Originally Posted by calivox

No. You want a 10 Mohm input impediance for most piezos. Most preamps will give you a 10 Mohm input. The only amp I'm aware of that has a 10 Mohm input is the AI series II (can't remember if series I did or not). They "engineered" it out of the series III which is why I don't have a series III yet. Eventually, I'll special order one with a 10 Mohm input (I've spoken to AI directly and they said they'd make the mod for me).

Mark, respectfully disagree, w/ clarification. There have been several posts on this in the past. Older piezos like the BP-100, maybe the Underwood, you're right. But w/ newer generation piezos like the Realist, K&K stuff, FC, Rev Solo, 1 Mohm seems to be fine as a general rule. I seriously doubt AI would have made the switch from 10 M to 1 M if what you said were still true.

If 10 M works better for your rig, then one new way to get 10 M on the front end is the HPF-Pre from fdeck.

Originally Posted by calivox

Anyway Polytones have a 1 Mohm input like every other bass amp made.

Um disagree here too I'm afraid. Markbass's LM II is 500 Kohm, and a lot of folks seem to really dig how this head sounds w/ a piezo p/u.

[Freddels]

Originally Posted by bopeuph

I forgot to mention: when I worked there, I remember this too; the store marks new prices UP from retail. Once I was trying to sell a Behringer guitar combo. I asked one of the managers how much it was, and he looked it up. "Well, it says retail is 349, so how about 425?" Couldn't believe that's what I had to tell the customer.

My godfather's brother came in once, and he still makes fun of me for being a bad sales man. I told him all this stuff is overpriced, and you won't want it.

Nick

They've got it backwards. Why would anyone pay more than the MSRP (unless it's so rare that they just can't wait to get it)? And you wonder why some of the small shops can't stay open.

[bolo]

From what I've learned crunching numbers and watching sales people scrunch their brow and come back with their "best offer", as a very broad generalization, street price often maps to about 70% of MSRP. For some more exclusive gear, it can be much higher.

Again, that's just a generalization. Perhaps others will clarify or counter this. But if I get an offer for a brand new instrument or amp for less than 70% of MSRP, usually I treat that as a pretty good deal.

[Paul Warburton]

I've been using a Polytone 12". I even have a Polytone 10 "". The 12ver has suited me best for my 5 string bass for many years with an Underwood PU.

[dar512]

Originally Posted by bolo

Mark, respectfully disagree, w/ clarification. There have been several posts on this in the past. Older piezos like the BP-100, maybe the Underwood, you're right. But w/ newer generation piezos like the Realist, K&K stuff, FC, Rev Solo, 1 Mohm seems to be fine as a general rule.

I must disagree with your disagreement. Output on the Realist (on the Eminence at least) is 3Mohm.

[Mark Perna]

Originally Posted by Paul Warburton

I've been using a Polytone 12". I even have a Polytone 10 "". The 12ver has suited me best for my 5 string bass for many years with an Underwood PU.

That's interesting. My 12 worked in a pinch but it didn't handle the low end as well as the 15 and it REALLY didn't like a hard hit on the E. The 15 worked quite well all up and down the range and you could drop E bombs all night without so much as mussing it's hair. 15 is quite a bit bigger and heavier though.

mark

[Mark Perna]

Originally Posted by bolo

Mark, respectfully disagree, w/ clarification. There have been several posts on this in the past. Older piezos like the BP-100, maybe the Underwood, you're right. But w/ newer generation piezos like the Realist, K&K stuff, FC, Rev Solo, 1 Mohm seems to be fine as a general rule. I seriously doubt AI would have made the switch from 10 M to 1 M if what you said were still true.

If 10 M works better for your rig, then one new way to get 10 M on the front end is the HPF-Pre from fdeck.Um disagree here too I'm afraid. Markbass's LM II is 500 Kohm, and a lot of folks seem to really dig how this head sounds w/ a piezo p/u.

Believe what you want. I've blind A-B'd every pickup I've ever used with 1 Mohm vs. 10 Mohm and 10 Mohm sounds fuller, more natural and better EVERY time. That includes the Realist which was the only pickup that came close to being able to handle 1 Mohm and that's probably because it is an incredibly dark pickup with a more limited dynamic range to begin with. It still sounded whiny and thinner on the 1 than the 10. To be fair, I've never tried the FC because it won't fit on any of my basses and I don't want to switch bridges just to try yet another pickup.

I've not tried the Markbass amp but I don't believe for a second that a 1/2 Mohm impediance is going sound even remotely acceptable for my use. It's not even worth my time checking it out.

But by all means, if you think 1 Mohm sounds good with your bass, go ahead.

mark

[bopeuph]

All disagreements aside, it seems consistent that my BP-100 definitely needs 10 Mohms, therefore needing a pre. Correct?

Nick

[bopeuph]

Originally Posted by Freddels

They've got it backwards. Why would anyone pay more than the MSRP (unless it's so rare that they just can't wait to get it)? And you wonder why some of the small shops can't stay open.

This is one of those places where they feed on the ignorance of customers. Believe me, it was the last place I went, and I used to work there. The owner would have never given me a deal. Actually, last year, he heard I was in the market for an upright, and he was pressuring me to buy this VERY crappy EUB. I have no idea what the brand was. He kept saying crap like "it's perfect for jazz" and "you can even use it in an orchestra with a bow." I couldn't believe he was trying to sell it as an orchestral instrument. I also recall when they had a Triton there for a VERY significant amount over the retail price and every potential sale that walked in said "I think I'll buy it at retail somewhere else."


Nick

[Mark Perna]

Originally Posted by bopeuph

All disagreements aside, it seems consistent that my BP-100 definitely needs 10 Mohms, therefore needing a pre. Correct?

Nick

Trust me, you'll be MUCH happier with a preamp. I used a K&K Pure Preamp (about 80 bucks from Gollihur) with terrific results when I used the Polytone with a BP-100. It's cheap, small and runs on a 9 volt that lasts for the major part of a year playing 4 nights per week.

mark