Interface Options and Opinions

[lowfreqgeek]

I need to upgrade my recording interface. I currently use a Line6 TonePort UX2, which is not horrible for demos and give some fun modeling options, but I strictly bypass everything when I record with it and only monitor direct through hardware. I also use an Avalon U5 as a preamp, so I usually record at line level.

I'd say my budget right now is in the $400 range. I was considering a TC Electronic Impact Twin, and I still am, but I'm concerned a little about my Firewire controller - an Agere FW 3227 (400 Mbit). I've gotten conflicting information regarding whether or not the Impact Twin will work with it. So, I started wondering about PCI options. I don't need a portable box and the computer I use is a desktop PC, so I have PCI slots.

So I'm curious if I can get better conversion quality for less with a PCI-based option? Something like a Delta 1010, or at least a Delta 66 would probably suit my needs well. Or an Audiophile 192?.

I'm more interested in signal integrity - clean audio path to the converters, low noise, low clock jitter, etc. I don't need mic-pres, and if I do, I'd probably rather get something high-quality and standalone. Ultimately, I don't care about bells and whistles if the signal integrity isn't superb. So what should I be looking at?

Thanks.

[Jim Roseberry]

Originally Posted by lowfreqgeek

I need to upgrade my recording interface. I currently use a Line6 TonePort UX2, which is not horrible for demos and give some fun modeling options, but I strictly bypass everything when I record with it and only monitor direct through hardware. I also use an Avalon U5 as a preamp, so I usually record at line level.

I'd say my budget right now is in the $400 range. I was considering a TC Electronic Impact Twin, and I still am, but I'm concerned a little about my Firewire controller - an Agere FW 3227 (400 Mbit). I've gotten conflicting information regarding whether or not the Impact Twin will work with it. So, I started wondering about PCI options. I don't need a portable box and the computer I use is a desktop PC, so I have PCI slots.

So I'm curious if I can get better conversion quality for less with a PCI-based option? Something like a Delta 1010, or at least a Delta 66 would probably suit my needs well. Or an Audiophile 192?.

I'm more interested in signal integrity - clean audio path to the converters, low noise, low clock jitter, etc. I don't need mic-pres, and if I do, I'd probably rather get something high-quality and standalone. Ultimately, I don't care about bells and whistles if the signal integrity isn't superb. So what should I be looking at?

Thanks.

FWIW, There's no need to worry about the Agere Firewire controller. With a desktop/tower/rack, you can simply install a good PCI/e TI chipset FW controller. ADS Pyro, SIIG, and others make good units (start at about $30).

If you want to go with PCI, any of the Delta range will work well (including the Audiophile 192).

I'd also consider the FastTrack Ultra 8R.
It's a USB 2.0 unit... and one of the very few that delivers total round-trip latency on par with the best PCI/e and Firewire units. In fact, it'll deliver lower round-trip latency than the TC unit you're considering.

If you go Firewire, I'd avoid units that use the DICE-II chipset... as these have been somewhat flakey (especially when used with Sonar).

[Pruitt]

I've had my Delta-44 for several years now, with no complaints at all. Your U5 into that will sound outstanding. I also have a Line 6 TonePort, that I really got for the Line 6 vst plugins it came bundled with, though I do occasionally use it as a portable interface once in a while. But the Delta-44 is much better sounding than my Toneport, in my opinion.

Best of luck with your decision!

[lowfreqgeek]

Originally Posted by Jim Roseberry

FWIW, There's no need to worry about the Agere Firewire controller. With a desktop/tower/rack, you can simply install a good PCI/e TI chipset FW controller. ADS Pyro, SIIG, and others make good units (start at about $30).

If you want to go with PCI, any of the Delta range will work well (including the Audiophile 192).

I'd also consider the FastTrack Ultra 8R.
It's a USB 2.0 unit... and one of the very few that delivers total round-trip latency on par with the best PCI/e and Firewire units. In fact, it'll deliver lower round-trip latency than the TC unit you're considering.

If you go Firewire, I'd avoid units that use the DICE-II chipset... as these have been somewhat flakey (especially when used with Sonar).

Thanks, Jim. I have a couple questions for you.

First, is there an advantage to going with a separate PCI/e FW controller and FW box over a PCI audio interface? Obviously of the products I mentioned, a FW interface will more likely have mic-pres and additional headphone outputs, etc. How about a sonic advantage?

Second, I'm cursed with XP Media Cener, which M-Audio specifically states is not supported with their products (including the FastTrack and Delta series). Is this going to be an issue for me with either of those? A new OS on top of the interface isn't really in my budget at the moment - so perhaps the FW with a TI-controller is the better option?

I really wish I could afford a dedicated Mac with an RME interface, but that's out of the budget right now. I mainly need the best conversion I can find within my budgetary constraints.

Thanks again for the help!

[seamonkey]

PCI - express bus, are going to give the highest conversion rates with the most simultaneous channels. and no protocol overhead of USB or FW. And the TC Electronic Impact Twin is a great piece of engineering, but don't expect miracles over a Line-6 UX2
You don't really need those super high sampling rates. And 24bits gives more than enough dynamics.
It get's to be like high end audio gear, people paying for a few micro percentage of change that really can't be heard or matters in the final mix.

[lowfreqgeek]

Seamonkey,

As far as the UX2, it's an ok piece of consumer-grade electronics. Recording gear does get to be like high-end audio, but the UX2 is stuck down with the Pioneer stereo amp you get from Walmart. The UX2 is functional in that it does record what you put in, but it's far from a pristine image. That's been my experience so far, my gauge being experience with several other interfaces or hard disk recorders (Delta 1010, Alesis HD24, M-Audio Octane, Korg D8 and others).

Regarding the PCI/FW thing, you pretty much hit what I was going at; if I'm already using PCI express to run a FW controller, why not just stick with a PCI-based audio interface and bypass the FW protocol overhead?

However, I did see an M-Audio Firepro 610 on craigslist a couple days ago. It has the Octane preamps plus quite a bit of I/O options. For the price, I'd consider dropping a PCI FW card with the TI chip set into my machine. Unfortunately, I don't know if it'll work with the XP Media Center OS I have and I can't take it back if it doesn't work...

Hmm.

[seamonkey]

I'm not really saying the line 6 is high quality, I wouldn't plop down a few $k an hour to sit in a studio that had line-6 interfaces in it's racks. It's not bad for it's price point, but spending a few hundred more may not get you miraculously better performance.

Since you mentioned Pioneer
http://www.hometheaterfocus.com/rece...d-quality.aspx
"audiophiles not able to tell the difference between a $200 Pioneer receiver and a $12,000 separate mono-block tube amp array with separate power supplies."

What I strive for, is recording something that can sound good on a $200 receiver.

I personally like PCI for other features (directwire), not that it sounds that much better. YMMV

[lowfreqgeek]

That's pretty funny! Thanks for the link.

I very well may find that a PCI or FW interface isn't that much better than the UX2, or maybe not. People are generally happy with my tracks (and willing to pay for them), but I'd feel better knowing I was giving them the best I could afford to give them, even if it's not the best available.

Thanks for the perspective.

[slipkyes]

I suggest getting a Saffire LE if you want to go firewire, it's in your price range and has excellent instrument inputs and mic preamps, you really can't go wrong with it